Brooks Rangers Will be in on Patrick Kane

[josh]

Just now, rmc51 said:

I feel like Kravtsov has some center qualities.

No. I’ve watched so much of him over the years and nothing to me says center. 
 

He’s an ideal opposite winger for Panarin. 

[RangersIn7]

41 minutes ago, josh said:

No. I’ve watched so much of him over the years and nothing to me says center. 
 

He’s an ideal opposite winger for Panarin. 

Agree.

Hes not a C.

Not at all.

His skill set, just looking at it, looks complimentary to Panarin’s. How it plays out? WTFK. 

[Br4d]

4 hours ago, RichieNextel305 said:

We were just within 2 games of the Final and 6 wins of a Championship. We’re going for it. Teams going for it don’t trade guys coming off of 52-goal seasons. What if this season wasn’t a one off and Kreider finally had something click and he becomes a 40-45 goal guy the next 2 or 3 years?

 

Hes the best net front presence in the league. He’s at the heart of one of the Top 2 or 3 power plays in the league. He’s a leader. Yeah, I get it. Not everyone loves the contract. But good players make good money, and Kreider is a good player. 

Kreider is a Ranger.

 

You don't trade Rangers unless you have no other recourse.

 

 

[Capt]

2 hours ago, Pete said:

Bro, you said you don't win Cups building around LW. Clearly untrue.

 

Just take the L. You're wrong.

Stats since Panarin signed.

Bro, Ovie had playoff disappointment for over a decade until the Caps finally had great depth at center.  Kusnetsov and Backstrom are a little different tha. Zib and scrub.  The only other wing on your list here to win a cup is Marchand who had Bergeron and Krecji as their top 2 centers and I believe Seguin when they won.  

 

And yes Ovie is an all time great.

 

So no I won't take the L.  Teams that win don't do so by having zero depth at center.  To even have to explain that to anyone here is laughable.  The rangers have Zib and no one else that are considered good centers.  That is a fact.  Prove me wrong, so I can take an L

[Pete]

1 hour ago, Capt said:

Bro, Ovie had playoff disappointment for over a decade until the Caps finally had great depth at center.  Kusnetsov and Backstrom are a little different tha. Zib and scrub.  The only other wing on your list here to win a cup is Marchand who had Bergeron and Krecji as their top 2 centers and I believe Seguin when they won.  

 

And yes Ovie is an all time great.

 

So no I won't take the L.  Teams that win don't do so by having zero depth at center.  To even have to explain that to anyone here is laughable.  The rangers have Zib and no one else that are considered good centers.  That is a fact.  Prove me wrong, so I can take an L

And you're moving the goal posts that's how I know you know you lost on your original point about Panarin being overpaid and not winning by paying LWs... It was a silly hill to die on. 

[Capt]

1 hour ago, Pete said:

And you're moving the goal posts that's how I know you know you lost on your original point about Panarin being overpaid and not winning by paying LWs... It was a silly hill to die on. 

Not moving the goalposts at all.  You can't respond so you act like you're in first grade.   The Rangers cannot afford to improve at center. The Rangers cannot afford it because their allocation of the cap is fucked up.  They have decided to pay  25% of their cap on two left wings.  Worse than that they have a plethora of wings in their system.  

 

 

[Sod16]

We're really into summer doldrums if we're talking about things that just ain't happening, like trading one of the best $6m a year players in the league.  Lean on CK to waive his NMC?  That's going to go over well with the players.  Why would he waive it?  It's not like they could go to him and threaten to waive him (NMC), as was done with McDonaugh.   

 

We may have to accept that we are a bit weak as far as second center goes for now.  In the cap era, all teams have at least one such weakness and the contenders work around it.  Heck, the defending champs don't even have a good goalie.

[Pete]

6 hours ago, Capt said:

Not moving the goalposts at all.  You can't respond so you act like you're in first grade.   The Rangers cannot afford to improve at center. The Rangers cannot afford it because their allocation of the cap is fucked up.  They have decided to pay  25% of their cap on two left wings.  Worse than that they have a plethora of wings in their system.  

 

 

 

 

They didn't have a "plethora of wings" when they signed Panarin and Kreider. Lafreniere fell in their lap.

 

And who cares about the system? Want to be in a perpetual state of rebuild? Just trading elite talent in one position to strengthen another (where you almost never get equal talent back), and then slot in rookies on ELCs into empty slots and being weaker overall anyway?

 

Congrats, you're now Ottawa. 

 

And if you can't reply without a personal shot, don't reply. You got proven wrong. Just deal with it. It happens. 

[The Dude]

15 hours ago, Br4d said:

Kakko would be the one to try at C.  He's played the position before and he's clearly got the legs to be a two-way player.

 

However that still does not resolve the depth chart issues because it moves a RW to C.

 

If I'm the Rangers I ask myself if I can afford to have 3 1LW's and support them all at the same time.

 

If the answer is yes then a lot of other moves have to be made to support that decision.  You need a 2C to support whomever the 2LW is, and that's not an easy call either.  If you don't put Lafreniere in the top 6 you are insane at this point from a developmental and future value perspective.  Lafreniere is the Ranger's future up front and to keep pretending that is not the case is just a loser move all around.  So do you put Kreider at 3LW or Panarin?  Because Lafreniere is taking one of the top 6 spots.  If you put Panarin at 2LW then that seemingly prevents you from using Chytil as 2C.  So Kreider to 3LW with Chytil and you also need to find at least 1RW alongside the 2C.

 

One solution would be to move Kreider to RW and resolve half the logjam right away.

 

That puts Laf-Zibanejad-Kreider on 1.  It puts Panarin, 2C, Kratsov/Kakko on line 2.  It puts 3LW, Chytil and Kratsov/Kakko on line 3.  3LW could be Will Cuylle if the Rangers decide to roster him in 2022-23 which is probably a decent chance.  Obviously there are other less attractive possibilities at 3LW but lines 1 and 2 look really good if the Rangers can figure out how to get Lafreniere on one of them alongside a 2C acquisition.  There's a lot of talent in those 6 players and line 3 has real possibilities also.  Line 4 is Hunt, Goodrow, Reaves which is a decent checking line.

 

If you choose to keep the 3LW's then figuring out how to line them all up is much tougher.

I agree that Lafreniere should be in the top 6. I also think Kakko and Chytil shoukd be too....

 

I've been on my soapbox saying the kid line should be the 2nd line, moving Panarin to Zibanejads line and figuring out which wing he plays on there. Then sign or trade for a quality 3C who either plays with some grit while having some offensive abilities, or is a flat out defensive wizard.

 

IMO the kids have not matched up well with other top six players. 

 

Kakko-  Didn't do much with Panarin OR Zibanejad this past season. It was a small sample, but it didn't look  good and his style didn't fit the components of those players. 

 

Lafreniere- while he played some RW with Panarin and Zibanejad, I'm pretty sure they experimented pushing Kreider to the right. Neither situation lasted long and I don't recall good results.  Hence the Vatrano trade.  I believe Lafreniere landed on the 4th line after one of those opportunities. 

 

Chytil- He's really just been stuck on the 3rd line where there wasn't much chemistry between he, Lafreniere and Gauthier,  though I felt like they needed more time together.  He got a few shifts as Panarins C and was quickly moved out of there. He played wing and looked ok for a few games but was quickly moved back to 3C. 

 

I myself think the trio play their best together. 

 

With the current cap problem and the lack of really solid options available, that fit the Rangers salary structure, I don't want to throw 6 plus years at Strome at 6 mill. I'd really like to keep Copp and have him as the 3C, but he hardly played C here and is looking for a big time contract.  

 

Who ever they bring this summer,  it's very likely going to be an albatross in the near future. Whether it's signing someone or trading for someone on their last leg. It's going to bite them in the ass and make things harder down the road. 

 

All this while also suppressing the kids growth potential. They don't fit on other lines, but they need to grow. They need to play more.

 

So, to me, its either play them together,  or move 2 of them  in a trade.  Stop stalling and make a choice. Trying to force them into spots that they didn't look good in, isn't the answer.

 

Chytil isn't going to center Panarin. Kakko isn't going to fit with Panarin or Zibanejad either. Lafreniere? I don't see a fit unless it's with Chytil and Kakko. They need bigger roles.  All of em. 

 

To me, since we are expecting a step backwards anyway, I think they should play it safe and think of the near future. Kid line as 2nd line, get a quality 3C on a manageable contract and see how the kids progress and figure out if/what they are worth extending next summer, or even deal them mid season.. Someone is bound to become unhappy elsewhere and if that happens and the kid line is a failure, as well as trying them in other spots,  you can then move them or pieces for a player. Maybe Larkin decides he wants out. Maybe Kopitar becomes available. 

 

I don't like the market available (besides Kadri, who people think is going to get 100 billion on his next contract) and I don't see why the Rangers should strap themselves to another overpay and NTC on the Cs available via FA. 

 

Then again.. Malkin is interesting at the right price... 

 

Edited July 9, 2022 by The Dude

[BrooksBurner]

https://nypost.com/2022/07/08/patrick-kane-must-be-rangers-target-if-theyre-ready-for-next-step

 

Quote

The question I am posing is this: If Drury believes this team is close enough to winning a Cup in 2023 to pay big for a one-year rental, would it make more sense to go as far in as possible for Patrick Kane instead of J.T. Miller? 

 

Quote

If Drury believes the Rangers are within rental range of a Cup, then he walls off Shesterkin, Adam Fox, Alexis Lafreniere, K’Andre Miller, Braden Schneider, Ryan Lindgren, Brennan Othmann and Will Cuylle and adds no-move guys Panarin, Chris Kreider, Mika Zibanejad and Jacob Trouba to the list. 

 

And then he barters.

 

First question: Are the Rangers close enough to rent a blue chip property?

 

And the second: If so, shouldn’t Patrick Kane be Target 1?

You tell em LB! Get me Kaner

[Pete]

3 minutes ago, rmc51 said:

https://nypost.com/2022/07/08/patrick-kane-must-be-rangers-target-if-theyre-ready-for-next-step

 

 

You tell em LB! Get me Kaner

Unfortunately they're not one player away. 

 

And I'm probably the biggest Patrick Kane fan on this board, but the need is JT Miller. A Patrick Kane style player was not getting us past Tampa Bay... A JT Miller like object would have been much more helpful.

 

And I also will reiterate the obvious, we are looking for a center not a right wing. We need a right-wing slot open to shift a left wing to, and unless Krav or Kakko go the other way (dumb IMO), there's just no space. 

[BrooksBurner]

Just now, Pete said:

Unfortunately they're not one player away. 

 

And I'm probably the biggest Patrick Kane fan on this board, but the need is JT Miller. A Patrick Kane style player was not getting us past Tampa Bay... A JT Miller like object would have been much more helpful.

 

And I also will reiterate the obvious, we are looking for a center not a right wing. We need a right-wing slot open to shift a left wing to, and unless Krav or Kakko go the other way (dumb IMO), there's just no space. 

You’re probably right re: not being one player away. At least without a few things going the Rangers’ way. But without making a move, they have no chance. If they got Kane, they would have a reasonable chance.  Not favorites, but in the contender list. All you need is a chance.

 

If they do make a rental move, Kane is a better get than Miller to me. I’m not sold Miller works with Panarin. I also think he costs more than Kane in a trade. Kane can force his way here.

 

Look at what Debrincat just went for. I don’t see why Kane half-retained would cost more than Lundkvist and a 1st if he pushes for a trade here. I make that deal 10x out of 10.

[Br4d]

The Rangers could be one player away right now if any of the kids make a leap next year.  If two of them suddenly start producing the Rangers are a player more away from a serious run.

 

In all of this we shouldn't forget that Lafreniere was the #1 overall a short time ago and that he was close to the team lead in 5v5 goals last season.  He also had a hell of a playoff run even if all that work did not translate into a lot of goals.

 

Kakko is really young and always seems on the edge of putting it all together.  He gets his opportunities and then he fumbles them.  If that pattern continues next season the Rangers are going to have to start assessing trade opportunities.

 

Chytil's potential suddenly flickered into view in the post-season.  Who was that guy who suddenly looked so strong around the net?  Can we turn that on for good? If he gets rolling the Rangers have 2 1C's and everything becomes easier.

[jsm7302]

I'm not interested in a RW of that caliber when we are tissue paper thin down the middle. That $$ need be spent on a center.

 

Our D is set IMO. Goaltender set (whoever they choose as a backup will be fine).

 

Our O lines are a jumbled bunch of parts after the departure of Strome, Copp and Vatrano. 

 

Keep the kid line together and put Krav with Panarin and whomever they pick up for center and put a hard nosed tough to play against RW on Zib and Kreids line (not Pat Kane).

[Pete]

1 hour ago, rmc51 said:

You’re probably right re: not being one player away. At least without a few things going the Rangers’ way. But without making a move, they have no chance. If they got Kane, they would have a reasonable chance.  Not favorites, but in the contender list. All you need is a chance.

 

If they do make a rental move, Kane is a better get than Miller to me. I’m not sold Miller works with Panarin. I also think he costs more than Kane in a trade. Kane can force his way here.

 

Look at what Debrincat just went for. I don’t see why Kane half-retained would cost more than Lundkvist and a 1st if he pushes for a trade here. I make that deal 10x out of 10.

They just don't need a RW though. 

 

I think if Miller could work with Pettersson he can work with Bread. Miller has the same qualities as Strome in knowing where to be, finding lanes, being an outlet who can make plays. He's just got a mean streak and is willing to play in traffic. 

[RJWantsTheCup]

I don’t see any problem with Miller being able to play with Panarin other than how they can afford to sign him after this year.  

[Capt]

7 hours ago, Pete said:

 

 

They didn't have a "plethora of wings" when they signed Panarin and Kreider. Lafreniere fell in their lap.

 

And who cares about the system? Want to be in a perpetual state of rebuild? Just trading elite talent in one position to strengthen another (where you almost never get equal talent back), and then slot in rookies on ELCs into empty slots and being weaker overall anyway?

 

Congrats, you're now Ottawa. 

 

And if you can't reply without a personal shot, don't reply. You got proven wrong. Just deal with it. It happens. 

Who cares what position they were in?  It only matters where they are now.  They have an abundance of wings and defenseman in their pipeline and on their NHL roster.  Those are their strengths.  It doesn't make sense to have Laf a 1OA pick and future of the franchise blocked from playing top 6 minutes or power play minutes, especially when the two blocking him make almost $20M in cap space.  

 

The entirety of your post here is making up shit that you think I said or mean.  I want to redirect $7-10M in cap space to the center position from the wing.  That doesn't make you Ottawa.  That makes you deeper and better.  

 

I reply just fine.  Consistently putting words in people's mouths to fit your narrative is moving the goal posts and debating a straw man .  You have proven nothing and you saying so doesn't strengthen your opinion.  That may work on the Huffington Post comments section.  

[Capt]

15 hours ago, Pete said:

And you're moving the goal posts that's how I know you know you lost on your original point about Panarin being overpaid and not winning by paying LWs... It was a silly hill to die on. 

This response is simple trolling only allowed because it's you.

[Capt]

I'm all for JT Miller.  I just don't see how the money works especially after year 1.  Seems like they would have to give up a lot for a rental.

[Pete]

2 hours ago, Capt said:

Who cares what position they were in?  It only matters where they are now.  They have an abundance of wings and defenseman in their pipeline and on their NHL roster.  Those are their strengths.  It doesn't make sense to have Laf a 1OA pick and future of the franchise blocked from playing top 6 minutes or power play minutes, especially when the two blocking him make almost $20M in cap space.  

 

The entirety of your post here is making up shit that you think I said or mean.  I want to redirect $7-10M in cap space to the center position from the wing.  That doesn't make you Ottawa.  That makes you deeper and better.  

 

I reply just fine.  Consistently putting words in people's mouths to fit your narrative is moving the goal posts and debating a straw man .  You have proven nothing and you saying so doesn't strengthen your opinion.  That may work on the Huffington Post comments section.  

You really don't even have a point or a like to stand on, so I'm just going to leave you here to keep pining over trading a player that's not going to get traded. 

[Pete]

2 hours ago, Capt said:

This response is simple trolling only allowed because it's you.

If you consider that trolling then you need to grow a thicker skin. You got proven wrong hands down. Your original point was that Panarin was overpaid. He's not. Then you said teams that build around left wings don't win, but Caps. So you're wrong again. 

 

Take the L instead of just changing the argument. 

Edited July 9, 2022 by Pete

[Shane Falco]

3 hours ago, Capt said:

This response is simple trolling only allowed because it's you.

 

57 minutes ago, Pete said:

You really don't even have a point or a like to stand on, so I'm just going to leave you here to keep pining over trading a player that's not going to get traded. 

 

55 minutes ago, Pete said:

If you consider that trolling then you need to grow a thicker skin. You got proven wrong hands down. Your original point was that Panarin was overpaid. He's not. Then you said teams that build around left wings don't win, but Caps. So you're wrong again. 

 

Take the L instead of just changing the argument. 

 

That's enough. Move on please.

 

[BrooksBurner]

46 minutes ago, Shane Falco said:

 

 

 

That's enough. Move on please.

 

There goes my Saturday entertainment Mr Buzzkill

[BrooksBurner]

7 hours ago, Pete said:

They just don't need a RW though. 

That’s what everyone said last summer when they dealt Buchnevich. They need a proven RW. It was the achilles heel of the forward group all year long. Going Lafreniere/Kravtsov/Kakko isn’t very realistic if the team has any aspirations next year. I know around here we expect a step back, but I don’t think Drury is necessarily going to manage that way.

Edited July 9, 2022 by rmc51

[Pete]

23 minutes ago, rmc51 said:

That’s what everyone said last summer when they dealt Buchnevich. They need a proven RW. It was the achilles heel of the forward group all year long. Going Lafreniere/Kravtsov/Kakko isn’t very realistic if the team has any aspirations next year. I know around here we expect a step back, but I don’t think Drury is necessarily going to manage that way.

When I say they don't need a RW, I mean they have like 5 guys who can line up there.

 

They literally don't have enough centers on the team right now.