[brooks] Rangers Getting Alarmingly Close to Forcing Jeff Gorton's Hand

[The Dude]

Oh now, after a mere 5 games into an 82 game season, there are those that want to dismantle the team? Dump Hank. Fire AV and replace him with Lindy, who BTW, many thought was a stupid hire in the first place. Or Scott Arniel who most ran into the ground as incompetent. I can't believe what I'm reading.

 

If this continues, seems to be what's being said. It's damage control thinking before it needs or if it needs to be done.

 

It's a reaction to the article in the OP. What do you expect? Sunshine and rainbow talk? It's the Rangers. The sky is always falling.

[AliveIn94]

Kreider Hayes and Miller have to make leaps this year. If not, we prob cannot afford to keep all if they don't get 50+ points at least and perform in the playoffs. Need a pure goal scorer out of those guys.

 

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[The Dude]

I fail to see how the St Louis trade was dumb, it got us 3 wins away from a championship, and a lucky break here or there, Rangers could've easily won that series in 5. The following season they were heavy favorites and a move for Yandle is the type of one piece move a team makes destined for another run. Rick Nash was acquired following a season where the team made the conference finals and also should've won if they could score. The go out and trade for him at the age of 28 while averaging 35 goals in his last 5 seasons with Columbus.

 

It sounds like a lot of bitching just for the sake of bitching

 

I see why there is complaining about the MSL and Yandle trades. They gave up a lot. Big overpayments.

 

I can't really say that I don't understand why they wanted those players. They fit big needs at the time. I wasn't a big fan of Yandle. Didn't think he fit or got to play HIS game, but they needed help on the blue line and the dude was a point producing and puck moving D man. Every team covets players with that skill set. MSL, the extra first rounder was crazy expensive for a guy who wanted out of Florida. But when you can add a HOF calibre player to your roster to put the puck in the net, you look into it..

 

I feel they paid in trade what Nash was worth. Nothing given away in that deal could have done anything better than what Nash has brought to this team. Like him or hate him, he's a presence and draws defenders to him. He's a legit scoring threat. Take him off this team and put those guys traded back in the lineup, they are extremely easy to defend and bring nothing close to the output Nash is capable of. Unless you are one of those who still think Dubinsky is going to pot 30 goals one day...

 

Had the Rangers won a cup, the overpayments would be forgotten.

[Kevin]

If Arniel takes over I may stop watching.

 

 

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I get the feeling that he is tied in with AV. If AV gets fired, Arniel goes too. Ruff takes over and brings in someone else to help him out.

[jjweimar]

IMO Rangers need a minimum of two wins out of the next four. 3 to 4 wins out of 10 isn't good but 1 or 2 and you need something drastic

[BlairBettsBlocksEverything]

I disagree, Drew. If they let this spin out that long, they run the risk of seriously losing the entire season. If you wait until they go 3-15-2, there's no coming back.

 

But like you mentioned, this is also an issue of inferior talent. They lack any threatening center depth or goal-scoring. The only game-breaking talent they do have is in net, and that varies night-to-night.

 

I'm starting to think the bill has arrived and there's no more stalling to avoid paying it. Missing the playoffs and strategically rebuilding is probably a requirement at this point.

 

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I think it's a bit premature top say that. There is still lots of talent on this team and it's still very early.

 

Pretty much every team will have a run like this at some point during their season and can still be playoff teams, even contenders. It just gets magnified more when you do it to start the year.

 

Yes we are 1-5. But we could have just as easily won almost all of those losses and were outplaying our opponents for good chunks of those. I think the frustration a team feels when guys aren't finishing keeps snowballing until they can break out of it.

[Blue Heaven]

I think it's a bit premature top say that. There is still lots of talent on this team and it's still very early.

 

Pretty much every team will have a run like this at some point during their season and can still be playoff teams, even contenders. It just gets magnified more when you do it to start the year.

 

Yes we are 1-5. But we could have just as easily won almost all of those losses and were outplaying our opponents for good chunks of those. I think the frustration a team feels when guys aren't finishing keeps snowballing until they can break out of it.

 

Its getting close to panicking especially with Pitt/NYI/NSH the next 3 games, and the Rangers playing 6 of the next 7 at home. Can you imagine starting 1-8? Quite possible.

[LONG LONG LONG TIME FAN]

If this continues, seems to be what's being said. It's damage control thinking before it needs or if it needs to be done.

 

It's a reaction to the article in the OP. What do you expect? Sunshine and rainbow talk? It's the Rangers. The sky is always falling.

 

Reaction to an article by Larry Kooks? Oh. Now it all makes sense. Dismantle the team on his say so.

[BlairBettsBlocksEverything]

Its getting close to panicking especially with Pitt/NYI/NSH the next 3 games, and the Rangers playing 6 of the next 7 at home. Can you imagine starting 1-8? Quite possible.

 

yeah, i think we are teetering on the edge of panic hour but I wouldn't say we are there just yet.

 

Lets see how these games play out. I do think we are still a better team than most of this division. This year has gotten off to a weird start across the league but it'll come back to earth soon enough.

[Dunny]

Looks like Desharnais up to 2nd line, Buch to 4th in practice today.

 

LOL

 

I'll take 6 Richard Matvichuks any day if it would allow us to employ actual NHL Centremen. This is close to fiasco level for a team with any notion of contention.

[ThirtyONE]

Looks like Desharnais up to 2nd line, Buch to 4th in practice today.

 

LOL

 

I'll take 6 Richard Matvichuks any day if it would allow us to employ actual NHL Centremen. This is close to fiasco level for a team with any notion of contention.

 

Buch on the 4th line is a fucking joke. I'm sorry. Why is AV's solution to demote the young players? I seriously don't think I can watch this team right now. Who the fuck am I supposed to be rooting for? Desharnais? On the 2nd line? At this point I'm hoping for more losses so that changes can happen.

[Dunny]

Also, saw an excerpt on Twitter from Avery's book and I guess Hank has the biggest Dong in the league, which, of course he does.

 

Also note: Where's the reports from rink thread?

[Blue Heaven]

Also, saw an excerpt on Twitter from Avery's book and I guess Hank has the biggest Dong in the league, which, of course he does.

 

Also note: Where's the reports from rink thread?

 

Tried to get the book on Saturday but it was sold out at the one store that put it on the shelf early.

Pre-ordered it today.

[Bugg]

Buch on the 4th line is a fucking joke. I'm sorry. Why is AV's solution to demote the young players? I seriously don't think I can watch this team right now. Who the fuck am I supposed to be rooting for? Desharnais? On the 2nd line? At this point I'm hoping for more losses so that changes can happen.

Desharnais had as much ice time vs. Devs as ZIb. Hard to understand.

[Shane Falco]

Amazing how they went from being deep at center to scrambling to find some.

 

This team has a ton of work to do. As it stands you can't even say they've improved on defense. It seems that way on paper but not what we've seen so far on the ice. Make a trade and get a legit center. Teams got plenty of wingers. Throw one up in a deal. This is a joke.

[Giacomin]

Also, saw an excerpt on Twitter from Avery's book and I guess Hank has the biggest Dong in the league, which, of course he does.

 

Also note: Where's the reports from rink thread?

 

Of course he does, he's the King.

 

So Avery spends his time in other team's locker rooms? And checked these things out??

 

As I said before, I no longer believe AV can lead this group to the Finals. Yet, the Center situation is on mgmt as a whole. Mgmt knew:

* they wanted to "retool on the fly"

* the expansion rules and the chaos/opportunity it would create

* they wanted to trade Step and did not get a top line C they could count on, in return

* it was likely we'd lose a C in expansion

 

Yet, Mgmt did nothing except bring in an iffy reclamation project in Desharnais. Iffy because he can't play D and has a size deficiency, so his fit is already limited. Essentially he has to be a point generator to be effective. It was a real leap of faith to rely on him to completely rejuvenate his offensive game. I doubt Gorton was foolish enough to think our 7th pick in a weaker top-end draft was going to play a pivotal role in his first year or two, regardless of him having a rounded game. So what did they expect?

 

Regardless, I doubt (with reason) that AV is creative enough to change the team's approach and systems to make a sustainable difference. Conditioning is a concern, practices need more of an overhaul, development and skills work seems neglected. Buch has started strong, but struggled in his last game, so of course he's demoted all the way to the 4th. Appears that is the only way AV knows how to deal with a young player underperforming. Isolated, this incident is nothing. Coach is gonna shake things up at 1-5 to find a winning formula. However, it is time for the coach to shake up the way he has been doing things the last few years. Some critical self analysis is overdue.

 

AV can not afford to lose 4 of the next 5. Neither can the team.

[Slobberknocker]

its getting late early

 

hopefully they get some home cooking here.

[Giacomin]

Due a contract

Current deal expires offseason 2019, 2 seasons remaining

Current cap hit $4.7 for 6 years sign on July 8, 2013

Expected cap hit $7m+ 7y

 

Rangers history:

Girardi, Staal tenures - finales for both.

- Eventual wear down - mostly within the last 2/3 years for both

History of Rangers players breaking down around 30 years old:

- Staal is 30, 689 (reg) + 104 (playoffs) games played, (523 total 2 years ago) 2 concussions

- Girardi 33, 788 +122 games played (637 total 2 seasons ago, age 31)

- Klein 32, 627 + 73

- McD: 467 + 96 (563 total games played)

- - Turned 28 on June 13

History of rangers players breaking down (guys that aged with the rangers, or came here around ~30): Drury (34), Gomez(29 trade), Richards (just turned 34 at buyout), Girardi, Staal, Redden (last game as a ranger at 32)

~33 years old, thats 5 more seasons… sure, but its 3 years into a 7 year deal. Potential 4 years of $7m left on the books. Isnt this the exact problem thats been repeating season after season, the achilles heal of the rangers cap space? All contracts bought out with 3-5 years remaining

 

The above portion of your notes needs to be given great consideration. Especially concussion history.

 

If any fan or mgmt want to trade McD, it is not really about trading McD. Mostly, it should be motivated by a target in mind, on a team that would benefit from McD and sign him long term. I like one win-win trade, where trading McD makes sense. The maniacal Toronto fans love to discuss acquiring that #1 Dman. On the HF and Toronto boards they know either Nylander or Marner would do it. They know Drew D, Keith and others are past their prime. They like McD. I love those two players. Both can play C. You have to give to get. No one is giving away their #1 D and not getting a young top line player in return.

 

Toronto's choice of Nylander or Marner. The Rangers might have to add something to this one, but not so much as to make it prohibitive.

 

Not pointing to you Josh, but I'm not interested in trading McD for RNH (who I like) or even Duchene. Tavares will be an FA and I don't think we should sign him to a 7-8 year 10 mil deal even if we don't give up assets.

[Rangers4Life]

The above portion of your notes needs to be given great consideration. Also some injury/concussion history is in the background.

 

If any fan or mgmt want to trade McD, it is not really about trading McD. Mostly, it should be motivated by a target in mind, on a team that would benefit from McD and sign him long term. I like one win-win trade, where trading McD makes sense. The maniacal Toronto fans love to discuss acquiring that #1 Dman. On the HF and Toronto boards they know either Nylander or Marner would do it. They know Drew D, Keith and others are past their prime. They like McD. I love those two players. Both can play C. You have to give to get. No one is giving away their #1 D and not getting a young top line player in return.

 

Toronto's choice of Nylander or Marner. The Rangers might have to add something to this one, but not so much as to make it prohibitive.

 

Not pointing to you Josh, but I'm not interested in trading McD for RNH (who I like) or even Duchene. Tavares will be an FA and I don't think we should sign him to a 7-8 year 10 mil deal even if we don't give up assets.

 

I agree with all of this.

[Giacomin]

Just to elaborate a little more:

We need a team that need D or a #1 LHD and interested in trading a C: ruling out teams like Nash, Anaheim, Minn, SJ, Chicago, Tampa, LA, Calg among others

 

A team that can afford a resign and is contending: ruling out zona, buff, vegas

 

Teams he'd want to resign possibly ruling out western Ca teams

 

Then you can probably rule out the Isles, Devils, Pens, Caps, Flyers

 

Not much left.

 

So let's be specific about trades, especially big ones. Otherwise, trading McD could range the spectrum of making a lot of sense to being completely ridiculous.

[LONG LONG LONG TIME FAN]

Trading the Capt. would be idiocy.

[josh]

The above portion of your notes needs to be given great consideration. Especially concussion history.

 

If any fan or mgmt want to trade McD, it is not really about trading McD. Mostly, it should be motivated by a target in mind, on a team that would benefit from McD and sign him long term. I like one win-win trade, where trading McD makes sense. The maniacal Toronto fans love to discuss acquiring that #1 Dman. On the HF and Toronto boards they know either Nylander or Marner would do it. They know Drew D, Keith and others are past their prime. They like McD. I love those two players. Both can play C. You have to give to get. No one is giving away their #1 D and not getting a young top line player in return.

 

Toronto's choice of Nylander or Marner. The Rangers might have to add something to this one, but not so much as to make it prohibitive.

 

Not pointing to you Josh, but I'm not interested in trading McD for RNH (who I like) or even Duchene. Tavares will be an FA and I don't think we should sign him to a 7-8 year 10 mil deal even if we don't give up assets.

 

I agree, McDonagh has a history of concussions and shoulder injuries... one thing I mentioned about him constantly is his inability to appropriately take a hit. He turns and puts himself in terrible positions on a nightly basis. We've already seen him get absolutely wrecked a number of times already this season.

 

 

we'd obviously need more than just an RNH, or even Duchene for him.

If he was put up for auction, I think we'd see some pretty insane offers.

 

I'm not necessarily condoning trading him either... but, no one is exempt from trade possibilities.

[josh]

Trading the Capt. would be idiocy.

 

Callahan - traded

Drury - bought out

Jagr - not given a contract

 

its not like its far fetched.

[Rangers4Life]

I think he means the player more than the actual captain, or at least I hope.

[fletch]

i can’t support trading any key defensemen at this point, especially McD. Lundqvist is showing less and less ability to save the day when there is a sh*t show in front of him. take away a key defenseman and this team is unwatchable and not a threat for the playoffs.

 

rebuild in the offseason, in season trades will only net you eighty or ninety cents for your dollar