The Dude Posted May 31, 2023 Share Posted May 31, 2023 2 hours ago, Long live the King said: That's the point. Laviolette has never been in the same situation as Hynes. Carolina had a magical cup run. Then he failed to make the playoffs in each of the next 2 years. He was fired after a 12-11-2 start in the 3rd year after the cup. Paul Maurice took over and took them to the conference finals. He went to Philly, a team that Stevens had already taken to the Conference final. He took over for Stevens mid-season. They went to the finals that year and proceeded to get progressively worse until he got fired. Seems like a track record of taking good teams and running them into the ground. The only place he took a non-playoff team and built them up into a contender is Nashville, where they got to the finals once and then declined. Washington was back to taking a team that finished first in the Metro for 5 straight years and coaching them into a missed playoff. This is why you need context about the teams, and what the coach is actually doing. We just fired Gallant with a 31-29 playoff record. Prior to this year, Maurice was 41-51 in the playoffs, guess its a good thing Florida didn't care he was 10 games under .500 in the playoffs. You should heed your own advice about context. He made that magical cup run with a 20 win team that he turned into a 52 win team that won the cup. In the ensuing seasons where he missed the playoffs, his teams finished with 88 and 92 points. That division was pretty strong at the time (ha, in 06/07 Atlanta lead the division with 97 points, Tampa had 93. Heck the league was strong with 15 teams going over 100 points). The following season they finished 9th in the conference in a very tight race finishing with 92 points as the 4- 8 seeds finished with 97, 95 and Ottawa & Boston both with 94. He went to Philly and coached 57 games. Squeeked them into the playoffs, came back from 3-0 against Boston and went to the finals. The following season Philly finished 1st in the division and 2nd in the conference with 106 points. Tied for 3rd in the league for points. They got better. Not worse. The following year they finished 5th in the east.l with 103 points which was 3rd best in the entire league. That's bad? I understand they didn't do well in the playoffs. But they were one of the top teams. He built up Nashville. A very young team. Again. A shot load of points in the standings each year and a Stanley Cup appearance. Your context needs a bit more depth itself. His teams were mostly tops in the entire league. You make it sound like he ruins teams when he gets there. It's just false. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abe Froman Posted May 31, 2023 Share Posted May 31, 2023 I have full confidence in the Rangers picking the wrong guy. 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Long live the King Posted May 31, 2023 Share Posted May 31, 2023 10 minutes ago, The Dude said: You should heed your own advice about context. He made that magical cup run with a 20 win team that he turned into a 52 win team that won the cup. In the ensuing seasons where he missed the playoffs, his teams finished with 88 and 92 points. That division was pretty strong at the time (ha, in 06/07 Atlanta lead the division with 97 points, Tampa had 93. Heck the league was strong with 15 teams going over 100 points). The following season they finished 9th in the conference in a very tight race finishing with 92 points as the 4- 8 seeds finished with 97, 95 and Ottawa & Boston both with 94. He went to Philly and coached 57 games. Squeeked them into the playoffs, came back from 3-0 against Boston and went to the finals. The following season Philly finished 1st in the division and 2nd in the conference with 106 points. Tied for 3rd in the league for points. They got better. Not worse. The following year they finished 5th in the east.l with 103 points which was 3rd best in the entire league. That's bad? I understand they didn't do well in the playoffs. But they were one of the top teams. He built up Nashville. A very young team. Again. A shot load of points in the standings each year and a Stanley Cup appearance. Your context needs a bit more depth itself. His teams were mostly tops in the entire league. You make it sound like he ruins teams when he gets there. It's just false. Lots of excuse making for Carolina there. Yea they missed the playoffs but they were close! One of only 3 teams to miss the playoffs after winning the cup...but everyone else was good! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siddious Posted May 31, 2023 Share Posted May 31, 2023 made me lol 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Posted May 31, 2023 Share Posted May 31, 2023 2 hours ago, Phil said: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted May 31, 2023 Share Posted May 31, 2023 4 minutes ago, siddious said: made me lol That's ok, you gotta give these guys at least until their 25+ before they round into shape and show signs of actually being something at this level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Posted May 31, 2023 Share Posted May 31, 2023 11 minutes ago, Long live the King said: Lots of excuse making for Carolina there. Yea they missed the playoffs but they were close! One of only 3 teams to miss the playoffs after winning the cup...but everyone else was good! Yeah true. Team was getting older? BrindAmour as a late 30 year old and other dinosaurs were still there? Maybe that was part of it. But yeah, they didn't make the playoffs. Bad excuse. The rest of what I said definitely put a hole in your "his teams got worse when he got there" boat. Odd you skipped over that. Ah well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Posted May 31, 2023 Share Posted May 31, 2023 6 minutes ago, jsrangers said: That's ok, you gotta give these guys at least until their 25+ before they round into shape and show signs of actually being something at this level. 26 or 27 and you'll have a much better idea. Atleast they will be cheap while they figure it out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Long live the King Posted May 31, 2023 Share Posted May 31, 2023 23 minutes ago, The Dude said: Yeah true. Team was getting older? BrindAmour as a late 30 year old and other dinosaurs were still there? Maybe that was part of it. But yeah, they didn't make the playoffs. Bad excuse. The rest of what I said definitely put a hole in your "his teams got worse when he got there" boat. Odd you skipped over that. Ah well. The rest of what you said. When Philly was 5th in the east but somehow 3rd in the league? 1st in the division to 3rd to out of the playoffs, with this roster https://www.hockey-reference.com/teams/PHI/2013.html isn't great. I acknowledged he was successful in Nashville. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Long live the King Posted May 31, 2023 Share Posted May 31, 2023 34 minutes ago, The Dude said: Yeah true. Team was getting older? BrindAmour as a late 30 year old and other dinosaurs were still there? Maybe that was part of it. But yeah, they didn't make the playoffs. Bad excuse. The rest of what I said definitely put a hole in your "his teams got worse when he got there" boat. Odd you skipped over that. Ah well. Dinosaurs? BrindAmour and Whitney were ppg players on those miss the playoff teams. How old was Staal? Justin Williams? Andrew Ladd? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 51 minutes ago, The Dude said: 26 or 27 and you'll have a much better idea. Atleast they will be cheap while they figure it out. y a y Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 58 minutes ago, Long live the King said: The rest of what you said. When Philly was 5th in the east but somehow 3rd in the league? 1st in the division to 3rd to out of the playoffs, with this roster https://www.hockey-reference.com/teams/PHI/2013.html isn't great. I acknowledged he was successful in Nashville. Lmao. Yeah I was in a rush. Really fucked that up. I honestly don't remember how the standings worked back then, but Philly was ranked 5th in the east despite having more points than the 2 and 3 seeds So, in actuality they had the 3rd most points in the east,and 4th or 5th most in the league (103) as the Rangers and Blues were tied with 109 for 2nd most. Nucks 111 Rangers/Blues 109 Pitt 108 Preds 104 Flyers 103 Bruins/Wings/Devs 102 Sorry for the confusion, this is my correction. Point still stands. They got better. Regular seasons do count. Especially when you try to say the team got worse. Can't go to the finals every year. But 3 out of 5 stops with different teams ain't so bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 1 hour ago, Long live the King said: Dinosaurs? BrindAmour and Whitney were ppg players on those miss the playoff teams. How old was Staal? Justin Williams? Andrew Ladd? BrindAmour was 38 and scored 54 points in Laviolettes last year. Whitney was 36 . Scott Walker 35. Year before they had 39 year old Glenn Wesley, 37 year old Hedican washed up Kaberle. Come off it. The last year, they had to transition out of the older players carrying the load. Any team relying on a 38 year old isn't going to do very well (despite the 97 points.). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jdog99 Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 2 hours ago, siddious said: made me lol Maybe he knocks laf down to the ahl...thatll make for some heated threads... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Long live the King Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 9 minutes ago, The Dude said: BrindAmour was 38 and scored 54 points in Laviolettes last year. Whitney was 36 . Scott Walker 35. Year before they had 39 year old Glenn Wesley, 37 year old Hedican washed up Kaberle. Come off it. The last year, they had to transition out of the older players carrying the load. Any team relying on a 38 year old isn't going to do very well (despite the 97 points.). By Laviolettes's last year you're referring to when he was fired and Maurice came in and took the to the conference finals...even though they were too old? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 43 minutes ago, Long live the King said: By Laviolettes's last year you're referring to when he was fired and Maurice came in and took the to the conference finals...even though they were too old? Both the year he was fired and the year prior, BrindAmour had 51 points. Not PPG like you said. So, Maurice came in after 25 games and took over a team that had been amongst the tops in points the 3 years prior and went on a tear. I'm tired and don't want to look it up, but were there any trades? They went 7 games in each round then got swept in the finals.... then flopped harder the following season and then some, as the years went by. If the team didn't nosedive the next year and so on, you'd have a leg to stand on. But I'd rather go with the team probably played the same way it did in the 3 years prior and did what their old coach instilled inthem and it clicked. I only say that because of the nosedive after that year. You'd think a coaching change that lead to a surge like that would show dividends the following year. You know, like Laviolettes 1st and 2nd years with Philly. But you don't care about that run. Odd how that works for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blueshirts1926 Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 Hynes is a moron and will waist the prime of Fox and Igor. Drury needs to look past the friendship vs looking for a coach Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichieNextel305 Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 I am not a time traveler so I have no way of knowing this. But man, I really hope we don’t go the route of Hynes. It just doesn’t seem like the right hire or the right fit. If I’m wrong, I’d be happy to eat crow. But I just don’t think he’s the answer here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Long live the King Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 2 hours ago, The Dude said: Both the year he was fired and the year prior, BrindAmour had 51 points. Not PPG like you said. So, Maurice came in after 25 games and took over a team that had been amongst the tops in points the 3 years prior and went on a tear. I'm tired and don't want to look it up, but were there any trades? They went 7 games in each round then got swept in the finals.... then flopped harder the following season and then some, as the years went by. If the team didn't nosedive the next year and so on, you'd have a leg to stand on. But I'd rather go with the team probably played the same way it did in the 3 years prior and did what their old coach instilled inthem and it clicked. I only say that because of the nosedive after that year. You'd think a coaching change that lead to a surge like that would show dividends the following year. You know, like Laviolettes 1st and 2nd years with Philly. But you don't care about that run. Odd how that works for you. Yes the year before Laviolette was fired BrindAmour had 51 points...in 59 games. Sorry for calling him a ppg player. The team flopped with Maurice? Your whole argument has been they were still good with Laviolette, but the players were dinosaurs and then they flopped with Maurice. Laviolette: 88 points Laviolette: 93 points Laviolette fired Maurice hired: Conference Finals Maurice: 80 points (your dinosaurs BrindAmour, Whitney, and Walker were all still there) Maurice: 91 points Not seeing the floppy nosedive and Maurice's team was even older than Laviolette's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slobberknocker Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 It just feels to me they’re waiting to see if Sullivan shakes out 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugg Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 (edited) 9 hours ago, RichieNextel305 said: I am not a time traveler so I have no way of knowing this. But man, I really hope we don’t go the route of Hynes. It just doesn’t seem like the right hire or the right fit. If I’m wrong, I’d be happy to eat crow. But I just don’t think he’s the answer here. Hynes is the colorless odorless flavorless gas of retreads. There's little in his CV to recommend him other than he played at BU with the GM. And development; played Jack Hughes on his 4th line. At that point would prefer Messier or Patrick Roy screaming from time to time while displaying Stanley Cup rings obnoxiously with Knoblauch getting promoted to "associate coach". Because there is a close to a 100% chance Hynes will run into the same perimeter cowardly lion shit from DJ MIA, Arturnovi and crew that doomed Quinn and then Gallant. This squad need paddles applied. Or this franchise gonna waste the career of another HoF goalie. Edited June 1, 2023 by Bugg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichieNextel305 Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 The last person I want is Messier. I’m sorry, but no experience whatsoever is not what this team needs. Hiring someone just because of his standing with the fanbase would likely be career suicide for Drury. There just isn’t a whole lot out there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangersIn7 Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 I’m not in either camp- be it Laviolette or Haynes. But im not opposed to either of them as well. Both are kinda guys I’d never be too much more than lukewarm about. Personally, I’d prefer they move on a guy like Knoblauch or Leach, but I understand any reluctance to do so, given the nature of the team. I don’t know that he’d be the right guy, but Hynes is very structured, always struck me as being a pretty smart guy, and brings a lot of things the Rangers seem to need. While he’s never really had too much success as an NHL HC, he’s never had a team this talented either. He might not be a bad choice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichieNextel305 Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 My issue with Hynes isn’t his smarts. I’m sure he is plenty intelligent. I just kind of would like to have someone with a little fire in his belly. I think this team needs someone who isn’t afraid to be a little loud and someone who is gonna keep them on their toes and not allow them to go through stretches of playing soft. I’m not sure that’s him. But again, I’d love to be wrong if this is the direction. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 1 hour ago, Bugg said: Hynes is the colorless odorless flavorless gas of retreads. There's little in his CV to recommend him other than he played at BU with the GM. And development; played Jack Hughes on his 4th line. At that point would prefer Messier or Patrick Roy screaming from time to time while displaying Stanley Cup rings obnoxiously with Knoblauch getting promoted to "associate coach". Because there is a close to a 100% chance Hynes will run into the same perimeter cowardly lion shit from DJ MIA, Arturnovi and crew that doomed Quinn and then Gallant. This squad need paddles applied. Or this franchise gonna waste the career of another HoF goalie. Yeah, it could it be possible that any of those coaches doomed themselves, could it? Does a cute nicknames though, what Rangers Twitter thread did you read them in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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