2022-23 Off-season Thread: Endless Pain, Hatred, and Rage ... Also Boredom

[RJWantsTheCup]

I think everyone has seen enough Panarin and Trochek together. 

[RichieNextel305]

I agree regarding Trocheck and Panarin. And it’s an issue. Because with 93, 72 and 16 signed for a few years, who does Panarin slot in with?

 

We all know he doesn’t work with Trocheck. Chytil and him, in limited action, hasn’t worked. Him with Zibanejad hasn’t really worked well either.

 

Listen, he’s gonna get his points. But I just don’t know where is best for him. I guess Chytil is the most logical spot. But even that doesn’t raise loads of confidence.

[The Dude]

14 minutes ago, Phil said:

 

I really hope not. Panarin and Trocheck go together like peanut butter and tuna fish. Chytil might work, but they've barely played together, so the jury's still out. They also don't have much choice outside of him, so they'll probably play together by default.

 

Personally, I've seen all I ever want to see of Trocheck and Panairn. Next season, I think it'd be smart to consider the idea of Laugh taking Kreider's spot at ES on the Zib line (to boost him) and then reuniting Kreider and Trocheck to create a straight line third line (with Vesey).

 

We don't know exactly what the outcome of the off-season will be, but with their limitations, they could easily go with:

 

Laugh-Zib-Kakko

Panarin-Chytil-Fast

Kreider-Trocheck-Vesey

Othmann-Kampf-Motte

 

They get "harder to play against" with all the bolded new additions and they won't break their cap.

 

If shit goes sideways, you can reconfigure, but I'd be actively trying to work a lineup that doesn't pair Panarin and Trocheck.

I agree with the Trocheck Panarin combo not working.  But if Trocheck moves to wing and kind stays on the outside, it's a different philosophy.

 

This year,  Trocheck would either pull the trigger at the wrong time, or Panarin would needle a pass into his skates on the doorstep.

 

Where Trocheck goes on the ice -as a center-, may be different than where he would go as a winger, with a center like Chytil, who isn't as predictable with where he can score from, would naturally make Trocheck change his game. 

 

If not with Panarin,  put him with Zibanejad  and Kreider.  

 

I'm trying to find a spot for Trocheck that fits his salary,  but also puts Chytil in a better position to succeed.  Chytil needs to be the 2 C. 

 

They need a gritty 3C. I guess Trocheck fits that mold and I don't hate paying him big bucks (it looks better after next season as the cap should go up a lot) to be the 3 C.

 

I think he worked great with Kreider. But I'm not putting Vesey on a 3rd line. I'm not giving Lafrenière top line minutes.  And I'm not bringing back Fast. 

 

There's many avenues they can go down. But Trocheck as Panarins center isnt one of them. So we agree there. 

 

I honestly see no way to get Lafrenière into any lineup that doesn't put him in the incorrect spot. Now,  more than ever, they can’t take a chance on giving him top line minutes.  He hasn't shown enough to warrant it. There's been too little of progress.  I can't see a new coach or a coach who's job is on the line, playing this disappointment on the top line. 

 

 

 

 

[Cash or Czech]

Our offensive “scheme” is so fluid it doesn’t matter who plays what position. Laugh can’t play RW yet half his zone entries were on the right side. Moving Trocheck to wing doesn’t change a thing or help with chemistry

[Pete]

1 hour ago, Cash or Czech said:

Our offensive “scheme” is so fluid it doesn’t matter who plays what position. Laugh can’t play RW yet half his zone entries were on the right side. Moving Trocheck to wing doesn’t change a thing or help with chemistry

It's worse than I thought, Laugh can't even tell his left from right. 

[Ranger Lothbrok]

With the dust having settled SLIGHTLY (though the pain hasn't abated in the slightest), I have come to believe that this result was both healthy and necessary. Last year we kind of failed upwards. We were getting dominated by Crosby before Trouba took him out. We were kind of a bad matchup for the Canes I guess, but we got as far as we did with shitty 5 on 5 play, decent special teams, and superb goaltending. We caught a rusty Tampa team, but as soon as they warmed up, we basically got swept. Those latter 4 games weren't remotely competitive. Neither was this series after the Devils shook off the jitters. 

 

This team is a bit of fool's gold. Regular season heroes with disappearing acts when it matters. And Drury fell for the same shit we used to and got stars in his eyes. Last year we made strategic adds in Copp and Vatrano and made it 2 games away from the SCFs. This year we chased star power that we didn't even really need and paid for it. 

 

This is this team's second trip to the post season after a five year drought. Getting to the ECFs last year was kind of miraculous, and again, required Crosby getting knocked out. We couldn't knock out Hughes and the better team won. Two years ago Panarin got his head bashed into the ice and we reacted by firing our GM and President and adding toughness. This year we added two scoring wingers for...what reason, exactly? In 94 we traded a young Tony Amonte for Matteau and look how that panned out. 

 

This needed to happen if this core was ever going to win anything. They're just not good. They don't want it bad enough. I hope they're embarrassed, sad, and enraged, and I hope this forces Drury to make some adjustments. Hopefully, this lights a fire the way only an embarrassing first round exit to your biggest rival after dominating the first two games can. 

 

We were exposed. NJ deserved it, every bit of it. They hounded us for every single puck and we had NO answer. They skated circles around us and we let them. They adjusted their PK and we did nothing. Flat out, the better team won. 

 

For me, it's better that it happened now than when we invariably run into NJ again in the next five years in the semis or conference finals. Learn from it. Be ashamed by it. And be better. 

[RichieNextel305]

Someone posted something similar to where I feel like canning Gallant almost gives the guys in the locker room an excuse too. “It was his fault, he didn’t do his job! So he’s gone, but keep doing what you’re doing!”

 

I don’t think that message is necessarily right here. This team needs mental fortitude. Way too soft upstairs and we need guys who get tough come playoff time, not who wilt.

 

Now, the flip side might also be that there is someone out there who may be able to get the most out of these guys too. Again, just a horribly tough call for Drury to make. Definitely don’t envy the job and the work he has on his plate right now. Lots of decisions that are gonna be scrutinized by the entire fanbase here.

[BrooksBurner]

I'm pretty convinced that Tyler Bertuzzi needs to be at the top of the list of moves to make for Drury. No matter what direction he chooses to go in terms of who is getting traded, he's the exact kind of guy who needs to be brought in. He likes to go to high traffic areas of the ice and has top 6 talent.

[Sharpshooter]

13 minutes ago, RichieNextel305 said:

Someone posted something similar to where I feel like canning Gallant almost gives the guys in the locker room an excuse too. “It was his fault, he didn’t do his job! So he’s gone, but keep doing what you’re doing!”

 

I don’t think that message is necessarily right here. This team needs mental fortitude. Way too soft upstairs and we need guys who get tough come playoff time, not who wilt.

 

Now, the flip side might also be that there is someone out there who may be able to get the most out of these guys too. Again, just a horribly tough call for Drury to make. Definitely don’t envy the job and the work he has on his plate right now. Lots of decisions that are gonna be scrutinized by the entire fanbase here.

This could be one hell of an interesting offseason.

[BrooksBurner]

18 minutes ago, RichieNextel305 said:

Someone posted something similar to where I feel like canning Gallant almost gives the guys in the locker room an excuse too. “It was his fault, he didn’t do his job! So he’s gone, but keep doing what you’re doing!”

 

I don’t think that message is necessarily right here. This team needs mental fortitude. Way too soft upstairs and we need guys who get tough come playoff time, not who wilt.

 

Now, the flip side might also be that there is someone out there who may be able to get the most out of these guys too. Again, just a horribly tough call for Drury to make. Definitely don’t envy the job and the work he has on his plate right now. Lots of decisions that are gonna be scrutinized by the entire fanbase here.

 

I've had my issues with Gallant. A few things he's done have really grinded my gears, and I think he really botched the PP deployments most of the year, especially post-trade deadline, but there just is no doubt in my mind that playoff loss was almost entirely on the players. Maybe 90% players and 10% Gallant if I'm assigning percentages. I totally agree that firing him might send that kind of excuse down to the locker room, and I'm not on board with that.

 

Firing Gallant, trading a kid, etc. None of this sends the right message at all. There's only one move that sends a proper message to the locker room and changes the makeup of the team. Drury will be GM of the year if he finds a way to unload Panarin.

[jsm7302]

44 minutes ago, BrooksBurner said:

 

I've had my issues with Gallant. A few things he's done have really grinded my gears, and I think he really botched the PP deployments most of the year, especially post-trade deadline, but there just is no doubt in my mind that playoff loss was almost entirely on the players. Maybe 90% players and 10% Gallant if I'm assigning percentages. I totally agree that firing him might send that kind of excuse down to the locker room, and I'm not on board with that.

 

Firing Gallant, trading a kid, etc. None of this sends the right message at all. There's only one move that sends a proper message to the locker room and changes the makeup of the team. Drury will be GM of the year if he finds a way to unload Panarin.

Dude has been a magician with some of his moves so it isn't impossible, just near impossible because Panarin drives that bus with his NMC. 

 

If Gallant stays then you gotta shake up the lineup and maybe it isn't at the cost of the kid line. Send Trochek packing a year into his contract? Send Fox or Miller somewhere for the dynamic RW we need?

 

A hockey trade must be made, talent for talent in order to right this ship.

[RichieNextel305]

43 minutes ago, BrooksBurner said:

 

I've had my issues with Gallant. A few things he's done have really grinded my gears, and I think he really botched the PP deployments most of the year, especially post-trade deadline, but there just is no doubt in my mind that playoff loss was almost entirely on the players. Maybe 90% players and 10% Gallant if I'm assigning percentages. I totally agree that firing him might send that kind of excuse down to the locker room, and I'm not on board with that.

 

Firing Gallant, trading a kid, etc. None of this sends the right message at all. There's only one move that sends a proper message to the locker room and changes the makeup of the team. Drury will be GM of the year if he finds a way to unload Panarin.

I think the chances of them trading Panarin are next to slim and none.

 

That being said, and again I am speaking in pure fantasy here because I don’t know whether moving him is right or wrong, these are some things I am concerned with. 
 

IF we do wait too long on Panarin, there is a chance he is 100% untradeable later when his regular season production isn’t even up to par. If Drury ever looked to do it now, we would find a taker. Would it take work from all parties? Sure. He has a NMC that would need to be worked on. Would he waive it if he felt he wasn’t wanted or was being shopped? Your guess is as good as mine. That said, Panarin is still a draw, is still an elite regular season player in this league and there are teams that would take him. We would clearly need to retain some, but I do think that the Rangers retaining money on him would net us something of value PLUS cap space to breathe. 
 

One of my issues with having Panarin and Zibanejad is the mental fragility. They both seem to be really nutty upstairs. And when it snowballs, it snowballs. In Zibanejads case, it almost looks like Kreider has to prop him up when times are tough because he gets so down on himself. Panarin gets shaken by the moment and gets away from being himself. And after a playoff like that, I’m scared it may either completely overwhelm him again this time next year.

Listen, I know it’s doubtful and I’m not even sure I want it, as much as I was red hot mad at him the other night and as bad as he was this whole series. You lose him, who knows how the team plays come playoff time? It would obviously be a lot of reshuffling. 
 

But honestly, the way they played in that series has given this fanbase, this media contingent and this front office the right to declare that no one outside of Igor is safe. You play like that? No option should be locked away and considered off the table. Even if it’s floated out there as a wake up.

[Albatrosss]

This team is not built for playoffs. Playoff hockey is a grind and this team is all finesse. And it starts with Panarin.  

[Phil]

3 hours ago, BrooksBurner said:

I'm pretty convinced that Tyler Bertuzzi needs to be at the top of the list of moves to make for Drury. No matter what direction he chooses to go in terms of who is getting traded, he's the exact kind of guy who needs to be brought in. He likes to go to high traffic areas of the ice and has top 6 talent.

 

I mean, on paper, yeah, but you need to swap him with one of Panarin or Kreider because he's going to make like $6 million? He also needs to be in the top six and is a left wing.

[RichieNextel305]

I don’t think there’s one or two or any set steps where you can look at and say, “that’s the answer!” This off-season is going to be unchartered territory. Anything can happen.

 

Usually, when a team loses, the gut reaction is to try and mold your team more like the team you just lost to. Not just us, or this sport. It’s like that in many sports I feel.

 

That said, while sure I would love to have Jerseys speed, it’s part of their team identity. For example, adding 1 or 2 burners makes us quicker; it doesn’t make our team as fast as theirs.

 

Going off track here, my point is this: I think usually we have a pretty good idea as to what moves or what types of players we need to pursue are. And what avenues we can take to get that type of player(s) here. Now? After what just happened? I really don’t know. I don’t know who to target, what to target, who is gonna take a fall, if anyone is gonna take a fall, who’s gonna be behind the bench, etc.

 

And again, as an organization, this falls on everyone, top to bottom. They did this to themselves and they gave themselves all a long few months to sit back, think, marinate and come up with a plan for the future. Because if we had just been beat by a better team, like we were last year, I think we can accept that. But to just come up with such gutless performances? It makes you wonder, and Drury has some wondering to do before he starts making moves.

Edited May 5, 2023 by RichieNextel305

[Br4d]

Bertuzzi is a LW.  Acquiring him would be a lot like the Trocheck acquisition in that we would get a known quantity but then be vulnerable to having somebody else (Laffy, Othman, Cuylle) step up making him a luxury not a need.

 

The Rangers really need to acquire this type of player on the RW, not another on the LW.

[jamsim1967]

The word is out on this team, and the entire league knows this. They are soft, and when they just don't feel like playing hard, or even showing up, they don't. They have trouble with teams that can skate, and hit. They get punched in the stomach, they wilt and will not punch back. Rather than take the body, the majority of the time they are happy to just use their stick and try and poke check. Anybody who watched Tampa and Toronto, or Boston and Florida was able to see the Rangers glaring weaknesses. The top 6, and a few defensive players have a problem rolling up their sleeves and going for it. If you can't motivate yourself for the playoffs, or a game 7 against the Devils, it's on the players. It's not a coaching issue, they are soft and are not built for the playoffs. Getting a new coach is not the answer. Drury and Gallant need to sit down and discuss what this team needs going forward. 

 

That being said, the Rangers will most likely bring in someone new, because that's what they always do. Just don't expect different results.

[mbob]

12 hours ago, Ranger Lothbrok said:

With the dust having settled SLIGHTLY (though the pain hasn't abated in the slightest), I have come to believe that this result was both healthy and necessary. Last year we kind of failed upwards. We were getting dominated by Crosby before Trouba took him out. We were kind of a bad matchup for the Canes I guess, but we got as far as we did with shitty 5 on 5 play, decent special teams, and superb goaltending. We caught a rusty Tampa team, but as soon as they warmed up, we basically got swept. Those latter 4 games weren't remotely competitive. Neither was this series after the Devils shook off the jitters. 

 

This team is a bit of fool's gold. Regular season heroes with disappearing acts when it matters. And Drury fell for the same shit we used to and got stars in his eyes. Last year we made strategic adds in Copp and Vatrano and made it 2 games away from the SCFs. This year we chased star power that we didn't even really need and paid for it. 

 

This is this team's second trip to the post season after a five year drought. Getting to the ECFs last year was kind of miraculous, and again, required Crosby getting knocked out. We couldn't knock out Hughes and the better team won. Two years ago Panarin got his head bashed into the ice and we reacted by firing our GM and President and adding toughness. This year we added two scoring wingers for...what reason, exactly? In 94 we traded a young Tony Amonte for Matteau and look how that panned out. 

 

This needed to happen if this core was ever going to win anything. They're just not good. They don't want it bad enough. I hope they're embarrassed, sad, and enraged, and I hope this forces Drury to make some adjustments. Hopefully, this lights a fire the way only an embarrassing first round exit to your biggest rival after dominating the first two games can. 

 

We were exposed. NJ deserved it, every bit of it. They hounded us for every single puck and we had NO answer. They skated circles around us and we let them. They adjusted their PK and we did nothing. Flat out, the better team won. 

 

For me, it's better that it happened now than when we invariably run into NJ again in the next five years in the semis or conference finals. Learn from it. Be ashamed by it. And be better. 

 

I’m terrible with words and you nailed my exact thoughts when earlier I only said  “the mirage is lifted”.
 

While I’m disappointed in this years playoffs, it doesn’t hurt as much as other failures for me, deep down I could see the issues.   We all did but were fooled into thinking they’d switch it on.  Then after the  first two playoff games my head was spinning that they just may have a switch and run in them.   

[jsm7302]

I've definitely taken a few steps back from the edge after our final game.

 

With that said, Gallant has a pretty good record here and I'm not sure we have seen the last of him. In fact I think Drury may take an outside the box approach to this off season and try to move one of the NMC contracts. I think removing Kreider is a tough decision but also makes Mika a bit more uncomfortable and focused. Kreids can fetch a good RW to slot in which is really what this team needs. Kreider is a year away from a NTC kicking in and I think it sends a message loud and clear that no one is safe and you gotta pick it up if you want to stay. We have to give to get; I don't love it but tough decisions needs to be made.

 

[mbob]

2 hours ago, jsm7302 said:

I've definitely taken a few steps back from the edge after our final game.

 

With that said, Gallant has a pretty good record here and I'm not sure we have seen the last of him. In fact I think Drury may take an outside the box approach to this off season and try to move one of the NMC contracts. I think removing Kreider is a tough decision but also makes Mika a bit more uncomfortable and focused. Kreids can fetch a good RW to slot in which is really what this team needs. Kreider is a year away from a NTC kicking in and I think it sends a message loud and clear that no one is safe and you gotta pick it up if you want to stay. We have to give to get; I don't love it but tough decisions needs to be made.

 

 

My problem with moving Kreider is his contract isn't bad for the production.  That and he sort of is cementing himself as one of the Rangers all-time greats.  I think he would be coveted in the market, maybe if we could move another contract along with him I would be more inclined to accept it like Trouba.

[jsm7302]

47 minutes ago, mbob said:

 

My problem with moving Kreider is his contract isn't bad for the production.  That and he sort of is cementing himself as one of the Rangers all-time greats.  I think he would be coveted in the market, maybe if we could move another contract along with him I would be more inclined to accept it like Trouba.

I agree with everything you said; I just don't think Trouba nets the RW we need like Kreider could. I don't wanna move CK, but for the betterment of the org and a possible cup, I'd entertain it.

[Br4d]

The issue isn't really moving Kreider specifically.  It's breaking up a logjam at LW while putting a group of veteran players on notice that if they are not playing every game like it might be their last as a Ranger it might be their last as a Ranger.

 

Kreider is one of two guys on the roster you can do that with.

Edited May 5, 2023 by Br4d

[BrooksBurner]

Playing around in CapFriendly pretending I'm in the [despicable] "trade Lafreniere" boat, so I've left him unsigned. Other than that, I've only re-signed Miller at $4M, Zac Jones at $800k, and Halak at $1M.

 

There's $5M left to round out this roster and tell me how it is in any way a better forechecking and hardworking team than what was sent to the slaughterhouse against the Devils.

 

I'll wait.

 

[BrooksBurner]

On the flip side, here's Panarin traded with $2M retained to Anaheim..expecting next to nothing back in return. Maybe a couple mid round picks.

 

I've made the same signings, plus Lafreniere at $3M and Bertuzzi at $5.75M. You've got $6M to round out this roster. Lots of options.

 

 

 

 

[RJWantsTheCup]

5M to get 4 wings isn't very much.  

I played around on cap friendly the other day and I think the best scenario is trading Miller & Lafraniere to improve the right wing dilemma.

Could save a few dollars by going with spicy pork instead of Halak.