Dreger Rangers Taking Calls on Kaapo Kakko

[Phil]

Just now, Pete said:

Or...hear me out here...Just trade futures for a 1RW.

 

Correct. My preference as well. I've literally said this a few times now. I'm not pushing Kakko out the door. I'm just not letting him stop me from getting a guy I really like.

[Pete]

1 minute ago, Phil said:

 

1. Yes, moves up and down the lineup as needed. Short-term injuries or line shuffling without dramatic drop-offs in team production. Kakko doesn't bring this (right now). Maybe he will in the future.

2. OK

3. OK, but he doesn't. Takes away from the idea of him being a "phenomenal" 3RW.

4. Once. Not consistently. It's looking like an outlier, too. Pacing 14 goals. Career average is 15 goals per 82 games.

He's 23! Nothing is an outlier! He's developing, he has 4 seasons on his hockey card. Not 14. The thing that's stopping his production is health. He's on played 82 games once.

[Pete]

1 minute ago, Phil said:

 

Correct. My preference as well. I've literally said this a few times now. I'm not pushing Kakko out the door. I'm just not letting him stop me from getting a guy I really like.

I don't think anyone is. Would I trade him fro Tuch? Yes. Vatrano? No.

[LindG1000]

8 minutes ago, Pete said:

I don't think anyone is. Would I trade him fro Tuch? Yes. Vatrano? No.

If Kakko were the piece holding up Alex Tuch coming to NYC, I'd pack his bags myself.

 

And I'm a foolish true believer in the dude.

[jsm7302]

7 minutes ago, Pete said:

I don't think anyone is. Would I trade him fro Tuch? Yes. Vatrano? No.

That's a super reasonable way to frame it. My concerns are dealing him for another RW is plugging one hole to create another. They gotta find depth not a stronger top 6 and weaker bottom 6. Glad I'm not GM. Prices are akin to gas prices this year, super high.

[JHS]

15 minutes ago, Pete said:

Like I said, I respect where you're coming from, but I disagree. His value will never be lower than it is now, anyway. So there really is no reason to trade him especially when the team is lacking RWs anyway.

I don't think you are right about your assumption.  Here's the thing-  I imagine there are several GM's who still believe Kappo has some excuses left for why he has not produced like expected( rookie season, not given a real chance with top 6 forwards...) but now that those excuses are going away he's slowly revealing how bad he is-- so from that standpoint, he may have some value left.  If they play him in a top 6 role and he gets maybe 25 points than he's exposed and those GM's who may think he can do something in the top 6 role on their team won't be able to justify taking a chance.  The time to trade him is now.

[Pete]

2 minutes ago, JHS said:

I don't think you are right about your assumption.  Here's the thing-  I imagine there are several GM's who still believe Kappo has some excuses left for why he has not produced like expected( rookie season, not given a real chance with top 6 forwards...) but now that those excuses are going away he's slowly revealing how bad he is-- so from that standpoint, he may have some value left.  If they play him in a top 6 role and he gets maybe 25 points than he's exposed and those GM's who may think he can do something in the top 6 role on their team won't be able to justify taking a chance.  The time to trade him is now.

I'm not assuming anything, but we can agree to disagree.

[Phil]

11 minutes ago, Pete said:

I don't think anyone is. Would I trade him fro Tuch? Yes. Vatrano? No.

 

We're in total alignment then. This is just a semantic argument over how we describe a player. It's why I suggested before that we all agree he's a good (no need for dramatizing pretext) third line player who's cheap (for now) and defensively responsible.

[Phil]

2 minutes ago, JHS said:

I don't think you are right about your assumption.  Here's the thing-  I imagine there are several GM's who still believe Kappo has some excuses left for why he has not produced like expected( rookie season, not given a real chance with top 6 forwards...) but now that those excuses are going away he's slowly revealing how bad he is-- so from that standpoint, he may have some value left.  If they play him in a top 6 role and he gets maybe 25 points than he's exposed and those GM's who may think he can do something in the top 6 role on their team won't be able to justify taking a chance.  The time to trade him is now.

 

This is only true if your primary focus is maximizing his value as an asset. Even I'm not there, and I don't even like this player very much at all.

 

The focus should be on winning a Cup, because that's the focus of the team. He can definitely help them win there... just not as a top-six player.

[JHS]

5 hours ago, Phil said:

 

This is only true if your primary focus is maximizing his value as an asset. Even I'm not there, and I don't even like this player very much at all.

 

The focus should be on winning a Cup, because that's the focus of the team. He can definitely help them win there... just not as a top-six player.

He can help them more by not being on the roster and bringing them back a top 6 wing.  He’s basically been completely invisible again tonight in the first half of the Florida game tonight.  Like he’s done absolutely nothing.

[Sharpshooter]

Oh, good god. lol

 

Anyway, good chance Kakko is in Anaheim or something by the end of the week. I kind of hope not, but we shall see.

Edited March 5 by Sharpshooter

[Pete]

51 minutes ago, Sharpshooter said:

Oh, good god. lol

 

Anyway, good chance Kakko is in Anaheim or something by the end of the week. I kind of hope not, but we shall see.

I would actually be really surprised if he was traded. 

[RichieNextel305]

28 minutes ago, Pete said:

I would actually be really surprised if he was traded. 

Agreed. At least right now.

 

If shit goes off the tracks during the playoffs, I literally don’t think there is one player on the roster who is safe.

 

But in the next couple of days? I just don’t see it. Not for what is out there right now. The only name I’ve heard that I would have no issue including him in a deal for is Tuch. But I just don’t see that happening right now.

[RangersIn7]

31 minutes ago, Pete said:

I would actually be really surprised if he was traded. 

 

1 minute ago, RichieNextel305 said:

Agreed. At least right now.

 

If shit goes off the tracks during the playoffs, I literally don’t think there is one player on the roster who is safe.

 

But in the next couple of days? I just don’t see it. Not for what is out there right now. The only name I’ve heard that I would have no issue including him in a deal for is Tuch. But I just don’t see that happening right now.

Now. Yes. 
 

In the summer. No. 

[Pete]

9 minutes ago, RangersIn7 said:

 

Now. Yes. 
 

In the summer. No. 

Depends on his playoff.

[RangersIn7]

Just now, Pete said:

Depends on his playoff.

100%

 

I don’t know that he goes anyway, and I think it’s probably a mistake.

 

But if you’ve got a hockey trade for a quality player go ahead. 
 

 

[Flynn]

Kakko has not lived up the the billing he had. Kakko is not the right guy to play RW on the 1st line.. 

 

But I see a lot of chatter about his being non existent.. That I can't agree with. He's not scoring, but he's noticeable. he chases the hell out of the puck, he will use his body (the reverse hit last night was a beauty). Different position, but he gives me a lot of the same vibes as Manny Malhotra. Not a star by any means, and not what you thought you were drafting. But the guy does do things that winning hockey teams need.   

 

If you can turn him into a great asset, do it in a heartbeat. But ignoring what he can add rather than focusing on what he will never became is the wrong lens IMO. Just because he isn't going to be a 40 goal scorer doesn't mean he can't fill a very valuable role. All that said, if someone wants to overpay in trade, I'll help pack his shit. 

[Pete]

2 minutes ago, Flynn said:

Kakko has not lived up the the billing he had. Kakko is not the right guy to play RW on the 1st line.. 

 

But I see a lot of chatter about his being non existent.. That I can't agree with. He's not scoring, but he's noticeable. he chases the hell out of the puck, he will use his body (the reverse hit last night was a beauty). Different position, but he gives me a lot of the same vibes as Manny Malhotra. Not a star by any means, and not what you thought you were drafting. But the guy does do things that winning hockey teams need.   

 

If you can turn him into a great asset, do it in a heartbeat. But ignoring what he can add rather than focusing on what he will never became is the wrong lens IMO. Just because he isn't going to be a 40 goal scorer doesn't mean he can't fill a very valuable role. All that said, if someone wants to overpay in trade, I'll help pack his shit. 

[Ozzy]

23 minutes ago, Flynn said:

Kakko has not lived up the the billing he had. Kakko is not the right guy to play RW on the 1st line.. 

 

But I see a lot of chatter about his being non existent.. That I can't agree with. He's not scoring, but he's noticeable. he chases the hell out of the puck, he will use his body (the reverse hit last night was a beauty). Different position, but he gives me a lot of the same vibes as Manny Malhotra. Not a star by any means, and not what you thought you were drafting. But the guy does do things that winning hockey teams need.   

 

If you can turn him into a great asset, do it in a heartbeat. But ignoring what he can add rather than focusing on what he will never became is the wrong lens IMO. Just because he isn't going to be a 40 goal scorer doesn't mean he can't fill a very valuable role. All that said, if someone wants to overpay in trade, I'll help pack his shit. 

 

Dead on, Flynner!

[Phil]

Quote

We are told that Anaheim GM Pat Verbeek is demanding a heavy price for Vatrano, who has one additional year left on his contract and we are also told that Drury is balking at sacrificing a first-rounder to bring No. 77 back to New York two years after his role in the run to the conference finals.

 

And no, Kakko most certainly is not in play for a deal anything like this.

 

https://nypost.com/2024/03/05/sports/matt-rempe-may-be-out-of-lineup-at-deadline-with-rangers-in-alex-wennberg-talks/

[LindG1000]

So, let's close that door then.

 

Also, just gonna say it....make the goddamn pick conditional on making the ECF like you know you want to and get the deal done for Frankie V, Dru. 

[BrooksBurner]

28 minutes ago, LindG1000 said:

So, let's close that door then.

 

Also, just gonna say it....make the goddamn pick conditional on making the ECF like you know you want to and get the deal done for Frankie V, Dru. 

 

I'm ok with a 1st for Vatrano half retained if it carries a strong conditional. In the McDonagh trade, the Rangers accepted a 2nd round pick the following year that would convert to a 1st round pick if Tampa won the year of the trade or the year after. That sounds reasonable here. 2025 1st round pick conditional on the Rangers winning a Cup this year or next. Otherwise, it's a 2nd. None of this ECF bullshit. Not good enough. Already fucked us with Copp.

Edited March 5 by BrooksBurner

[LindG1000]

4 minutes ago, BrooksBurner said:

 

I'm ok with a 1st for Vatrano half retained if it carries a strong conditional. In the McDonagh trade, the Rangers accepted a 2nd round pick the following year that would convert to a 1st round pick if Tampa won the year of the trade or the year after. That sounds reasonable here. 2025 1st round pick conditional on the Rangers winning a Cup this year or next. Otherwise, it's a 2nd. None of this ECF bullshit. Not good enough. Already fucked us with Copp.

 

I'd rather give this years pick tbh. Both drafts are very top-heavy, but we're clear enough on there being little difference between 10 and 55 in this draft. 

 

That, and a general manager/president never looks at it that way. The ECF conversion is paying a pick that has a 15% likelihood of being a decent NHLer - not a star, a player - for a player and at minimum six home games of playoff revenue. In 2022, that was nearly $5m a game. Might be closer to $6 this year. The Rangers would look at that as if it were trading #29 overall for Vatrano and $36m. More, if they're a top seed and these series' go long, which....we're the Rangers. They do.

 

And that, my friend, is a trade they make every single day.

[JHS]

1 hour ago, Flynn said:

Kakko has not lived up the the billing he had. Kakko is not the right guy to play RW on the 1st line.. 

 

But I see a lot of chatter about his being non existent.. That I can't agree with. He's not scoring, but he's noticeable. he chases the hell out of the puck, he will use his body (the reverse hit last night was a beauty). Different position, but he gives me a lot of the same vibes as Manny Malhotra. Not a star by any means, and not what you thought you were drafting. But the guy does do things that winning hockey teams need.   

 

If you can turn him into a great asset, do it in a heartbeat. But ignoring what he can add rather than focusing on what he will never became is the wrong lens IMO. Just because he isn't going to be a 40 goal scorer doesn't mean he can't fill a very valuable role. All that said, if someone wants to overpay in trade, I'll help pack his shit. 

This is very true-  when I say he's non existent or invisible I mean it from a point production standpoint-- and for a second overall pick, the expectation is points.  He's an infinitely serviceable bottom 6 guy but those are not second overall picks most of the time.  That's why I say his value is most heightened by trading him now while some organizations may think he can live up to his second overall status before he proves to everyone that he is not worth taking a flyer on!

 

[JJ in VA]

This is like Laffy all over again.   #1 overall is a bust, blah blah blah.    Now Laffy is just starting to hum and its year four.

#2 overall, gotta trade him.  Slow the roll dudes.  KK will be fine if you continue to coach him up and let him grow.

 

It's only been since 1994, what's the fargin hurry right !

 

Personally, I like KK and think he will be a star.   Once again, I look at this team and see tremendous upside.  Plus, I think we can win now with just a few tweaks.   

 

LGR

JJ