Who Will Be the Next Coach?

[BrooksBurner]

2 minutes ago, siddious said:

Leach is already an assistant I doubt he would come here to do the same. 

But everyone wants to work in filthy NYC though!

[The Dude]

3 minutes ago, siddious said:

Leach is already an assistant I doubt he would come here to do the same. 

Meh. If he sees a possible foot in the door,, for a quick rise in position, with less pressure to win if Laviolette fails, it may be a better opportunity.  Or maybe he could he has a better chance at winning here as an assistant? 

 

The possibilities are not endless. There are many possibilities.  We can not predict the future. 

[Pete]

37 minutes ago, BrooksBurner said:

But everyone wants to work in filthy NYC though!

Crazy, right? Who would want culture and diversity and energy, when they can just have the Carolinas?

[BrooksBurner]

7 minutes ago, Pete said:

Crazy, right? Who would want culture and diversity and energy, when they can just have the Carolinas?

https://nypost.com/2022/07/14/nyc-ranks-as-one-of-worlds-dirtiest-cities-poll/

 

Quote

New York City was ranked the world’s second-dirtiest city due to rampant rats and foul-smelling piles of trash, according to a new poll.

Species diversity I guess. Enjoy the dirty rats

[Pete]

1 hour ago, BrooksBurner said:

https://nypost.com/2022/07/14/nyc-ranks-as-one-of-worlds-dirtiest-cities-poll/

 

Species diversity I guess. Enjoy the dirty rats

Enjoy the lillies!

 

Edited June 3, 2023 by Pete

[siddious]

1 hour ago, The Dude said:

Meh. If he sees a possible foot in the door,, for a quick rise in position, with less pressure to win if Laviolette fails, it may be a better opportunity.  Or maybe he could he has a better chance at winning here as an assistant? 

 

The possibilities are not endless. There are many possibilities.  We can not predict the future. 

I’m not sure Seattle would let him go to be an assistant elsewhere. Usually they give permission for a hC job.

[BrooksBurner]

https://www.tennessean.com/story/sports/nhl/predators/2023/05/30/barry-trotz-john-hynes-fired-nashville-predators-coach-andrew-brunette/70270553007/

 

 

Quote

“I'm sure it happens all the time,” said Trotz of interviewing head-coaching candidates with Hynes still employed. “I'm sure it happened here when I was here (as coach). You don't fire a coach and not have another one ready. It wouldn't be any different probably in your job.”

 

Unless you're Chris Drury.

[siddious]

7 minutes ago, BrooksBurner said:

https://www.tennessean.com/story/sports/nhl/predators/2023/05/30/barry-trotz-john-hynes-fired-nashville-predators-coach-andrew-brunette/70270553007/

 

 

 

Unless you're Chris Drury.

“Hockeys different here”

[Pete]

16 minutes ago, BrooksBurner said:

https://www.tennessean.com/story/sports/nhl/predators/2023/05/30/barry-trotz-john-hynes-fired-nashville-predators-coach-andrew-brunette/70270553007/

 

 

 

Unless you're Chris Drury.

And yet Columbus doesn't have a coach, or Calgary, and the Caps didn't have one until Tuesday...

 

Just an asinine comment from Trotz. Probably his paranoia from being a coach. What a collosal blunder. Who's going to be comfortable coaching there thinking that there's somebody coming to interview behind their back?

 

No wonder all the coaches are pissed off at the way he handled this. Total amateur hour on his part. 

[Bugg]

2 hours ago, BrooksBurner said:

https://nypost.com/2022/07/14/nyc-ranks-as-one-of-worlds-dirtiest-cities-poll/

 

Species diversity I guess. Enjoy the dirty rats

It ain't what it used to be. High taxes and homogenized national culture too. What set NY apart is now less so, and more expensive. 

[Scott]

15 hours ago, CCCP said:

Hynes looks like an alien. Bring him on. 

 

15 hours ago, Sharpshooter said:

That's the only good thing he has going for him.

Devils fans referred to him as Uncle Fester and for good reason. 

[BrooksBurner]

3 hours ago, Pete said:

And yet Columbus doesn't have a coach, or Calgary, and the Caps didn't have one until Tuesday...

 

Just an asinine comment from Trotz. Probably his paranoia from being a coach. What a collosal blunder. Who's going to be comfortable coaching there thinking that there's somebody coming to interview behind their back?

 

No wonder all the coaches are pissed off at the way he handled this. Total amateur hour on his part. 

 

Columbus and Calgary? Those are the model teams others should follow? The Flames let go of Treliving and kept Sutter hanging around for a couple weeks before canning him. A real winning organization. And the Caps? Pretty sure the guy you're ripping on was a good part of why they won the Cup. I think I'll go with Trotz on how to conduct a coaching search. If anyone knows the nature of being a coach, it's him, and he's right.

 

Re: the bold, uh, that's life. Especially in a high profile line of business like being a professional head coach. It comes with the territory when the team isn't performing. The coach is in the hot seat wondering if he'll have a job every day. If Hynes wasn't thinking he might be on the chopping block after 4 years of doing dick all with Nashville, 3-11 in the playoffs, 1st round exits, missed playoffs most recently, then he's missing some brain cells.

[Pete]

7 hours ago, BrooksBurner said:

 

Columbus and Calgary? Those are the model teams others should follow? The Flames let go of Treliving and kept Sutter hanging around for a couple weeks before canning him. A real winning organization. And the Caps? Pretty sure the guy you're ripping on was a good part of why they won the Cup. I think I'll go with Trotz on how to conduct a coaching search. If anyone knows the nature of being a coach, it's him, and he's right.

 

Re: the bold, uh, that's life. Especially in a high profile line of business like being a professional head coach. It comes with the territory when the team isn't performing. The coach is in the hot seat wondering if he'll have a job every day. If Hynes wasn't thinking he might be on the chopping block after 4 years of doing dick all with Nashville, 3-11 in the playoffs, 1st round exits, missed playoffs most recently, then he's missing some brain cells.

There's nothing in the front half of your post worth responding to, there have been plenty of times coaches have been relieved of their duties during the offseason and then you go searching for a coach. It's just flat out false that you only fire a coach when you have a backup ready. The caps fired Laviolette and then had to ask permission to talk to Carberry. What if Toronto said no?

 

Trotz was a great coach, and doesn't make him a great GM. It also doesn't mean that he's not an asshole. It also doesn't mean that he can't make an asinine statement like the one he just made. 

 

The point is that they could have let Hynes go after exit interviews. If a coach makes it this far into the offseason, he should feel pretty safe.

 

Marek and Friedman covered this on 32 thoughts, and Trotz being pretty universally panned for this move.

 

I'll trust their take on this issue over yours. 

Edited June 3, 2023 by Pete

[Scott]

6 hours ago, BrooksBurner said:

https://nypost.com/2022/07/14/nyc-ranks-as-one-of-worlds-dirtiest-cities-poll/

 

Species diversity I guess. Enjoy the dirty rats

Sad but true, having worked in the financial district for most of my career while having a house on Lake Norman in NC, gimmie NC all day every day.  Don't  like almost everything about NYC. It's certainly not for everyone. That said not all parts of NC are created equal, same with the state of NY. There's something to be said about fresh air.

[Br4d]

The GG firing is really starting to feel like an impulse firing at this point.

 

GG was in trouble in November but the Rangers righted the ship and were one of the best teams in the second half.  Then the Devils series started as a continuation of that but petered out as everybody but Igor had a bad series from game 3 onwards.

 

I think the Tarasenko deal was a good move but the impact of the Kane deal was not.  The Rangers had just recovered from integrating Tarasenko when the Kane deal was made.  They stuttered a bit after that deal and GG was swapping lines around like a madman trying to get the chemistry back where it was before the two deals and not quite getting there.

 

When you're a player's coach finding the right lines is an absolute necessity because you have to keep the players happy or their play starts to taper off.  The Tarasenko deal didn't really mess with the chemistry a lot although GG was tinkering hard after the Trocheck-Panarin mismatch reared it's head again.  The Kane deal essentially pushed both Trocheck and Kreider down to the third line and they had some synergy but it was getting harder to find a good line for Panarin without disrupting something else the Rangers had established.

 

Panarin had a bunch of goals after the deals but they were mainly on the powerplay as he shot a lot more often there than he had been doing beforehand.  He was particularly leery of cycling when he got a pass from Kane or Tarasenko and they were feeding him.

 

I think the situation was very unsettled going into the Devils series and other than the powerplay the Rangers were still figuring things out.  Then they got a bunch of whistles in their favor early on in the Devils series and the one part of the teams that was really clicking gave them the big lead.

 

By game 4 it was obvious that the Rangers were being outplayed at even strength and they weren't getting the calls they had earlier in the series.  I think Drury and GG went at each other after game 4 based on the fact that the Rangers just weren't performing at even strength and GG had no more time to flip the lines to try to find the magic combos.  Obviously none of us were a fly on the wall in that heated conversation but it's easy to see Drury being upset because the big trades he made weren't panning out and GG being upset because to him lines were everything and he just hadn't had enough time to get things settled. 

 

The Devils were a rough matchup because they had younger better legs under them and the Rangers vets were clearly rattled by that point.  The cycling that had been at least efficient in the regular season was producing giveaways, particularly early in the sequence after zone entry and the Rangers were giving up goals they hadn't in the regular season.

 

By the end of the series it was obvious that the chemistry just wasn't there and Adam Fox had a very low energy game 7, almost as if he had surrendered by that point.

 

GG had called the players out publicly after game 4 but that's a well you can only draw from once and probably he should have just said nothing then.

 

I think by the end of the series the obvious question GG had to answer was: "what will be different next year?"  There are some answers to this question that might have sufficed, mainly centered around the younger players that took a step forward this year.  The reality was that the Rangers were likely to have to be buyers again at the deadline given the cap situation.  You can only import a few years in a row before the situation collapses in on you and the Rangers were kind of at a make or break point at the deadline this season and the result was very disappointing.

 

I think GG felt that the 2 years had given him some safety and Drury probably felt threatened by the fact that the Rangers hadn't gotten closer to the goal this season.  I think the blowup after game 4 probably was still reverberating in both guys heads as the end of season interview approached.  I think it likely repeated in that interview albeit maybe at a more muted level.

 

I think Drury decided to move on without a plan in place to replace GG.  I think GG decided to move on without a clear next destination in mind.  I don't think either side had given much thought to what came next.

 

Why do I think Drury had no plan?  We're watching that scenario evolve in front of us.

 

Why do I think GG thought he was safe?  Because he said so and that's not the kind of statement you make if you think you are getting fired.

 

The Rangers have a lot of questions to answer at this point and most of them are in the locker room.  It's going to take a very good coach to come in here and get more out of these guys than GG did.

 

I know I harp on Panarin a lot but really he is the key guy.  He had a worse season last year than show up in the production numbers.  He had a lot of giveaways and that lead directly to his lower than usual +/-.  That trend continued in the series against the Devils.  He has become a much less well-rounded player than he was a few seasons ago.  This has coincided with some nasty contact on the ice and with him exiting his prime.  It's doubtful, although not impossible, that the next guy can recover the player that Panarin was rounding into at 28 into 2019 before Tom Wilson scrambled his eggs.  If that guy is not recoverable then Panarin is just going to be a gaudy extra as he ages into that soon to be completely immovable deal.

[Pete]

I'm

1 hour ago, Br4d said:

The GG firing is really starting to feel like an impulse firing at this point.

 

GG was in trouble in November but the Rangers righted the ship and were one of the best teams in the second half.  Then the Devils series started as a continuation of that but petered out as everybody but Igor had a bad series from game 3 onwards.

 

I think the Tarasenko deal was a good move but the impact of the Kane deal was not.  The Rangers had just recovered from integrating Tarasenko when the Kane deal was made.  They stuttered a bit after that deal and GG was swapping lines around like a madman trying to get the chemistry back where it was before the two deals and not quite getting there.

 

When you're a player's coach finding the right lines is an absolute necessity because you have to keep the players happy or their play starts to taper off.  The Tarasenko deal didn't really mess with the chemistry a lot although GG was tinkering hard after the Trocheck-Panarin mismatch reared it's head again.  The Kane deal essentially pushed both Trocheck and Kreider down to the third line and they had some synergy but it was getting harder to find a good line for Panarin without disrupting something else the Rangers had established.

 

Panarin had a bunch of goals after the deals but they were mainly on the powerplay as he shot a lot more often there than he had been doing beforehand.  He was particularly leery of cycling when he got a pass from Kane or Tarasenko and they were feeding him.

 

I think the situation was very unsettled going into the Devils series and other than the powerplay the Rangers were still figuring things out.  Then they got a bunch of whistles in their favor early on in the Devils series and the one part of the teams that was really clicking gave them the big lead.

 

By game 4 it was obvious that the Rangers were being outplayed at even strength and they weren't getting the calls they had earlier in the series.  I think Drury and GG went at each other after game 4 based on the fact that the Rangers just weren't performing at even strength and GG had no more time to flip the lines to try to find the magic combos.  Obviously none of us were a fly on the wall in that heated conversation but it's easy to see Drury being upset because the big trades he made weren't panning out and GG being upset because to him lines were everything and he just hadn't had enough time to get things settled. 

 

The Devils were a rough matchup because they had younger better legs under them and the Rangers vets were clearly rattled by that point.  The cycling that had been at least efficient in the regular season was producing giveaways, particularly early in the sequence after zone entry and the Rangers were giving up goals they hadn't in the regular season.

 

By the end of the series it was obvious that the chemistry just wasn't there and Adam Fox had a very low energy game 7, almost as if he had surrendered by that point.

 

GG had called the players out publicly after game 4 but that's a well you can only draw from once and probably he should have just said nothing then.

 

I think by the end of the series the obvious question GG had to answer was: "what will be different next year?"  There are some answers to this question that might have sufficed, mainly centered around the younger players that took a step forward this year.  The reality was that the Rangers were likely to have to be buyers again at the deadline given the cap situation.  You can only import a few years in a row before the situation collapses in on you and the Rangers were kind of at a make or break point at the deadline this season and the result was very disappointing.

 

I think GG felt that the 2 years had given him some safety and Drury probably felt threatened by the fact that the Rangers hadn't gotten closer to the goal this season.  I think the blowup after game 4 probably was still reverberating in both guys heads as the end of season interview approached.  I think it likely repeated in that interview albeit maybe at a more muted level.

 

I think Drury decided to move on without a plan in place to replace GG.  I think GG decided to move on without a clear next destination in mind.  I don't think either side had given much thought to what came next.

 

Why do I think Drury had no plan?  We're watching that scenario evolve in front of us.

 

Why do I think GG thought he was safe?  Because he said so and that's not the kind of statement you make if you think you are getting fired.

 

The Rangers have a lot of questions to answer at this point and most of them are in the locker room.  It's going to take a very good coach to come in here and get more out of these guys than GG did.

 

I know I harp on Panarin a lot but really he is the key guy.  He had a worse season last year than show up in the production numbers.  He had a lot of giveaways and that lead directly to his lower than usual +/-.  That trend continued in the series against the Devils.  He has become a much less well-rounded player than he was a few seasons ago.  This has coincided with some nasty contact on the ice and with him exiting his prime.  It's doubtful, although not impossible, that the next guy can recover the player that Panarin was rounding into at 28 into 2019 before Tom Wilson scrambled his eggs.  If that guy is not recoverable then Panarin is just going to be a gaudy extra as he ages into that soon to be completely immovable deal.

I don't know where you got this stuff, but your timelines are completely skewed. Tro Kreider Vesey was the third line before the deadline, the acquisitions did not push Tro and Kreider to the third line. 

 

If lines are everything to GG, why does he change him so frequently?

 

They agreed to part ways after exit interviews based on player feedback that they needed more than he was able to give. 

 

This is all information that we know. You're making up a narrative at looking for facts to support it but it's just not there. I don't know why you would go into trying to get into what was going on in their heads when we pretty much know what happened. There's no mystery here. It's just that you would rather blame specific players than acknowledge what the real issue was, and I'm not really sure why.

Edited June 4, 2023 by Pete

[Bugg]

1 hour ago, Br4d said:

The GG firing is really starting to feel like an impulse firing at this point.

 

GG was in trouble in November but the Rangers righted the ship and were one of the best teams in the second half.  Then the Devils series started as a continuation of that but petered out as everybody but Igor had a bad series from game 3 onwards.

 

I think the Tarasenko deal was a good move but the impact of the Kane deal was not.  The Rangers had just recovered from integrating Tarasenko when the Kane deal was made.  They stuttered a bit after that deal and GG was swapping lines around like a madman trying to get the chemistry back where it was before the two deals and not quite getting there.

 

When you're a player's coach finding the right lines is an absolute necessity because you have to keep the players happy or their play starts to taper off.  The Tarasenko deal didn't really mess with the chemistry a lot although GG was tinkering hard after the Trocheck-Panarin mismatch reared it's head again.  The Kane deal essentially pushed both Trocheck and Kreider down to the third line and they had some synergy but it was getting harder to find a good line for Panarin without disrupting something else the Rangers had established.

 

Panarin had a bunch of goals after the deals but they were mainly on the powerplay as he shot a lot more often there than he had been doing beforehand.  He was particularly leery of cycling when he got a pass from Kane or Tarasenko and they were feeding him.

 

I think the situation was very unsettled going into the Devils series and other than the powerplay the Rangers were still figuring things out.  Then they got a bunch of whistles in their favor early on in the Devils series and the one part of the teams that was really clicking gave them the big lead.

 

By game 4 it was obvious that the Rangers were being outplayed at even strength and they weren't getting the calls they had earlier in the series.  I think Drury and GG went at each other after game 4 based on the fact that the Rangers just weren't performing at even strength and GG had no more time to flip the lines to try to find the magic combos.  Obviously none of us were a fly on the wall in that heated conversation but it's easy to see Drury being upset because the big trades he made weren't panning out and GG being upset because to him lines were everything and he just hadn't had enough time to get things settled. 

 

The Devils were a rough matchup because they had younger better legs under them and the Rangers vets were clearly rattled by that point.  The cycling that had been at least efficient in the regular season was producing giveaways, particularly early in the sequence after zone entry and the Rangers were giving up goals they hadn't in the regular season.

 

By the end of the series it was obvious that the chemistry just wasn't there and Adam Fox had a very low energy game 7, almost as if he had surrendered by that point.

 

GG had called the players out publicly after game 4 but that's a well you can only draw from once and probably he should have just said nothing then.

 

I think by the end of the series the obvious question GG had to answer was: "what will be different next year?"  There are some answers to this question that might have sufficed, mainly centered around the younger players that took a step forward this year.  The reality was that the Rangers were likely to have to be buyers again at the deadline given the cap situation.  You can only import a few years in a row before the situation collapses in on you and the Rangers were kind of at a make or break point at the deadline this season and the result was very disappointing.

 

I think GG felt that the 2 years had given him some safety and Drury probably felt threatened by the fact that the Rangers hadn't gotten closer to the goal this season.  I think the blowup after game 4 probably was still reverberating in both guys heads as the end of season interview approached.  I think it likely repeated in that interview albeit maybe at a more muted level.

 

I think Drury decided to move on without a plan in place to replace GG.  I think GG decided to move on without a clear next destination in mind.  I don't think either side had given much thought to what came next.

 

Why do I think Drury had no plan?  We're watching that scenario evolve in front of us.

 

Why do I think GG thought he was safe?  Because he said so and that's not the kind of statement you make if you think you are getting fired.

 

The Rangers have a lot of questions to answer at this point and most of them are in the locker room.  It's going to take a very good coach to come in here and get more out of these guys than GG did.

 

I know I harp on Panarin a lot but really he is the key guy.  He had a worse season last year than show up in the production numbers.  He had a lot of giveaways and that lead directly to his lower than usual +/-.  That trend continued in the series against the Devils.  He has become a much less well-rounded player than he was a few seasons ago.  This has coincided with some nasty contact on the ice and with him exiting his prime.  It's doubtful, although not impossible, that the next guy can recover the player that Panarin was rounding into at 28 into 2019 before Tom Wilson scrambled his eggs.  If that guy is not recoverable then Panarin is just going to be a gaudy extra as he ages into that soon to be completely immovable deal.

If players had stopped listening to Gallant, what would be the point of bringing him back? That's how pro sports works. Gallant himself knows as much. 

 

Sure Drury or any GM always has in the back of his mind who he might think would be a good a coach for his team. Not sure though any GM has a plan beyond that, nor would you expect them to. And there are  few other considerations; Memorial Cup (RE Roy) still under way, Quenneville mess, the NHL discouraging (though not preventing) teams form making announcements during the Finals;CBJ have in fact hired Babcock . But because his contract with TML runs right until June 30th, won't be announced yet. 

[Br4d]

38 minutes ago, Pete said:

There's no mystery here. It's just that you would rather blame specific players than acknowledge what the real issue was, and I'm not really sure why.

 

I post what I post because I don't think the change from GG is going to matter one whit without significant changes elsewhere also.

 

The Rangers are always going to be at least a bubble team based on the roster and the goalie but I don't see them taking the next step without the primary stars on the team adjusting their playstyles to be more effective at even strength.

 

I think Panarin is just the most obvious guy that needs to do more at even strength.  The only established non-goalie on the roster who is just as good at even strength as he is on the powerplay is Adam Fox.  By that I mean Fox is a plus player at even strength and a force on the powerplay.  All of the other guys gobbling cap space are so-so at even strength and a force on the powerplay.

 

Zibanejad makes up for his meh offensive production by working very hard on defense.  Kreider kills penalties, although he is mostly there for his breakaway ability and chemistry with Zibanejad.

 

What exactly does Panarin do at even strength that justifies his cap slot?

[Pete]

25 minutes ago, Br4d said:

 

I post what I post because I don't think the change from GG is going to matter one whit without significant changes elsewhere also.

 

The Rangers are always going to be at least a bubble team based on the roster and the goalie but I don't see them taking the next step without the primary stars on the team adjusting their playstyles to be more effective at even strength.

 

I think Panarin is just the most obvious guy that needs to do more at even strength.  The only established non-goalie on the roster who is just as good at even strength as he is on the powerplay is Adam Fox.  By that I mean Fox is a plus player at even strength and a force on the powerplay.  All of the other guys gobbling cap space are so-so at even strength and a force on the powerplay.

 

Zibanejad makes up for his meh offensive production by working very hard on defense.  Kreider kills penalties, although he is mostly there for his breakaway ability and chemistry with Zibanejad.

 

What exactly does Panarin do at even strength that justifies his cap slot?

Your assessment of those players is so off it's not worth starting as a baseline. Zib has meh offensive skills? How can that be taken seriously.

 

I also don't know why you don't think better defense, zone exits, and entries will lead to better 5v5 play. That's what their weakness was, and that's coaching. 

[Br4d]

Just now, Pete said:

Your assessment of those players is so off it's not worth starting as a baseline. Zib has meh offensive skills? How can that be taken seriously.

 

I also don't know why you don't think better defense, zone exits, and entries will lead to better 5v5 play. That's what their weakness was, and that's coaching. 

 

You're assuming that the vets are going to be able to readjust to whatever the next scheme is smoothly.

 

I think that's a major assumption at this point.

 

I don't know that Artemi Panarin is going to put his body on the line in the new system any more than he did in the more free-for-all style under GG.  If anything I think the FFA style probably helped him maintain production because he was able to get out of the way of contact whenever he wanted too.

 

Again, I probably focus too much on him because of the cap number, the same way you focus too much on Laffy because of the draft position.

[Pete]

20 minutes ago, Br4d said:

 

You're assuming that the vets are going to be able to readjust to whatever the next scheme is smoothly.

 

I think that's a major assumption at this point.

 

I don't know that Artemi Panarin is going to put his body on the line in the new system any more than he did in the more free-for-all style under GG.  If anything I think the FFA style probably helped him maintain production because he was able to get out of the way of contact whenever he wanted too.

 

Again, I probably focus too much on him because of the cap number, the same way you focus too much on Laffy because of the draft position.

That's fair, and maybe I am making assumptions, but you're also making leaps in logic like Panarin "having to put his body on the line". Why would he? There are ways to get to the inside without being bull or guys like Gaudreau and Keller wouldn't be able to play. 

 

I also don't think it's a huge assumption that they'll adapt to a new coach's system. They've been coached their whole lives and when they weren't being coached they asked Drury for help in exit interviews.

 

There's absolutely no evidence to suggest your default position that Gallant was coaching and the players refused to listen. That's diametrically opposed to what we heard coming out of exit interviews as far as what the plans were telling Drury. 

[BrooksBurner]

Re: "Gallant just juggles lines"

 

The kid line combination was 7th in 5v5 TOI amongst all combinations in the league: https://evolving-hockey.com/stats/combos/?_inputs_&std_c3_range="Seasons"&std_c3_players=null&std_c3_adj="No Adjustment"&dir_combo="F Lines"&std_c3_str="5v5"&std_c3_toi="30"&std_c3_type="Rates"&std_c3_span="Regular"&std_c3_team="All"&std_c3_season="20222023"

 

It's not hard to see why he stuck with it either because their underlying numbers were fantastic (52x GF%, 53 CF%) as were actual results relative to what they were giving up (60 GF%, very strongly on the plus side). He also stuck with Kreider/Zibanejad because it works, so he is more than willing to stick with combinations that work.

[Blueshirts1926]

10 hours ago, Br4d said:

The GG firing is really starting to feel like an impulse firing at this point.

 

GG was in trouble in November but the Rangers righted the ship and were one of the best teams in the second half.  Then the Devils series started as a continuation of that but petered out as everybody but Igor had a bad series from game 3 onwards.

 

I think the Tarasenko deal was a good move but the impact of the Kane deal was not.  The Rangers had just recovered from integrating Tarasenko when the Kane deal was made.  They stuttered a bit after that deal and GG was swapping lines around like a madman trying to get the chemistry back where it was before the two deals and not quite getting there.

 

When you're a player's coach finding the right lines is an absolute necessity because you have to keep the players happy or their play starts to taper off.  The Tarasenko deal didn't really mess with the chemistry a lot although GG was tinkering hard after the Trocheck-Panarin mismatch reared it's head again.  The Kane deal essentially pushed both Trocheck and Kreider down to the third line and they had some synergy but it was getting harder to find a good line for Panarin without disrupting something else the Rangers had established.

 

Panarin had a bunch of goals after the deals but they were mainly on the powerplay as he shot a lot more often there than he had been doing beforehand.  He was particularly leery of cycling when he got a pass from Kane or Tarasenko and they were feeding him.

 

I think the situation was very unsettled going into the Devils series and other than the powerplay the Rangers were still figuring things out.  Then they got a bunch of whistles in their favor early on in the Devils series and the one part of the teams that was really clicking gave them the big lead.

 

By game 4 it was obvious that the Rangers were being outplayed at even strength and they weren't getting the calls they had earlier in the series.  I think Drury and GG went at each other after game 4 based on the fact that the Rangers just weren't performing at even strength and GG had no more time to flip the lines to try to find the magic combos.  Obviously none of us were a fly on the wall in that heated conversation but it's easy to see Drury being upset because the big trades he made weren't panning out and GG being upset because to him lines were everything and he just hadn't had enough time to get things settled. 

 

The Devils were a rough matchup because they had younger better legs under them and the Rangers vets were clearly rattled by that point.  The cycling that had been at least efficient in the regular season was producing giveaways, particularly early in the sequence after zone entry and the Rangers were giving up goals they hadn't in the regular season.

 

By the end of the series it was obvious that the chemistry just wasn't there and Adam Fox had a very low energy game 7, almost as if he had surrendered by that point.

 

GG had called the players out publicly after game 4 but that's a well you can only draw from once and probably he should have just said nothing then.

 

I think by the end of the series the obvious question GG had to answer was: "what will be different next year?"  There are some answers to this question that might have sufficed, mainly centered around the younger players that took a step forward this year.  The reality was that the Rangers were likely to have to be buyers again at the deadline given the cap situation.  You can only import a few years in a row before the situation collapses in on you and the Rangers were kind of at a make or break point at the deadline this season and the result was very disappointing.

 

I think GG felt that the 2 years had given him some safety and Drury probably felt threatened by the fact that the Rangers hadn't gotten closer to the goal this season.  I think the blowup after game 4 probably was still reverberating in both guys heads as the end of season interview approached.  I think it likely repeated in that interview albeit maybe at a more muted level.

 

I think Drury decided to move on without a plan in place to replace GG.  I think GG decided to move on without a clear next destination in mind.  I don't think either side had given much thought to what came next.

 

Why do I think Drury had no plan?  We're watching that scenario evolve in front of us.

 

Why do I think GG thought he was safe?  Because he said so and that's not the kind of statement you make if you think you are getting fired.

 

The Rangers have a lot of questions to answer at this point and most of them are in the locker room.  It's going to take a very good coach to come in here and get more out of these guys than GG did.

 

I know I harp on Panarin a lot but really he is the key guy.  He had a worse season last year than show up in the production numbers.  He had a lot of giveaways and that lead directly to his lower than usual +/-.  That trend continued in the series against the Devils.  He has become a much less well-rounded player than he was a few seasons ago.  This has coincided with some nasty contact on the ice and with him exiting his prime.  It's doubtful, although not impossible, that the next guy can recover the player that Panarin was rounding into at 28 into 2019 before Tom Wilson scrambled his eggs.  If that guy is not recoverable then Panarin is just going to be a gaudy extra as he ages into that soon to be completely immovable deal.

Completely disagree because after the first 2 games the Rangers outscored them 10-2, what happened to that team for those 2 games and line combinations as it seemed to work pretty good. Plus Ruff would have made adjustments between games 1 and 2 and they still prevailed. After the game 3 loss I think the team just quit except for Igor and Lindgren so CG had to go. Look at his previous coaching track record coming into year 3. Panaran needs to go as his game is one sided and at playoff he is easy to control/figure out which deems him useless and his failure to adjust.

[The Dude]

7 hours ago, Pete said:

 That's diametrically opposed to what we heard coming out of exit interviews as far as what the plans were telling Drury. 

I'm seriously not being a dick here.

 

But... is this fact? I haven't seen anything saying that the players exit interviews are what fueled the 2 to "part ways"  Is there a quote from Drury or Gallant that backs this? 

 

It's very possible. It may be what happened. But it is speculation. 

 

For all we know, it could have been an analytics argument, that just couldn't be solved. 

 

If you could provide a link to quotes to back this, I'd appreciate it. I'm honestly just asking. 

 

 

[The Dude]

6 hours ago, BrooksBurner said:

Re: "Gallant just juggles lines"

 

The kid line combination was 7th in 5v5 TOI amongst all combinations in the league: https://evolving-hockey.com/stats/combos/?_inputs_&std_c3_range="Seasons"&std_c3_players=null&std_c3_adj="No Adjustment"&dir_combo="F Lines"&std_c3_str="5v5"&std_c3_toi="30"&std_c3_type="Rates"&std_c3_span="Regular"&std_c3_team="All"&std_c3_season="20222023"

 

It's not hard to see why he stuck with it either because their underlying numbers were fantastic (52x GF%, 53 CF%) as were actual results relative to what they were giving up (60 GF%, very strongly on the plus side). He also stuck with Kreider/Zibanejad because it works, so he is more than willing to stick with combinations that work.

Didn't the numbers suggest Trocheck-Panarin worked?