Alexis Lafreniere and the Rangers Reach a Critical Point

[RJWantsTheCup]

4 minutes ago, Pete said:

 I don't hate him. I hate Trouba. Lafreniere just sucks. Unless you're pulling random stats out of your ass. "He's the best on the team at red hairs/per head and dominates all other Rangers wearing 13!"

 

Sure cool.

 

This thread has went on so long maybe it just needs a level set.

 

I don't hate him. He stinks. Let's just say it's half his fault and half the organization (that's completely untrue but let's just leave it there). 

 

Right now he stinks. Will he stinks tomorrow or next year? I don't know. No one can predict the future. He might not always stink.

 

And for the record, if he doesn't stink next year, there's no receipts. Your blind faith, based on absolutely nothing happening on the ice, just happened to pay off. 

So basically he stinks, stank, stunk as an NHLer but who knows if he will stink in the future.

[Pete]

17 minutes ago, RJWantsTheCup said:

So basically he stinks, stank, stunk as an NHLer but who knows if he will stink in the future.

Precisely. I'm not out here saying he's always gonna be bad. Just that so far he's been bad, and he's not showing anything on the ice that would make anyone think he won't always be bad. 

 

But there's always hope that he does eventually show signs of not being bad, and maybe in the future he won't be bad. 

[josh]

1 hour ago, Pete said:

 I don't hate him. I hate Trouba. Lafreniere just sucks. Unless you're pulling random stats out of your ass. "He's the best on the team at red hairs/per head and dominates all other Rangers wearing 13!"

 

Sure cool.

 

This thread has went on so long maybe it just needs a level set.

 

I don't hate him. He stinks. Let's just say it's half his fault and half the organization (that's completely untrue but let's just leave it there). 

 

Right now he stinks. Will he stinks tomorrow or next year? I don't know. No one can predict the future. He might not always stink.

 

And for the record, if he doesn't stink next year, there's no receipts. Your blind faith, based on absolutely nothing happening on the ice, just happened to pay off. 

I’m pulling out basic stats. Sorry if those are too complicated

 

 And out of all people, I can’t understand how Stromes biggest nut hugger refuses to acknowledge what resurrected his career, wouldn’t apply to other offensive players.

 

look though Stromes points totals and how they change when he got put in a spot to be successful, with good linemates, and PP time. 

[Pete]

20 minutes ago, josh said:

I’m pulling out basic stats. Sorry if those are too complicated

 

 And out of all people, I can’t understand how Stromes biggest nut hugger refuses to acknowledge what resurrected his career, wouldn’t apply to other offensive players.

 

look though Stromes points totals and how they change when he got put in a spot to be successful, with good linemates, and PP time. 

And how did he get there? By excelling as a 3rd/4th liner. He didn't come here and materialize as Panarin's center. Your boy Quinn put him in that spot because he saw something in him as a third liner. Stromes shooting percentage as a 3rd liner is better than Lafreniere as a 2nd liner LOL. 

 

One player earned his spot, the other player you want gifted ice time and position based on draft pedigree and nothing more.

 

And you're not pulling out basic stats, you're pulling out half a slice of pizza because it has all the pepperoni and ignoring the rest of the pie

[fletch]

Didn't we move Buchnevich to save cap space, as well as there would be a slot for Lafreniere in the top 6 forwards?  Can we be a serious Stanley Cup contender with lines of Kreider-Zib-Kakko, Panarin-Trocheck-Kravtsov, Lafreniere-Chytil-Vesey?  I don't hate those line combinations, there is good balance for those 3 lines, and the fourth line has been a rotating cast.

 

But eventually don't we need Lafreniere to develop into a top 6 forward?  Or is he a third-line player until he gets moved to another team, where he gets a fresh start, and a chance to develop into the top 6 forward I expect him to be 2-3 years from now?  Maybe he just needs a new organization to develop, and never pans out for the Rangers?

[The Dude]

15 hours ago, josh said:

"Gallant is fucking with Lafreniere... and Alexis should accept it"

 

What?? 

"Gallant is being a cunt and Lafrenière being a supposed all world talent, should be able to score at will against other teams 3rd and 4th line talent that he is constantly matched up against. "

 

What?

[Pete]

5 minutes ago, The Dude said:

3rd and 4th line talent that he is constantly matched up against.

I don't think this gets enough attention.

 

When I see "Kreider and Lafreniere have the same amount of ES points since Laf came in the league", it's such an asinine comment because Kreider is always playing against the opponent best lines and defensmen and Lafreniere among the worst. 

Edited January 7, 2023 by Pete

[The Dude]

22 minutes ago, Pete said:

I don't think this gets enough attention.

 

When I see "Kreider and Lafreniere have the same amount of ES points since Laf came in the league", it's such an asinine comment because Kreider is always playing against the opponent best lines and defensmen and Lafreniere among the worst. 

It's why I tried to bring up other young players  (in the league) who have had success.  If Zegras was playing on a 3rd line on a deep team (not getting PP time), he would score like a MFer and push his way into the PP. 

 

Lafrenière has a unique opportunity to be under the radar for other teams. Playing with Chytil (who IS playing good and scoring) should be opening doors for him. They are getting  great match ups. Lafrenière is not doing anything good out there though. This kid should be dominating if he was 1/2 as good as advertised.  Seriously. 5 fucking goals? 

 

Maybe situationally, he's not getting good opportunities? Like at the end of a 2 minute straight  PP1 shift where the team seems to let off the gas pedal? Or maybe they aren't letting off the pedal.  It's just Lafrenière not playing good to keep up any tempo. 

 

He doesn't typically start a period. I'm guessing his line doesn't usually get many defensive zone starts., do it's not that. 

 

It just seems like we don't see him (or notice him) very much. This year there hasn't been one of those shifts where you would think, "OK this kid is going to have a good game today,  he's on the verge, or he's buzzing." It's just blah. This year especially.  He did start off good pretty good though. What happened since? Injury? 

 

Where I disagree with you Pete, is that Lafrenière shouldn't get a look on PP1, or just getting his PP2 line more looks and starts. I would give a 1OA  a chance based solely on his draft position.  Especially when he's floundering.

 

Gallant has moved lines around to get certain players going. Not sure why Lafrenière doesn't get the same support. 

 

 

Edited January 7, 2023 by The Dude

[BrooksBurner]

There’s a silver lining here for me. He turned 21 back in October, so I don’t have to read the “he can’t even buy a beer yet” cliche as a defense mechanism anymore. I guess there’s still the “he can’t even rent a car” one next.

[Pete]

27 minutes ago, rmc51 said:

There’s a silver lining here for me. He turned 21 back in October, so I don’t have to read the “he can’t even buy a beer yet” cliche as a defense mechanism anymore. I guess there’s still the “he can’t even rent a car” one next.

I hate when people say that because it's such a brainless comment.

 

No, he can't buy a beer, but he's eligible to play in the best league in the world. Did I miss the part where you need to be 21 years old to play in the NHL too? 

[BrooksBurner]

I know the talent is here though. I’ve seen it.

 

I give him one more offseason. If he doesn’t show up to camp in significantly better shape, then I chalk it up as a work ethic problem and I look to trade him.

[Pete]

25 minutes ago, rmc51 said:

I know the talent is here though. I’ve seen it.

 

I give him one more offseason. If he doesn’t show up to camp in significantly better shape, then I chalk it up as a work ethic problem and I look to trade him.

I don't have any more patience with this kid not because I think he's always going to be terrible, but more because I just don't think he has the mental makeup to be an elite player.

 

You can tell he just doesn't take shit seriously, and GG is just not the coach for him because he's not actually going to communicate what's expected, and I don't even think LaFreniere knows why he was benched and scratched. I think he's just chalking it up to the coach being an asshole and in his head he thinks he's playing fine. 

 

This picture really does say a thousand words. 

 

 

 

[RJWantsTheCup]

1 hour ago, rmc51 said:

There’s a silver lining here for me. He turned 21 back in October, so I don’t have to read the “he can’t even buy a beer yet” cliche as a defense mechanism anymore. I guess there’s still the “he can’t even rent a car” one next.

Great now he can drink beer with his donuts.  He’s going to be in even worse shape soon. 

[4EverRangerFrank]

Fitness shouldn’t be in the conversation about any NHL player. But it is. I would think that making it to the show would be motivation enough to be at your best, striving to be better. We have all experienced in life, those ‘new hires’ who were gung-ho during the interview process turn into desk turds a week or two into their employment. Happens all the time. 

[The Dude]

2 hours ago, Pete said:

I don't have any more patience with this kid not because I think he's always going to be terrible, but more because I just don't think he has the mental makeup to be an elite player.

 

You can tell he just doesn't take shit seriously, and GG is just not the coach for him because he's not actually going to communicate what's expected, and I don't even think LaFreniere knows why he was benched and scratched. I think he's just chalking it up to the coach being an asshole and in his head he thinks he's playing fine. 

 

This picture really does say a thousand words. 

 

 

 

Thats real???

 

That's photo shopped man. No way he does that. 

 

Right?

[siddious]

He knows he’s not getting PP time anyway what’s the difference 

[Pete]

19 minutes ago, siddious said:

He knows he’s not getting PP time anyway what’s the difference 

The difference is... act like you give a fuck. 

[Scott]

3 hours ago, rmc51 said:

I know the talent is here though. I’ve seen it.

 

I give him one more offseason. If he doesn’t show up to camp in significantly better shape, then I chalk it up as a work ethic problem and I look to trade him.

Reading through that old thread from early Oct, what a bunch of clowns

 

@Pete was the only one not buying into it.

 

Oh well maybe next year or one of the years after that?

 

The more I see the more I'm equally convinced he doesn't think the NHL game at the same speed as necessary either. I think the problem could be bigger than his physical shape. Not for nothing, I don't think he's a Phil Kessel all kidding aside, he doesn't seem to be that over overweight if at all (sure he enjoys a few good boxes of donuts and slams a few pizzas here and there).  I think he's dog shit slow w/foot speed and the way he thinks the game and has zero endurance.  It's a gear or worse yet a set of gears he may never find. Like I said before I do think we're stuck with him so I guess we'll find out over the next few years of frustration.

[BrooksBurner]

33 minutes ago, jsrangers said:

Reading through that old thread from early Oct, what a bunch of clowns

 

@Pete was the only one not buying into it.

 

Oh well maybe next year or one of the years after that?

 

The more I see the more I'm equally convinced he doesn't think the NHL game at the same speed as necessary either. I think the problem could be bigger than his physical shape. Not for nothing, I don't think he's a Phil Kessel all kidding aside, he doesn't seem to be that over overweight if at all (sure he enjoys a few good boxes of donuts and slams a few pizzas here and there).  I think he's dog shit slow w/foot speed and the way he thinks the game and has zero endurance.  It's a gear or worse yet a set of gears he may never find. Like I said before I do think we're stuck with him so I guess we'll find out over the next few years of frustration.

Yeah. I made that thread too early

 

I came in with high expectations after how he finished last year. Looked like he was picking right up where he left off but man is he out of shape for the rigors of an NHL season.

[Scott]

8 minutes ago, rmc51 said:

Yeah. I made that thread too early

 

I came in with high expectations after how he finished last year. Looked like he was picking right up where he left off but man is he out of shape for the rigors of an NHL season.

No shame there it's what we were all hoping for and counting on.  Nobody was expecting a massive shart.

[Br4d]

Covid.  When all the other answers don't seem to fit there's always Covid.  Bitch of a disease that has long-lasting effects that we've only begun to figure out.

 

Obviously there's no survival value as an NHL player in ignoring your fitness or letting your weight get out of hand.  Whenever I see Laffy red-faced and puffing the first thing that comes to mind is the friend I have who went from being very active to red-faced and puffing after a short walk.  After having Covid of course.  She's 56 so obviously a difference but it just looks so similar.

[Keirik]

Just for some perspective compared to the first 40 games last year.

 

21/22 40 games

8g 3a for 11 points,  49 shots on goal

 

22/23 40 games

5g 13 a for 18 points, 70 shots on goal

[Keirik]

12 minutes ago, Br4d said:

Covid.  When all the other answers don't seem to fit there's always Covid.  Bitch of a disease that has long-lasting effects that we've only begun to figure out.

 

Obviously there's no survival value as an NHL player in ignoring your fitness or letting your weight get out of hand.  Whenever I see Laffy red-faced and puffing the first thing that comes to mind is the friend I have who went from being very active to red-faced and puffing after a short walk.  After having Covid of course.  She's 56 so obviously a difference but it just looks so similar.

It’s kind of silly to speculate that. If that were the case, he’s not making it through a morning skates/practices let alone full NHL games and training camp prior to the season. 

[LindG1000]

It's just getting really hard to root for him. I know he's markedly better than last season in the boxcars as @Keirikpointed out, but he's supposed to be a far more special player than this. A half-point-a-game first overall is perfectly fine....if you're a defender or a rookie.

 

I think it's just compounded having watched Hughes torch us like that. Where's that dynamism from OUR guy?

[Pete]

2 minutes ago, LindG1000 said:

Where's that dynamism from OUR guy?

And this is the crux. I could forgive the production (or lack of) if he was doing something dynamic every game. He's not even noticeable shift to shift.

 

Everytime I ask this, all I get is the goal vs Detroit with Larkin back and the atrocious goaltending. 

 

It's sad, really.