Targets to Break the Rangers' Homogeneity?

[Drew a Penalty]

Or that Gauthier guy...

 

If he were a better player with the puck, he'd be ideal. I'd still prefer Kravtsov there.

[josh]

Yeah but isn't that what they've been trying to drill into Kakkos head? He USED TO slow down the game, now he's mucking it up and winning puck battles along the boards. You know, like they want him to do... to make him better than the 2nd overall offensive threat they drafted.

yeah i don't know where Kakko slowing down the game came from.

He used to hesitate with the puck, but isn't a "slow down the pace" player

[BrooksBurner]

If he were a better player with the puck, he'd be ideal. I'd still prefer Kravtsov there.

 

Panarin and Strome are the puck possesors on that line. They need someone good without the puck, not necessarily with it.

 

I agree though. I see what Kravtsov can bring there. He seemed to have a knack for finding a nice pocket for a shot.

[Drew a Penalty]

Panarin and Strome are the puck possesors on that line. They need someone good without the puck, not necessarily with it.

 

I agree though. I see what Kravtsov can bring there. He seemed to have a knack for finding a nice pocket for a shot.

 

He still has to be the one getting the puck in the corners and passing it off. I don't trust Goat to do that with players of their skill level.

[BrooksBurner]

He still has to be the one getting the puck in the corners and passing it off. I don't trust Goat to do that with players of their skill level.

 

Not sure I agree with the premise. Those guys carry the puck over the blue line. I care more about having a player who can find an open spot to sit and wait to receive a pass for a shot, and a willingness to go to the net. I think Kravtsov possesses both traits.

[Drew a Penalty]

Not sure I agree with the premise. Those guys carry the puck over the blue line. I care more about having a player who can find an open spot to sit and wait to receive a pass for a shot, and a willingness to go to the net. I think Kravtsov possesses both traits.

 

They're not always carrying. If you're playing a dump and chase game, which they often do and will have to against teams that stack the blue line, you're gonna need someone who has the speed and ability to distribute once they get the puck. I trust Kravtsov to do that. I don't really trust Gauthier to on a top line. Kravtsov is useful in that he has the speed and defensive ability to be the first man in on the forecheck and the first man back on the backcheck.

[BrooksBurner]

They're not always carrying. If you're playing a dump and chase game, which they often do and will have to against teams that stack the blue line, you're gonna need someone who has the speed and ability to distribute once they get the puck. I trust Kravtsov to do that. I don't really trust Gauthier to on a top line. Kravtsov is useful in that he has the speed and defensive ability to be the first man in on the forecheck and the first man back on the backcheck.

 

I haven't seen anything to make me think that's Kravtsov's game. But hey, we get to the same result (play Kravtsov with those guys), just different paths to get there.

[The Dude]

There's a difference between slowing down the game and literally being a slow player. By slowing down the game he's searching for a play and trying to control the game on his stick. That doesn't work when you have Panarin and Strome who already do that. They need someone who's quick and on top of pucks. That's not Kakko's game.

 

It is now.. That's my point. They had him working and battling instead of dangling. He doesn't carry the puck anymore. It's like it's been removed from his brain.

 

Christ, if I were to read another post on how much better Kakko looked because of how he battled along the boards and how his production wasn't an issue as long as he did the digging and grew as a player.... Why turn him into that then? Why are people shooting loads over the fact that they changed his style of play away from the exact reason that made him the 2nd overall pick?

 

I'm at the point in thinking Kakko doesn't HAVE a game anymore.

[The Dude]

If he were a better player with the puck, he'd be ideal. I'd still prefer Kravtsov there.

 

Weird. I think he's pretty good with the puck. Especially when he takes it to the middle of the ice and straight to the net. I'd say that's the least of his problems. He doesn't do enough along the boards and I don't know if he has much of a shot if he's not on the doorstep or on a break.

[Drew a Penalty]

It is now.. That's my point. They had him working and battling instead of dangling. He doesn't carry the puck anymore. It's like it's been removed from his brain.

 

Christ, if I were to read another post on how much better Kakko looked because of how he battled along the boards and how his production wasn't an issue as long as he did the digging and grew as a player.... Why turn him into that then? Why are people shooting loads over the fact that they changed his style of play away from the exact reason that made him the 2nd overall pick?

 

I'm at the point in thinking Kakko doesn't HAVE a game anymore.

 

Kakko needed to improve his game because he needed an alternative to try and dangling through players. He hasn't had the footspeed or puck skills to break into the offensive zone the way he did in Finland and on other larger ice surfaces. The point of adapting his game was to help him overcome those deficiencies. You can't keep attacking the same way. He's more competent now, and his underlying stats show him to be a strong contributor defensively, but that doesn't mean he fits on that line. Just because he's better at puck retrieval now doesn't mean it's his strong suit.

[Drew a Penalty]

Weird. I think he's pretty good with the puck. Especially when he takes it to the middle of the ice and straight to the net. I'd say that's the least of his problems. He doesn't do enough along the boards and I don't know if he has much of a shot if he's not on the doorstep or on a break.

 

How many times did he carry the puck towards the middle of the ice? Did it even reach ten times? I like that he powers to the net, but that's not remotely what we're looking for in this role and he doesn't do it frequently enough. He scored two goals all season and one of them was scored in that fashion. It's not as though he was being told to play a different way. How many times did they mention on the broadcasts that the Rangers wanted Gauthier to make better use of his size?

[TwoMinutesForNothing]

Or that Gauthier guy...

 

Hadn't thought about him in a while. This makes me realize how much Gallant will love him. He goes from unwanted by soft ass Quinn to ideal piece for Gallant.

[Scott]

Imo if Gauthier is still here an even sniffing getting playing time on the top two lines Drury has failed miserably this off-season and or the roster has be ravaged with injuries. Barring that going into the season if he's in consideration for that role I would call it a massive failure.

[TwoMinutesForNothing]

I would have considered him a solid 4th line option. Not top 6.

[josh]

People are under the impression that Quinn was fired and will be replaced by a coach preaching dump and chase to the skill guys?

[Drew a Penalty]

People are under the impression that Quinn was fired and will be replaced by a coach preaching dump and chase to the skill guys?

 

People are still under the impression you can play just a skill game after watching these playoffs?

[Phil]

It's almost like the answer lies between the extremes, eh? Crazy how that works.

 

No one is asking Panarin to dump it in and chase. What's being asked is that an option to chase be added to his line so it can't be neutered by the Islanders, Canadiens, and other tight defensive clubs who can stifle one-dimensional offensive lines.

[The Dude]

How many times did he carry the puck towards the middle of the ice? Did it even reach ten times? I like that he powers to the net, but that's not remotely what we're looking for in this role and he doesn't do it frequently enough. He scored two goals all season and one of them was scored in that fashion. It's not as though he was being told to play a different way. How many times did they mention on the broadcasts that the Rangers wanted Gauthier to make better use of his size?

 

Jesus. I saw him do it 37 times. Ok? Do you want a list of the times?

 

Game 22 he beat two defend......... Seriously?

That's his game. That what he was brought in to do. It's no secret. It's what makes many drool over his potential. Such skills go to waste when the player muddles on the 4th line with lesser players and an inability to try to be creative because they will get benched.

 

With what Spooner said in that interview about Quinn along with how they wanted Kakko to stay away from dangling makes you wonder if they indeed DID tell him to play a different way. They've done it to the 2nd overall pick, why wouldn't they do it to this meat head? Considering he was on the 4th line and had size, you'd think they asked him to be more of a board worker and grind....... Like they did to Kakko.

 

You really think the coaching staff wouldn't ask players to play a different way? Seems that's all they did. Kakko, Hajek, Gauthier, Andersson. Is it any wonder that players of any age come to the Rangers and add spark and a change of pace, only to become more of the same 3 weeks later? Is that the player or the coaches mentality setting in?

 

I don't understand how people are ok with coaches not being able to adapt a game plan around players attributes and skills . Instead they change the player into some completely different type of player. It makes sense for players who are on their last chance to make it in the league. Not for a guy drafted 2 summers ago.

 

Imo Kakko is ruined. Instead of giving the 18-20 year old version of what they drafted, adapt to the quicker pace and figure out how to make HIS playing style work, they made him into Jesper Fast.

 

You don't draft a dangler, with what is considered all world scoring talent and make him into Jesper fucking Fast.

 

We've seen MANY scorers with the label "poor foot speed " adapt and overcome that problem. I see less and less of a 2nd overall pick with each passing day Kakko isn't dangling.

[Drew a Penalty]

Jesus. I saw him do it 37 times. Ok? Do you want a list of the times?

 

Game 22 he beat two defend......... Seriously?

That's his game. That what he was brought in to do. It's no secret. It's what makes many drool over his potential. Such skills go to waste when the player muddles on the 4th line with lesser players and an inability to try to be creative because they will get benched.

 

With what Spooner said in that interview about Quinn along with how they wanted Kakko to stay away from dangling makes you wonder if they indeed DID tell him to play a different way. They've done it to the 2nd overall pick, why wouldn't they do it to this meat head? Considering he was on the 4th line and had size, you'd think they asked him to be more of a board worker and grind....... Like they did to Kakko.

 

You really think the coaching staff wouldn't ask players to play a different way? Seems that's all they did. Kakko, Hajek, Gauthier, Andersson. Is it any wonder that players of any age come to the Rangers and add spark and a change of pace, only to become more of the same 3 weeks later? Is that the player or the coaches mentality setting in?

 

I don't understand how people are ok with coaches not being able to adapt a game plan around players attributes and skills . Instead they change the player into some completely different type of player. It makes sense for players who are on their last chance to make it in the league. Not for a guy drafted 2 summers ago.

 

Imo Kakko is ruined. Instead of giving the 18-20 year old version of what they drafted, adapt to the quicker pace and figure out how to make HIS playing style work, they made him into Jesper Fast.

 

You don't draft a dangler, with what is considered all world scoring talent and make him into Jesper fucking Fast.

 

We've seen MANY scorers with the label "poor foot speed " adapt and overcome that problem. I see less and less of a 2nd overall pick with each passing day Kakko isn't dangling.

 

That’s a very long winded way of saying that you can’t understand why players would be asked to adapt their games when their games weren’t working as is. Kakko didn’t have the speed or timing to go through people. They gave him alternatives. Gauthier played like a perimeter player and did most of his producing in the AHL on the PP in front of the net. They wanted him to play a heavier and straight-forward game. Andersson was a two-way player. He didn’t want to play a defensive role to the point he pouted through an AHL stint where they allowed him to play exclusively offense. Hajek has good edge work but otherwise sucks so I’m not even going to bother there.

[The Dude]

People are under the impression that Quinn was fired and will be replaced by a coach preaching dump and chase to the skill guys?

 

I'm expecting a coach who will build lines that do different things. A coach who utilizes his weapons to the best of their attributes. Not really straying from what they do best.

 

So if you had a player that liked to carry the puck, you would have your coach put him with atleast one forward who can draw attention by just being on the ice and then you add some beef to the line. A net crasher or a guy to plug along the glass. You don't make your puck carrier abandon his game and plug along the boards.

 

This is where I hope Gallant stays to his Word and gives players roles. This way, they really don't have to force the "jack of all trades" onto players that have no business taking on such roles.

[LindG1000]

Jesus. I saw him do it 37 times. Ok? Do you want a list of the times?

 

Game 22 he beat two defend......... Seriously?

That's his game. That what he was brought in to do. It's no secret. It's what makes many drool over his potential. Such skills go to waste when the player muddles on the 4th line with lesser players and an inability to try to be creative because they will get benched.

 

With what Spooner said in that interview about Quinn along with how they wanted Kakko to stay away from dangling makes you wonder if they indeed DID tell him to play a different way. They've done it to the 2nd overall pick, why wouldn't they do it to this meat head? Considering he was on the 4th line and had size, you'd think they asked him to be more of a board worker and grind....... Like they did to Kakko.

 

You really think the coaching staff wouldn't ask players to play a different way? Seems that's all they did. Kakko, Hajek, Gauthier, Andersson. Is it any wonder that players of any age come to the Rangers and add spark and a change of pace, only to become more of the same 3 weeks later? Is that the player or the coaches mentality setting in?

 

I don't understand how people are ok with coaches not being able to adapt a game plan around players attributes and skills . Instead they change the player into some completely different type of player. It makes sense for players who are on their last chance to make it in the league. Not for a guy drafted 2 summers ago.

 

Imo Kakko is ruined. Instead of giving the 18-20 year old version of what they drafted, adapt to the quicker pace and figure out how to make HIS playing style work, they made him into Jesper Fast.

 

You don't draft a dangler, with what is considered all world scoring talent and make him into Jesper fucking Fast.

 

We've seen MANY scorers with the label "poor foot speed " adapt and overcome that problem. I see less and less of a 2nd overall pick with each passing day Kakko isn't dangling.

 

Kakko has never been a dangler. He's a possession-based projectable big wing with a good shot. Not sure where you got "dangler" from here.

 

Meanwhile, Kakko's gone from "worst defensive forward" in the NHL to "a non-scoring Mark Stone" as a barely 20 year old with no meaningful special teams time, and Julien Gauthier went from "tons of wasted potential" to "tons of wasted potential in the press box". Maybe we should just accept that one of them earned something and the other didn't.

 

We get it - you hated Quinn for offing your boys and won't give him a lick of credit for anything else he's done. Quinn's gone. We have no idea how Gallant views either of these players and we have no idea how Gallant will utilize them. We do know that Gallant happens to like big players, good skaters, and people who work hard. Kakko will probably be fine, in no small part because Quinn made him work to play two-way hockey. Gauthier? TBD, but Gallant tends to like players of his skillset. Maybe he gets a chance.

[BrooksBurner]

I'm expecting a coach who will build lines that do different things. A coach who utilizes his weapons to the best of their attributes. Not really straying from what they do best.

 

So if you had a player that liked to carry the puck, you would have your coach put him with atleast one forward who can draw attention by just being on the ice and then you add some beef to the line. A net crasher or a guy to plug along the glass. You don't make your puck carrier abandon his game and plug along the boards.

 

This is where I hope Gallant stays to his Word and gives players roles. This way, they really don't have to force the "jack of all trades" onto players that have no business taking on such roles.

 

You're not wrong that lines need diversity, but the problem is the roster wasn't constructed to accomodate this approach. Might be another reason Gorton (and JD, by way of hitching his wagon to him) aren't here anymore. It was ignored last offseason.

[The Dude]

That’s a very long winded way of saying that you can’t understand why players would be asked to adapt their games when their games weren’t working as is. Kakko didn’t have the speed or timing to go through people. They gave him alternatives. Gauthier played like a perimeter player and did most of his producing in the AHL on the PP in front of the net. They wanted him to play a heavier and straight-forward game. Andersson was a two-way player. He didn’t want to play a defensive role to the point he pouted through an AHL stint where they allowed him to play exclusively offense. Hajek has good edge work but otherwise sucks so I’m not even going to bother there.

 

Well I don't understand it. Kakko played 66 games last season. No camp, no preseason, no minors stint,, no preparation for the NHL.

 

You can't decide after such a weird season that you have to make dramatic changes to your top prospect. I think that's ridiculous.

 

Gauthier didn’t play a perimeter game, so I don't know where you got that from. Come to think of it he was a part of the only line that did anything in the first 15 games or so.. I believe it was Lafreniere Chytil and Gauthier who were the only line doing anything. Then Chytil got hurt and Gauthier was thrown to the 4th line. The 4th line really never came together. It was a mish mosh of players that didn't seem to have any direction..

[josh]

Thank god “Make Mistakes Faster” is fucking done!!

[LindG1000]

You're not wrong that lines need diversity, but the problem is the roster wasn't constructed to accomodate this approach. Might be another reason Gorton (and JD, by way of hitching his wagon to him) aren't here anymore. It was ignored last offseason.

 

All things being equal and with the hindsight we have - I'd have paid Fast and just held DeAngelo to the coals until he buckled. We should never have let Fast go.