Albatrosss Posted November 27, 2023 Share Posted November 27, 2023 7 hours ago, Ozzy said: Does anyone else cringe when you see this thread bumped? ...or is it just me? LOL you cringe now but were you cringing after last years playoffs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzy Posted November 27, 2023 Share Posted November 27, 2023 1 minute ago, Albatrosss said: you cringe now but were you cringing after last years playoffs? Only at some of the GDT posts!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrooksBurner Posted November 28, 2023 Share Posted November 28, 2023 10 hours ago, Ozzy said: Does anyone else cringe when you see this thread bumped? ...or is it just me? LOL Not just you. I cringe at how right it turned out to be every playoff I’ve watched Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flynn Posted January 1 Share Posted January 1 His value has to be at its peak right now 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Br4d Posted January 1 Share Posted January 1 The reason the thread is wrong is that Panarin substantially changed his mode of play and became more valuable in the process. It's not his points that have gone up it is his goals and not by a little bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Posted January 1 Share Posted January 1 10 minutes ago, Br4d said: The reason the thread is wrong is that Panarin substantially changed his mode of play and became more valuable in the process. It's not his points that have gone up it is his goals and not by a little bit. The reason this thread is wrong is because it was wrong. And it was never right, and it will always be wrong. And it will always wrong because it was never right. 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Br4d Posted January 1 Share Posted January 1 10 hours ago, Pete said: The reason this thread is wrong is because it was wrong. And it was never right, and it will always be wrong. And it will always wrong because it was never right. Dude, when Panarin is east-westing he's not one of the most valuable players in the league. That's what causes the problems the Rangers had in round 1 last year. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Posted January 1 Share Posted January 1 (edited) 1 hour ago, Br4d said: Dude, when Panarin is east-westing he's not one of the most valuable players in the league. That's what causes the problems the Rangers had in round 1 last year. So what your saying is that when the best players aren't playing their best hockey, they're not the best players? How novel. The point is you don't toss out the body of work over a bad two weeks. Whether those bad 2 weeks are in April or October. Especially because there's a good chance you're not playing at the end of April without him. It's asinine. Edited January 1 by Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangersIn7 Posted January 1 Share Posted January 1 2 hours ago, Br4d said: Dude, when Panarin is east-westing he's not one of the most valuable players in the league. That's what causes the problems the Rangers had in round 1 last year. What caused the problem in Round 1 last year was two-fold 1) Half the roster played poorly 2) The coaching staff didn’t make any adjustments. Panarin was just one name on a list of key guys who were lousy. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Br4d Posted January 1 Share Posted January 1 1 hour ago, RangersIn7 said: What caused the problem in Round 1 last year was two-fold 1) Half the roster played poorly 2) The coaching staff didn’t make any adjustments. Panarin was just one name on a list of key guys who were lousy. Panarin had 15 shots in 7 games and 2 assists. He was beyond lousy. He was nearly invisible. This despite playing most of the power play minutes the Rangers were given. This year he made the commitment to take a lot of shots and drive the play in the offensive end and he's become one of the most valuable players in the NHL as a result. 10 more goals and he will set his Ranger high. His pace will have him scoring more goals than he did in the last two seasons combined. That's all on his decision to be a better hockey player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valriera Posted January 1 Share Posted January 1 8 minutes ago, Br4d said: Panarin had 15 shots in 7 games and 2 assists. He was beyond lousy. He was nearly invisible. This despite playing most of the power play minutes the Rangers were given. This year he made the commitment to take a lot of shots and drive the play in the offensive end and he's become one of the most valuable players in the NHL as a result. 10 more goals and he will set his Ranger high. His pace will have him scoring more goals than he did in the last two seasons combined. That's all on his decision to be a better hockey player. You’re missing the point. Everything you said above is correct, and yet the thread is still and always has been wrong. Even in spite of all of the above, we don’t play in April during the last four seasons without this player, regardless of his play style in each season. So the argument “trade panarin because _____” or “don’t trade panarin because ______” is irrelevant when talking about a player who has carried us to the post season every year he’s been here. It doesn’t matter what he does or doesn’t do in April, he’s the most important player on the team and you cannot snap your fingers and replace him. No free agent signing since his signing is remotely comparable and no trade since his signing is comparable, except eichel. It’s simply not a reality that the player can be replaced, regardless of whatever is written here. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Posted January 1 Share Posted January 1 37 minutes ago, Br4d said: Panarin had 15 shots in 7 games and 2 assists. Panarin had 34 shot attempts, which over the course of 82 games is about 400 shot attempts. In the regular season he had 430 shot attempts. Whether you think that's enough shots or not can be debated, but 15 shots hit the net, 10 were blocked and 9 missed. This season his shots through percentage is 6% higher than the playoffs last year. Point being, this statement: Quote He was beyond lousy. He was nearly invisible. This despite playing most of the power play minutes the Rangers were given. Is pretty inaccurate, especially about him being invisible. Maybe his shot selection wasn't as good as it could have been, and maybe he should have done more to get into high danger areas, sure. But the effort was there last playoff, the results weren't, and as he himself admitted, it snowballed. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodka Drunkenski Posted January 1 Author Share Posted January 1 Everyone has missed the point of this thread. This thread was made because of getting the 2nd and 1st overall picks in back to back years. In hindsight, no one could predict both would be busts considering their draft position. With that said, Happy Nee Year to all and trade Panarin 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangersIn7 Posted January 1 Share Posted January 1 1 hour ago, Br4d said: Panarin had 15 shots in 7 games and 2 assists. He was beyond lousy. He was nearly invisible. This despite playing most of the power play minutes the Rangers were given. This year he made the commitment to take a lot of shots and drive the play in the offensive end and he's become one of the most valuable players in the NHL as a result. 10 more goals and he will set his Ranger high. His pace will have him scoring more goals than he did in the last two seasons combined. That's all on his decision to be a better hockey player. Not disagreeing with any point about Panarin being lousy. He was. Nor that he’s clearly made a concerted effort to alter his approach and be better. He has. That’s all true. Whats also true about that is it has absolutely nothing to do with the post I made. A large portion of the team was poor. Coaches did nothing. You can’t put the onus so heavily on Panarin. Zib was bad. Kane was bad. Kid line was bad. Even Fox. Fox was dreadful in Game 7. May have been the worst I’ve seen him play. Yet we ignore that and it’s all Panarin. Let’s not be ridiculous and put it all on him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Posted January 1 Share Posted January 1 (edited) 1 hour ago, Pete said: Panarin had 34 shot attempts, which over the course of 82 games is about 400 shot attempts. In the regular season he had 430 shot attempts. Whether you think that's enough shots or not can be debated, but 15 shots hit the net, 10 were blocked and 9 missed. This season his shots through percentage is 6% higher than the playoffs last year. Point being, this statement: Is pretty inaccurate, especially about him being invisible. Maybe his shot selection wasn't as good as it could have been, and maybe he should have done more to get into high danger areas, sure. But the effort was there last playoff, the results weren't, and as he himself admitted, it snowballed. Spot on. To say he was invisible means someone isn't watching the games and is going directly to the stat sheet. Panarin was all over the place in that series. Probably the most consistent effort level of all skaters on the team. The rest of the team was trying to force pucks to Zibanejad and Kane in that east-west fashion. Kreider had a shit ton of goals early, but that MF was totally invisible after that. I'll agree with anyone who says Panarin has to produce more meaningful points in the playoffs. You need your best players to be your best players when it matters most. With that said, let's stop this stuff about him being terrible or invisible on the ice in that series. Was he getting it done? No. We can say he was a guy that was putting forth way more effort than anyone is willing to give him credit for. Sometimes you have to dig deeper than the stat sheet to see how a player is doing. @Pete you gave perfect examples of just how much Panarin was trying and elevated his play. This was said months ago. Why does it get forgotten or passed over? If people want to remember that series so bad, go back and watch it again. Key on Panarins playing style. It's NOT east/west. It's a lot of north with him doing a lot on his own. Way more shot attempts and a lot more stuff going on in the middle of the ice as opposed to the perimeter. There weren't a lot of zone entries with curls at the blue line. It was a lot more taking the puck deep and getting shots from the hard areas. Edited January 1 by The Dude Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrooksBurner Posted January 1 Share Posted January 1 I’m glad Panarin didn’t think he was good enough last year, or that his approach to the game has been good enough in the playoffs for this team. Everything he has done has been to try and be prepared to play differently this year. I deeply respect the hustle, and the ability to re-invent his game at his age. That’s what he’s done. He’s reinvented his game. That’s why he’s on pace for over 50 goals which would shatter his career high of 32. You guys may not know this, but I was critical of Panarin this summer, just as he was of himself. My opinions are always subject to change with new information, and I think he’s earned some early optimism that it could be different this time around, but we’re at game 35 and this ain’t the playoffs. He’s got my pinky toe in the water of belief, but that’s about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jdog99 Posted January 1 Share Posted January 1 (edited) the sentiment was wrong because it was always premature. sure - he dropped off last season and hasn't played at a high level in the playoffs. but there were also always team and coaching issues that needed to be addressed. and the book shouldve never been closed on him so soon in any case. Edited January 1 by Jdog99 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrooksBurner Posted January 1 Share Posted January 1 4 minutes ago, Jdog99 said: the sentiment was wrong because it was always premature. sure - he dropped off last season and hasn't played at a high level in the playoffs. but there were also always team and coaching issues that needed to be addressed. and the book shouldve never been closed on him so soon in any case. One to two years into his contract, yes it was way premature. That’s why it was a joke. But going into his 5th contract year and his mid 30s? Nope. It was and is a more than worthy discussion. He obviously thought so too with how he approached the offseason. Still, nobody can say what we see now is what we’ll get in April. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Posted January 1 Share Posted January 1 (edited) 28 minutes ago, BrooksBurner said: I’m glad Panarin didn’t think he was good enough last year, or that his approach to the game has been good enough in the playoffs for this team. Everything he has done has been to try and be prepared to play differently this year. I deeply respect the hustle, and the ability to re-invent his game at his age. That’s what he’s done. He’s reinvented his game. That’s why he’s on pace for over 50 goals which would shatter his career high of 32. You guys may not know this, but I was critical of Panarin this summer, just as he was of himself. My opinions are always subject to change with new information, and I think he’s earned some early optimism that it could be different this time around, but we’re at game 35 and this ain’t the playoffs. He’s got my pinky toe in the water of belief, but that’s about it. Being critical is one thing. To advocate as hard as you did to trade him, and suggest that the team would somehow be better without him, is quite another. The season's performance by him, as well as the team, should squarely put to rest any debate whether they make the playoffs without him... They don't. And you can't replace what he brings, even by committee. And that's not even getting into how you were predicting his demise. He's on base for a career year in terms of goal scoring and is an MVP candidate. Can't be! He's 32! Edited January 1 by Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Long live the King Posted January 1 Share Posted January 1 On 11/27/2022 at 6:52 PM, cupalife said: Aho Svechnikov Werenski Gaudreau Hughes Hichier Barzal Pastarnak Marchand McAvoy Dahlin Tage Thompson Seider Larkin Barkov M. Tkachuck B. Tkachuck Point Kucherov Hedman Matthews Kane MacKinnon Makar Hintz Robertson Heiskanen Kaprisov Josi Kyle Connor McDavid Draistl Miller Petterson Eichel Pietrangelo All better than our $11.5M man Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrooksBurner Posted January 1 Share Posted January 1 7 minutes ago, Pete said: Being critical is one thing. To advocate as hard as you did to trade him, and suggest that the team would somehow be better without him, is quite another. The season's performance by him, as well as the team, should squarely put to rest any debate whether they make the playoffs without him... They don't. And you can't replace what he brings, even by committee. And that's not even getting into how you were predicting his demise. He's on base for a career year in terms of goal scoring and is an MVP candidate. Can't be! He's 32! You gaslighted my position all summer and continue to do so, so it’s a pointless conversation with you, but the bottom line of the argument was that the version of Panarin the team had was not a recipe for the ultimate success of winning a Stanley Cup. This year’s Panarin is different than every other iteration seen in his career. It’s really that simple. We still don’t know how this version of Panarin will look when the ice shrinks and the middle of the ice gets clogged in the playoffs, but what he’s done is shift the logical thought process from “we know what we are getting” to “we aren’t sure what we will get”. For now I’ll keep enjoying the nose for the net, top shelf snipes, and Hart quality play, but it doesn’t mean anything if it doesn’t translate to playoff hockey. This team is well past the phase of just being happy to make it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangersIn7 Posted January 1 Share Posted January 1 To talk about trading him ignores the one fact about why guys like him don’t often get traded except under some very specific circumstances…. That is… you typically lose that trade when you send the best player out of town. That, coupled with all the other complications and implications of trading him, means that conversationally, it’s basically a non-starter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Posted January 1 Share Posted January 1 (edited) 27 minutes ago, BrooksBurner said: You gaslighted my position all summer and continue to do so, so it’s a pointless conversation with you, but the bottom line of the argument was that the version of Panarin the team had was not a recipe for the ultimate success of winning a Stanley Cup. This year’s Panarin is different than every other iteration seen in his career. It’s really that simple. We still don’t know how this version of Panarin will look when the ice shrinks and the middle of the ice gets clogged in the playoffs, but what he’s done is shift the logical thought process from “we know what we are getting” to “we aren’t sure what we will get”. For now I’ll keep enjoying the nose for the net, top shelf snipes, and Hart quality play, but it doesn’t mean anything if it doesn’t translate to playoff hockey. This team is well past the phase of just being happy to make it. What you call gaslighting is actually just calling out flawed logic. You lobbied to trade Panarin, give his ice time to Lafreniere, sign Tyler Bertuzzi... Meanwhile Panarin has (1) single-handedly made Lafreniere relevant and (2) almost twice as many goals as Bertuzzi has points. You can hide behind the "none of it matters until playoffs" because it just means you don't have to admit he's shoving it up your hoop no spit no lube with a little sandpaper in there (same as Laf is doing to me this season)... But that's conveniently ignoring that you have to get to the playoffs first, which they are likely unable to do without him. Edited January 1 by Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangersIn7 Posted January 1 Share Posted January 1 14 minutes ago, Pete said: What you call gaslighting is actually just calling out flawed logic. You lobbied to trade Panarin, give his ice time to Lafreniere, sign Tyler Bertuzzi... Meanwhile Panarin has (1) single-handedly made Lafreniere relevant and (2) almost twice as many goals as Bertuzzi has points. You can hide behind the "none of it matters until playoffs" because it just means you don't have to admit he's shoving it up your hoop no spit no lube with a little sandpaper in there (same as Laf is doing to me this season)... But that's conveniently ignoring that you have to get to the playoffs first, which they are likely unable to do without him. Give Laf some credit. He’s improved on his own. If he got PP time, he’d have 30 points right now, and we’d be staring down the barrel of the point per game player we all wanted. Yes… Panarin has helped. Hes also helped Panarin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangersIn7 Posted January 1 Share Posted January 1 20 minutes ago, Pete said: What you call gaslighting is actually just calling out flawed logic. You lobbied to trade Panarin, give his ice time to Lafreniere, sign Tyler Bertuzzi... Meanwhile Panarin has (1) single-handedly made Lafreniere relevant and (2) almost twice as many goals as Bertuzzi has points. You can hide behind the "none of it matters until playoffs" because it just means you don't have to admit he's shoving it up your hoop no spit no lube with a little sandpaper in there (same as Laf is doing to me this season)... But that's conveniently ignoring that you have to get to the playoffs first, which they are likely unable to do without him. They said all the regular season nonsense about Yzerman too. Great scorer. Can put up droves of points in regular season. Doesn’t do it when it matters. Regular season doesn’t mean anything. BLAH BLAH BLAH. You still have to get there. Eventually he figured it out. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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