Pete Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 Never shoot? Scored 27 goals... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giacomin Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 I myself could care less about how Hayes uses his size. It cant be taught, he is what he is. He's a guy that likes to carry the puck and never shoot it, or never do much of anything worth while with the puck. I just don't see all that much to his game that is hard to find, nor is it irreplaceable. I think the exact opposite. Someone given the endless opportunity that hes been given, might have shown more. Hes OK, and hes definitely done way more than I thought he would after his sophomore season. I really can't get on board with people who think of him as a legitimate 2nd line option. He's found very little chemistry with anyone (i guess Grabner can be brought up as one). I go with Spooner over him any day. Yet I go with Hayes over Namestikov, whom I may regret being so down on, as hes got the skillset you want, but am unsure how good he actually is, away from Tampa. Hayes had excellent chemistry with Hags and Fast too. Then again, given the work they do, who wouldn't. However, Spooner also benefited from the defensive strengths and puck possession of Hayes. Hayes and Fast (or Grabs) could really create a balanced 3rd line with Spoons. Also, give Hayes some time with a new coach and system. He has not had any other coach in forever. AV and his college coach, that's it. Same is true for Vesey and he has much less NHL experience. I know many are down on Vesey and they may be right. Or he may be better and improve (as many do) in his 3rd year. Both players need to take the next step, both on and off the ice. Lastly, not reading too much into the end of the year, but Hayes said he would start shooting more and he did. And he got hot. He may have learned something. Now he needs to go all-in and put it all together this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giacomin Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 Added Note: I wouldn't rush to trade either player because I do not think we'll get the value we would from waiting. However, if either allows us to fill a need with a player or draft choice we covet, or wins us a hockey trade because the trading partner overvalues one of them, then trade either. Also, one aspect of Hayes game is severely undervalued is takeaways. He is dangerous in the opponents end defending the outlet with a good F1 partner or a good fast forechecker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giacomin Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 Dude, let's leave Howden (and Hajek) out of 2018 discussions. No matter how good they project, at the very least they need a half year (likely full year) in the A to develop properly. These players should not be rushed just because they have potential and are highly productive in their current league. Getting them into our new system via Hartford is a nice leap and we do not need to skip steps with these two, just because we have holes in NY. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giacomin Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 Not even sure Lias is ready, he could be much stronger and needs to work on his skating. I'm not sure about what they are doing in Tampa, but they have turned below avg skaters into strong ones. I think Chytil will make the jump and he'll keep learning D along the way. The D thing might have him on the wing to start. Especially if Zib, Names and Hayes are on the team. Add Lias and it is possible Chytil gets some exposure as a 2nd line winger. Looking forward to it, the kid has it. Dunny says Getzlaff, my first impression was Peter Stastny. Either way that makes him a 1C if we are lucky enough to see him realize that potential. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rosenvold Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 Added Note: I wouldn't rush to trade either player because I do not think we'll get the value we would from waiting. However, if either allows us to fill a need with a player or draft choice we covet, or wins us a hockey trade because the trading partner overvalues one of them, then trade either. Also, one aspect of Hayes game is severely undervalued is takeaways. He is dangerous in the opponents end defending the outlet with a good F1 partner or a good fast forechecker. Agreed. Hayes had a good season and his value could be high if the right teams are interested and believe they can re-sign him at a discount. Otherwise, it makes a lot of sense to bridge him and then see how he performs under a new coach. If he is on a cheap 2-year bridge deal, he could be very attractive for contenders at the 2019 or 2020 trade deadlines. Physical, scoring 3rd liners are always in demand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
torontonyr Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 Gotta give to get folks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drew a Penalty Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 I myself could care less about how Hayes uses his size. It cant be taught, he is what he is. He's a guy that likes to carry the puck and never shoot it, or never do much of anything worth while with the puck. I just don't see all that much to his game that is hard to find, nor is it irreplaceable. I think the exact opposite. Someone given the endless opportunity that hes been given, might have shown more. Hes OK, and hes definitely done way more than I thought he would after his sophomore season. I really can't get on board with people who think of him as a legitimate 2nd line option. He's found very little chemistry with anyone (i guess Grabner can be brought up as one). I go with Spooner over him any day. Yet I go with Hayes over Namestikov, whom I may regret being so down on, as hes got the skillset you want, but am unsure how good he actually is, away from Tampa. You know Hayes uses his size basically in the same way Joe Thronton does right? The same Joe Thronton whom you've insisted they acquire over the years. In a recent Athletic interview with Hayes, he cited Eric Staal, Rick Nash, and Joe Thornton as his favorite players growing up. That reads in his game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CBrowningPI Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 Dr. Jekkyl and Mr. Hayes. Sent from my [device_name] using http://Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile app powered by Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.wiskers Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 I would keep Hayes over Zibenajad because of Zibenajads injury history, which includes what 5 concussions?who knows how many concussions away is he from a forced retirement. And of course it depends on what we?re getting in return?Sam Bennett, Sam Reinhart... Especially is we?re talking Tavares as our #1 center. Sent from my iPad using Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile app powered by Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sod16 Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 Zibenajads injury history, which includes what 5 concussions—who knows how many concussions away is he from a forced retirement. This is something that has not been discussed a whole lot by the media (which these days pretty much means Larry Brooks because the other local coverage of the Rangers has grown limpid). It concerns me very much. Especially how sluggish he was after being cleared to return from the last one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 I agree. Unless he can be resigned dirt cheap, I don't think he would be missed as they have 2-3 guys that are almost on the cusp of being able to take his role. Kovy- JT- Zucc Kreider- Zib- Buch Spooner- Andersson/Chytil/Howden- Fast Roussel- Andersson/Chytil/Howden- FA/Hartford Deal Vesey, Hayes, and Namestikov for future draft pick and defensive help. Zucc, Buch, Chytil, Spooner, and Fast can be shuffled around anywhere in the lineup if the lines need tweaking. Spooner or Chytil could maybe be put into the 2nd line center spot, moving Zib to 1st or 2nd line RW.. Zib gives this team way more flexibility for the top six than Hayes IMO. My concerns are how Zibby will recover if he gets injured again. And, will Kovy be another player that we get one year too late? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.wiskers Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 With the whole CTE thing and lawsuits?I would figure NHL doctors will/would be leary of clearing players as fast as they use to. Sent from my iPad using Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile app powered by Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 Good Point Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatfrancesa Posted April 18, 2018 Share Posted April 18, 2018 My concerns are how Zibby will recover if he gets injured again. And, will Kovy be another player that we get one year too late? Yes on kovy. He’s not the same player he was when he left. Obviously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted April 19, 2018 Share Posted April 19, 2018 Yes on kovy. He’s not the same player he was when he left. Obviously. more than one year late on Kovulchuk imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Posted April 19, 2018 Share Posted April 19, 2018 Hayes had excellent chemistry with Hags and Fast too. Then again, given the work they do, who wouldn't. However, Spooner also benefited from the defensive strengths and puck possession of Hayes. Hayes and Fast (or Grabs) could really create a balanced 3rd line with Spoons. Also, give Hayes some time with a new coach and system. He has not had any other coach in forever. AV and his college coach, that's it. Same is true for Vesey and he has much less NHL experience. I know many are down on Vesey and they may be right. Or he may be better and improve (as many do) in his 3rd year. Both players need to take the next step, both on and off the ice. Lastly, not reading too much into the end of the year, but Hayes said he would start shooting more and he did. And he got hot. He may have learned something. Now he needs to go all-in and put it all together this year. And AV gave him the longest leash of any young player to come through the system. He definitely didn't have it rough here. Had quite a bit handed to him. He could have and probably should have been sent to Hartford on a few occasions. Most definitely last season (edit, i meant his second year, my how time has passed, hrs been here 4 seasons). Im not sure another coach would have the patience to give this guy the leeway he got here. Hes had chemistry with two speedsters, who dont put up many points. When paired with skill players, he absolutely stinks. I rush to trade him, because as i said his replacement is already in the system. Waiting to deal him, unsigned will be a lot harder. I just don't see a spot onnthe roster for this guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Posted April 19, 2018 Share Posted April 19, 2018 Dude, let's leave Howden (and Hajek) out of 2018 discussions. No matter how good they project, at the very least they need a half year (likely full year) in the A to develop properly. These players should not be rushed just because they have potential and are highly productive in their current league. Getting them into our new system via Hartford is a nice leap and we do not need to skip steps with these two, just because we have holes in NY. I think Howden has a fighting chance since they are slim at the lower line center position. Heck ALL line center positions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Posted April 19, 2018 Share Posted April 19, 2018 Not even sure Lias is ready, he could be much stronger and needs to work on his skating. I'm not sure about what they are doing in Tampa, but they have turned below avg skaters into strong ones. I think Chytil will make the jump and he'll keep learning D along the way. The D thing might have him on the wing to start. Especially if Zib, Names and Hayes are on the team. Add Lias and it is possible Chytil gets some exposure as a 2nd line winger. Looking forward to it, the kid has it. Dunny says Getzlaff, my first impression was Peter Stastny. Either way that makes him a 1C if we are lucky enough to see him realize that potential. Thats the point. No Hayes or Namestikov. Spooner, Chytil , Andersson and anyone else young, inexpensive and of course ready get a role while being cost effective. Making it possible to sign JT, and possible to use assets to obtain at least one NHL caliber D man. Has Chytil ever even played wing/ Why are we already shifting the current top prospects position before he even makes the team? When do people want to start making room for all the prospects we are so in love with? After they sign Kevin Hayes to a 5 year deal at 4.5+ a year? Rip off the band aid. Keep the better players. I myself don't think much of Hayes. Sorry. Im going to continue to suggest life without him here moving forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Posted April 19, 2018 Share Posted April 19, 2018 You know Hayes uses his size basically in the same way Joe Thronton does right? The same Joe Thronton whom you've insisted they acquire over the years. In a recent Athletic interview with Hayes, he cited Eric Staal, Rick Nash, and Joe Thornton as his favorite players growing up. That reads in his game. Yeah no. Please dont try to connect a future HOFer to Hayes. Please. Thornton has all world vision. Is a playoff point producer, doesn't handle the puck like Hayes and had (HAD) a history of playing physical. Thornton takes the puck to the net. Not to the corner. Thornton can put up 45 points in his sleep. Thornton actually possess a decent shot that he had success using. How many allstar games has Hayes been in? Olympic rosters? Worlds? Ross and Hart trophies? Seriously? If you read my comment, I wasn't complaining about Hayes lack of physical play. Im fine with him not being a bull. Its the head down and stick handle into the corner boards and not to the net that bothers me. Quite the opposite of what made Joe Thornton a house hold name. You think the average fan knows Kevin Hayes? Mike Richter, Curtis Joseph and Mike Vernon were some of my favorite players growing up. They all had different styles. Does that mean im as good as any of them? Do you honestly see Hayes becoming anything like ANY of those favorites of his? Is he going to put up an 80 point season? 40 goals? Be a physical and good skating generational talent??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatfrancesa Posted April 19, 2018 Share Posted April 19, 2018 He doesn’t have to be a hall of famer to earn 4.5m a year or be a quality player. There is no reason to rush to move him. If a good deal comes up sure trade him. Bottom line he is probably the most complete center this team has. He plays a decent two way game and does produce some offense. That probably says more about the rest of this team than anything but it’s true. Spooner and Namestnikov maybe better in the future but that’s a big leap of faith. They are as passive as Hayes maybe even more so. Zib can’t stay on the ice and when he does he facilitates nothing. He’s a goal scorer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
torontonyr Posted April 19, 2018 Share Posted April 19, 2018 Saying someone is good doesn't eliminate the necessity or possibility of trading them. In fact, it only highlights the advantages of doing so when you're in a rebuild. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.wiskers Posted April 19, 2018 Share Posted April 19, 2018 Yep, no one wants scrubs?it?s all about how much of a return you can get?and I mean quality not quantity. Sent from my iPad using Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile app powered by Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Future Posted April 19, 2018 Share Posted April 19, 2018 I think Howden has a fighting chance since they are slim at the lower line center position. Heck ALL line center positions. I mean, sure, he has a chance, but the Rangers have a ton of depth at C. Zib, Hayes, Namestnikov, Lias, Chytil is a lot of centers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
torontonyr Posted April 19, 2018 Share Posted April 19, 2018 Dolan “We need strong leadership in the locker room. I don’t think we had great leadership last year,” Dolan said. “I think maybe we added a burden to Ryan when we made him captain that affected him on and off the ice and kind of changed his own perception of himself. But he was a really good player for us for a long time. “And I know we need that one great player who can make a difference. We’ve identified some who might become available, and if they do, we want to be in position where we’re able to get them. We’re building a lot of data and analytics into our decision-making. And it’s important for the new coach to embrace that. “We’re committed to winning the Stanley Cup. I can’t give a timetable, but I also think we can compete for a playoff spot next year and sneak into seventh or eighth place,” he said. “We’re rebuilding but it doesn’t have to take forever.” Link: https://nypost.com/2018/04/18/rangers-owner-reveals-what-he-wants-in-the-next-coach/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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