Kakko Signs 1-Year $6.1M Offer Sheet — What Would You Do?

[Phil]

Because he was given an insane figure he isn't actually worth in order to ensure the offer sheet would work. Just like this would-be scenario. I'm not getting bullied into paying players nearly 3x their actual value. I'll take the compensation every time.

[BrooksBurner]

8 minutes ago, Phil said:

Because he was given an insane figure he isn't actually worth in order to ensure the offer sheet would work. Just like this would-be scenario. I'm not getting bullied into paying players nearly 3x their actual value. I'll take the compensation every time.

Well, yes, that’s how you have to steal a young, possibly very high potential player via RFA. By paying them proven money as an unproven player.

 

I don’t buy the “if he signs he doesn’t want to be here” stuff I’m seeing either. If the Rangers offer him 2 x 2.5 and Team B offers 6M…the only conclusion I’d draw from that is he’s not an idiot at math. 

[Ozzy]

Two facts:

 

I love Kakko....

I take the comp! 

 

[jsm7302]

I like Kakko and I think patience with him above ALL OTHER PROSPECTS is needed. I pay it everyday. His size. His hands. Etc.....he is going to pan out. 

 

The other guy.....Lafrenierre......let him go.....Bye!!

[Phil]

1 hour ago, rmc51 said:

Well, yes, that’s how you have to steal a young, possibly very high potential player via RFA. By paying them proven money as an unproven player.

 

I don’t buy the “if he signs he doesn’t want to be here” stuff I’m seeing either. If the Rangers offer him 2 x 2.5 and Team B offers 6M…the only conclusion I’d draw from that is he’s not an idiot at math. 

 

I agree, but I also understand where they're coming from when they say that. It sends a signal to the fan base, rightly or wrongly, that you want out, even though it's for obvious reasons no one else would turn down.

[RangersIn7]

At that amount for 1 year, I take the comp and let him go.

 

But if I’m him, I don’t sign it. It’s a bad message to send for only a 1 year deal. It’s just not worth it for him. However his career arc goes, he more than likely stands to make more money in NY than in Carolina. 

[Sod16]

If someone did that and we didn't match, they'd have an RFA after one year who they'd lose if they did not give him a qualifying $6.1 million offer.  What if he doesn't have a good season?  You don't qualify him and you've lost a 1st and 3rd.  Sounds pretty dumb for some team to do this.

[Pete]

10 hours ago, Phil said:

 

I agree, but I also understand where they're coming from when they say that. It sends a signal to the fan base, rightly or wrongly, that you want out, even though it's for obvious reasons no one else would turn down.

Well it's not really that simple.

 

If he wants to sign a 6m offer sheet to go play in Buffalo, Edmonton, Montreal... That a send a message that he's all about the money, so in essence he doesn't want to be here... he wants to be wherever will pay him the most.

 

But the question really is mood, we would not be able to match and keep him at that price tag with what his qualifying offer will be afterwards. Yes I know his next contract doesn't have to be 6 million, but a player sends a message when they make a move like this.

 

[Phil]

8 minutes ago, Pete said:

Well it's not really that simple.

 

If he wants to sign a 6m offer sheet to go play in Buffalo, Edmonton, Montreal... That a send a message that he's all about the money, so in essence he doesn't want to be here... he wants to be wherever will pay him the most.

 

But the question really is mood, we would not be able to match and keep him at that price tag with what his qualifying offer will be afterwards. Yes I know his next contract doesn't have to be 6 million, but a player sends a message when they make a move like this.

 

Absolutely.

[LindG1000]

For me, it depends on who he signs that sheet with. As Pete noted, there's a different message sent if he signs with Buffalo or another bottom-dweller than it is if he signs with, like, Minnesota or Colorado.

 

If a team that we're pretty sure gets a lottery pick in 2023 signs him, it's a real hard thing to consider matching. 

[siddious]

24 minutes ago, G1000 said:

For me, it depends on who he signs that sheet with. As Pete noted, there's a different message sent if he signs with Buffalo or another bottom-dweller than it is if he signs with, like, Minnesota or Colorado.

 

If a team that we're pretty sure gets a lottery pick in 2023 signs him, it's a real hard thing to consider matching. 

Was going to say this earlier too although High draft choices haven’t exactly worked out for us recently

[BrooksBurner]

1 hour ago, Pete said:

Well it's not really that simple.

 

If he wants to sign a 6m offer sheet to go play in Buffalo, Edmonton, Montreal... That a send a message that he's all about the money, so in essence he doesn't want to be here... he wants to be wherever will pay him the most.

 

But the question really is mood, we would not be able to match and keep him at that price tag with what his qualifying offer will be afterwards. Yes I know his next contract doesn't have to be 6 million, but a player sends a message when they make a move like this.

 

 

I think it depends on what the negotiations with the Rangers looks like. I would agree with you if the scenario was the Rangers offered 5.5 and he takes 6.1 elsewhere. If the discrepancy is larger, 2.5-3 vs 6.1, I don’t think it’s fair to draw the same conclusion. I’m sure many of us here have left companies we didn’t necessarily want to leave for pay raises.

[Blue Heaven]

out 

[BrooksBurner]

3 hours ago, G1000 said:

For me, it depends on who he signs that sheet with. As Pete noted, there's a different message sent if he signs with Buffalo or another bottom-dweller than it is if he signs with, like, Minnesota or Colorado.

 

If a team that we're pretty sure gets a lottery pick in 2023 signs him, it's a real hard thing to consider matching. 

Yup. This piggy backs off @Drew a Penalty’s post. I think it’s where my head is at too. An unprotected first has a much different value depending on whose it is. I suspect the kind of team that might try this would be a fringe playoff team this year with plenty of cap space to gamble that they will be a playoff team the following year and therefore protection doesn’t matter. Or even a solid playoff team that has expiring contracts and gobs of cap space as a result.

 

Anaheim, which is really an excellent mention by @Phil .

 

Calgary, if they don’t pay the piper for Gaudreau or Tkachuk, which it sounds like they are reluctant to do.

 

Pittsburgh. Loads of cap space. They might consider taking a swing, and stealing from a rival.

Edited February 21, 2022 by rmc51

[LindG1000]

10 minutes ago, rmc51 said:

Yup. This piggy backs off @Drew a Penalty’s post. I think it’s where my head is at too. An unprotected first has a much different value depending on whose it is. I suspect the kind of team that might try this would be a fringe playoff team this year with plenty of cap space to gamble that they will be a playoff team the following year and therefore protection doesn’t matter. Or even a solid playoff team that has expiring contracts and gobs of cap space as a result.

 

Anaheim, which is really an excellent mention by @Phil .

 

Calgary, if they don’t pay the piper for Gaudreau or Tkachuk, which it sounds like they are reluctant to do.

 

Pittsburgh. Loads of cap space. They might consider taking a swing, and stealing from a rival.

 

I'd be watching the Central division. That whole group aside from Arizona falls into the bucket you're describing (Chicago thinks they're a fringe playoff team and that's all that matters here).

 

I don't let him to go the Pacific for the 2023 1st + 3rd package. That whole division is wild and impossible to predict. 

[BrooksBurner]

55 minutes ago, G1000 said:

 

I'd be watching the Central division. That whole group aside from Arizona falls into the bucket you're describing (Chicago thinks they're a fringe playoff team and that's all that matters here).

 

I don't let him to go the Pacific for the 2023 1st + 3rd package. That whole division is wild and impossible to predict. 

Pittsburgh has Malkin and Letang coming off (17M total). They might stay, but probably at much discounted prices…which leaves room. What are you doing if they offersheet Kakko? What’s your threshold for matching versus not? At $4M do you match? $5M?

 

I don’t think I could stomach risking him blowing up there, but I also don’t know what kind of choice we would have to prevent it. It almost makes me think they should consider trading him in a deal for a piece that is cost controlled and proven (think a Mark Scheifele, maybe JT miller). Not because I would want to, but because it may be the most risk averse path to take. The bonus is, it makes them a better team in the short term rather than taking a 1st and 3rd in compensation.

 

I actually think there is >50% chance Kakko gets some really tempting offer sheets. I won’t say he’ll get a $6M one, but probably at least $4-5M to put the Rangers in a difficult spot.

Edited February 21, 2022 by rmc51

[LindG1000]

Just now, rmc51 said:

Pittsburgh has Malkin and Letang coming off (17M total). They might stay, but probably at much discounted prices…which leaves room. What are you doing if they offersheet Kakko? What’s your threshold for matching versus not? At $4M do you match? $5M?

 

I don’t think I could stomach risking him blowing up there, but I also don’t know what kind of choice we would have to prevent it. It almost makes me think they should consider trading him in a deal for a piece that is cost controlled and proven (think a Mark Scheifele, maybe JT miller). Not because I would want to, but because it may be the most risk adverse path to take. The bonus is, it makes them a better team in the short term rather than taking a 1st and 3rd in compensation.

 

I actually think there is >50% chance Kakko gets some really tempting offer sheets. I won’t say he’ll get a $6M one, but probably at least $4-5M to put the Rangers in a difficult spot.

 

I just don't think they would. Pitt might have a ton of cap space, but they've got to work out Malkin, Letang, and then six more forwards. I see those two taking up half of their cap space (~29m total, so figure something like 7m a head). 

 

From there, it's six forwards and a backup G. I assume they'll keep RFAs Kapanen and Heinen, but both will get raises. I assume they want Rust to stay; he's gotta get paid. I assume they want Rodrigues to stay - he's gotta get paid too. If they want Kakko to be one of those forwards, there's little we can do, but they also haven't got much space to really do it. 

[Keirik]

17 hours ago, Phil said:

Because he was given an insane figure he isn't actually worth in order to ensure the offer sheet would work. Just like this would-be scenario. I'm not getting bullied into paying players nearly 3x their actual value. I'll take the compensation every time.

And to piggy back on that as I would too, I would absolutely then do the same thing the following year for a guy like Zegras and say “sorry, team X opened this door so it’s time for us to start realizing this is the new NHL until the loophole is closed” or teams start getting ahead of this by taking care of this mid season. 

[ThirtyONE]

Personally, I'd keep him. I dunno know why anyone would be interested in picks at this point.

[Drew a Penalty]

11 minutes ago, Keirik said:

And to piggy back on that as I would too, I would absolutely then do the same thing the following year for a guy like Zegras and say “sorry, team X opened this door so it’s time for us to start realizing this is the new NHL until the loophole is closed” or teams start getting ahead of this by taking care of this mid season. 

 

Same. If someone wants to steal Kakko, go for it. That's reserved money down the line that can go to a Zegras or Caufield offer sheet. I'm highly doubtful GMs around the league start poaching, though. Kotkaniemi was partly a revenge play.

[Pete]

2 minutes ago, Drew a Penalty said:

 

Same. If someone wants to steal Kakko, go for it. That's reserved money down the line that can go to a Zegras or Caufield offer sheet. I'm highly doubtful GMs around the league start poaching, though. Kotkaniemi was partly a revenge play.

And frankly, that play has flopped big time. 

[Drew a Penalty]

3 minutes ago, Pete said:

And frankly, that play has flopped big time. 

 

Right. He's barely better than a geriatric Derek Stepan.

[BrooksBurner]

35 minutes ago, Keirik said:

And to piggy back on that as I would too, I would absolutely then do the same thing the following year for a guy like Zegras and say “sorry, team X opened this door so it’s time for us to start realizing this is the new NHL until the loophole is closed” or teams start getting ahead of this by taking care of this mid season. 

 

Well, the thing is an offer sheet is only likely to work if 1) a player hasn’t shown enough yet to insta-match it, and 2) the current team is tight on cap.

 

So we can say just offer sheet a guy like Zegras, but with what he’s shown on the ice it’s an easy match for Anaheim almost regardless of the number.

 

I’m surprised offer sheets aren’t used more often, and I’m surprised teams haven’t been better about doing exactly what you suggest. Take care of it mid season - either extend or trade. Pushing through to arbitration can also an ugly arrangement, for players that young in particular.

[Keirik]

21 minutes ago, rmc51 said:

 

Well, the thing is an offer sheet is only likely to work if 1) a player hasn’t shown enough yet to insta-match it, and 2) the current team is tight on cap.

 

So we can say just offer sheet a guy like Zegras, but with what he’s shown on the ice it’s an easy match for Anaheim almost regardless of the number.

 

I’m surprised offer sheets aren’t used more often, and I’m surprised teams haven’t been better about doing exactly what you suggest. Take care of it mid season - either extend or trade. Pushing through to arbitration can also an ugly arrangement, for players that young in particular.

No I get that how offer sheets work and how it plays out for the team that’s attempted to be poached from. I’m just using Zegras as an example. There will be other guys as well. 

[BrooksBurner]

1 hour ago, ThirtyONE said:

Personally, I'd keep him. I dunno know why anyone would be interested in picks at this point.

I’m not interested in the picks. I’d probably just want the Rangers to trade them for something good.