[friedman] Rangers Are Thinking "More and More" About Keeping Kreider

[Scott]

Panarin could suffer a blood clot. Shesterkin could. Anyone could. Literally anyone could have their careers ended tomorrow. "Shit happens," isn't a viable reason to not sign someone. You'd have no one under contract if it was.

 

My point was from Kreiders pov, on a 5 year deal for 6ish he's leaving millions on the table that would be guaranteed going elsewhere. It be a great deal for the team if he took it and I understand them only going with the shorter term.

[Ozzy]

Kreider is a freak of nature, physically. Probably a top 1% conditioned NHL athlete. His hands might leave him (LOL, I know), but I doubt his feet will, which mitigates the tail end of this hypothetical deal IMO.

 

One hot month doesn't sell me on Kreider, Phil....

 

This is a mirage we're seeing here...smoke and mirrors, slide of hand, twist of fate...

 

Call it what you want, but no way they keep this guy. The Rangers should take this hot streak he's been on, and sell it for everything it's worth to go with new players or high picks in this seasons entry draft, for a guy who in my opinion will never hit his potential here in NY...especially as he ages into his 30's.

[Blue Heaven]

https://theathletic.com/1572841/2020/01/30/rossis-mailbag-how-could-the-penguins-land-chris-kreider-plus-defense-pairings-contracts-and-more/

 

Hi Rob, if the Penguins target Kreider do you think the asking price would be higher since both teams play in the same division? And what do you think the Penguins would have to give up to get him?

 

John L.

 

A Chris Kreider question to start off this mailbag. Well done, readers.

 

The Penguins are targeting Kreider. They’ve inquired. They’ve not been told by the New York Rangers that Kreider isn’t available, which should dismiss the notion that Kreider won’t be moved to a Metropolitan club.

 

Here’s what seems to be the consensus regarding Kreider’s status:

 

He’ll be moved.

 

The asking price is a first-round pick.

 

Might that be the Rangers’ starting asking price? Perhaps. It’s a steep one to pay for an impending free agent. That said, the Rangers are driving this bus, and they’re going to gladly run it over some club that believes Kreider is the difference between a Stanley Cup run and an early exit.

 

Put me in the camp with those folks who believe Kreider would be an ideal fit to play alongside Sidney Crosby on the Penguins’ top line. He’s fast. He’s a scorer. He’s punishing. He’s possibly the deciding factor in a potential Eastern Conference final against either Boston or Tampa Bay, if not the next playoff chapter between the Penguins and Capitals.

 

What I can’t fathom is the Rangers viewing the Penguins’ first-round pick — presumably, a later first-round pick — to be their best offer for Kreider. Which means the Penguins’ success this season should work against them in the #KreiderWatch.

[Phil]

One hot month doesn't sell me on Kreider, Phil....

 

This is a mirage we're seeing here...smoke and mirrors, slide of hand, twist of fate...

 

Call it what you want, but no way they keep this guy. The Rangers should take this hot streak he's been on, and sell it for everything it's worth to go with new players or high picks in this seasons entry draft, for a guy who in my opinion will never hit his potential here in NY...especially as he ages into his 30's.

 

Is it? He's a career 0.6 P/GP player. He's pacing 0.67 P/GP this season. He paced 0.66 P/GP last season. He paced 0.64 P/GP the season prior.

 

What you call "smoke and mirrors," I call "career average."

[4EverRangerFrank]

^Can't argue with the stats...it's that damn 'eye-test' with Kreider. Some games my eyes just don't see him participating. Trying to be fair, are those the games where we are taking penalty after penalty after penalty...and losing so I am in a bad mood anyway? Or is it his career tendancy (and justifiable criticism) that he just doesn't show up every game?

 

I'm going along with Ozzy and saying he has to go (in spite of the stats.) Now about that late first round PIT pick? Yeah, that's not the greatest return.

[Pete]

He's inconsistent, that's the book on him when you listen to other NHL pods like HC12 and 31 Thoughts.

[Phil]

^Can't argue with the stats...it's that damn 'eye-test' with Kreider. Some games my eyes just don't see him participating. Trying to be fair, are those the games where we are taking penalty after penalty after penalty...and losing so I am in a bad mood anyway? Or is it his career tendancy (and justifiable criticism) that he just doesn't show up every game?

 

I'm going along with Ozzy and saying he has to go (in spite of the stats.) Now about that late first round PIT pick? Yeah, that's not the greatest return.

 

Probably made a lot better if Filip Hallander is coming in addition to it.

 

He's inconsistent, that's the book on him when you listen to other NHL pods like HC12 and 31 Thoughts.

 

Right. He operates in bursts throughout the season, which means, by default, there are weeks that pass in which he's a non-factor. This is the player he is. We've got a body of work large enough to say it with certainty.

[ThirtyONE]

https://theathletic.com/1572841/2020/01/30/rossis-mailbag-how-could-the-penguins-land-chris-kreider-plus-defense-pairings-contracts-and-more/

 

A late first should be the starting point. Not the ending point. As far as trading him to the Pens... who cares. If you're going to move him. Get the best deal regardless of location.

[Mr.wiskers]

Forget the 1st Rd pick give me Samuel Poulin and Filip Hallander.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile app powered by Tapatalk

[Ozzy]

He's inconsistent, that's the book on him when you listen to other NHL pods like HC12 and 31 Thoughts.

 

Is it? He's a career 0.6 P/GP player. He's pacing 0.67 P/GP this season. He paced 0.66 P/GP last season. He paced 0.64 P/GP the season prior.

 

What you call "smoke and mirrors," I call "career average."

 

Maybe it's my expectations, Phil. I see Kreider, or was "sold" Kreider being this elite Power forward that scores 35-40 goals a year, and puts up 70-85 points in doing so on the top line. .67 PPG is approximately what? 55 points per season? ...and they think he's going to get better than that as he approaches and exceeds 30 years old?

 

Not only that but pay him an excessive amount of their remaining cap space when we have guys like Kravtsov, Kakko, Chytil, Fox, Shesty and company who are going to be coming off their ELC's in a few years. We're gonna need every quarter in the jukebox to keep that nucleus in tact, I think.

 

Pete's point is really the driving force with Kreider, and it hits home with me though; His inconsistency, or as I call it: "His ability to disappear" is uncanny. A guy that you're paying 7 million a season cannot go a whole quarter of a season being Claude Rains. Then show up just sucking around for a big contract. I'm not buying it with Kreider.

 

I love ya to death, man, but no way on this guy. I hope he's traded to a contender, wish him the best, and the Rangers fill another spot on this team they're looking to upgrade...there are plenty of holes as you know ;)

[josh]

Kreider, like Strome, comes down to dollars. Kreider’s expected cap hit x length seems to be too steep for a team in this position, currently. They’ll desperately need today’s Kreider in 3, 4,...5 seasons, but signing a big deal potentially prevents other important pieces from coming/staying in NY.

[The Dude]

https://theathletic.com/1572841/2020/01/30/rossis-mailbag-how-could-the-penguins-land-chris-kreider-plus-defense-pairings-contracts-and-more/

 

That's a scary thought. Kreider with Crosby or Malkin.

 

If the going rate is just a 1st round pick. I keep Kreider. He HAS to bring back at least one 1st and a good prospect if they deal him.

[josh]

I think Strome would be an ideal linemate for Crosby, the way he?s played this season.

 

I see Kreider doing well with a lot of teams... but not so much Pittsburgh (smarts) or Boston (needs RW).

[BrooksBurner]

Kreider on a 5 year deal is a no brainer. Fuck a pick. I can't believe anyone would still ship him out if this was on the table. 7 years is NO, but 5 years is very manageable. I would fully expect a regression by year 5, but by then you can figure it out.

[Mr.wiskers]

Not to beat this over you guys head, but Pierre Lebrun on Insider Trading show said 8 teams are in on Kreider. And the return should be the same return we got for Hayes last year, a 1st and a player/prospect.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile app powered by Tapatalk

[josh]

Kreider on a 5 year deal is a no brainer. Fuck a pick. I can't believe anyone would still ship him out if this was on the table. 7 years is NO, but 5 years is very manageable. I would fully expect a regression by year 5, but by then you can figure it out.

 

At 5 years, you are probably looking at the highest AAV cap hit. go 6, 7y, you might get it 1m per season lower. I dont think less than 5 years is an option.

[Keirik]

If we got a 1st for Kreider, I’d look into packaging it with say, one of our contracts like a Skjei and seeing what bigger fish we can catch. Nylander maybe?

[Dunny]

If we got a 1st for Kreider, I’d look into packaging it with say, one of our contracts like a Skjei and seeing what bigger fish we can catch. Nylander maybe?

 

I'm in favour of expanding a deal with TO. I think another bold stroke is needed.

[BrooksBurner]

At 5 years, you are probably looking at the highest AAV cap hit. go 6, 7y, you might get it 1m per season lower. I dont think less than 5 years is an option.

 

At 5 years I'd go up to 7M. Easy.

 

The caveat is that it costs you Strome or DeAngelo now, because we don't have the current cap space for all 3 and you can't have all 3 on the books in the next 2-4 years when we might be looking at extending the young guys to longer term contracts rather than cheaper bridge deals.

 

Kreider at 5 years? Bye Strome. And that's not even a hard decision for me.

 

Kreider at 7 years? Bye Kreider. And that's not even a hard decision for me.

[Pete]

This team is better with Strome and ADA than it is with Kreider.

 

If Kreider is retained then it's bye ADA, not Strome.

 

The fact is there are plenty of D to replace ADA in the system. There are no centers replacing Strome especially with Howden moving to wing and looking light years better.

[BrooksBurner]

This team is better with Strome and ADA than it is with Kreider.

 

If Kreider is retained then it's bye ADA, not Strome.

 

The fact is there are plenty of D to replace ADA in the system. There are no centers replacing Strome especially with Howden moving to wing and looking light years better.

 

I hope the Rangers don't see it that way. It would be a mistake to pass on Kreider @ only 5 years to keep a career 35 point guy who was fortunate enough to play a year with Panarin.

 

Soon enough Zibanejad and Chytil will be the top 2 centers for quite some time.

[jsm7302]

This team is better with Strome and ADA than it is with Kreider.

 

If Kreider is retained then it's bye ADA, not Strome.

 

The fact is there are plenty of D to replace ADA in the system. There are no centers replacing Strome especially with Howden moving to wing and looking light years better.

 

Yes, I do believe both will be retained and Kreider will be sent elsewhere by the deadline and I think that is the right decision. This team isn't better with Kreider eating that cap space over any of the alternatives. I'd be listening to all offers for Kreider, ADA, Georgiev and Buch. Packages, hockey deals, picks, all of it. (I'd prefer to retain ADA but sometimes a deal can be to good to say no and honestly, he sat out with no leverage this year, imagine his demands and his ability to sit out next year after his production this season, we may not even be able to retain him at that point)

[jsm7302]

I hope the Rangers don't see it that way. It would be a mistake to pass on Kreider @ only 5 years to keep a career 35 point guy who was fortunate enough to play a year with Panarin.

 

Soon enough Zibanejad and Chytil will be the top 2 centers for quite some time.

 

What comps do you have for Kreider at 5 years. If we give him 6 mil, that sure eats a lot of space moving forward if he drops off.

[Pete]

I hope the Rangers don't see it that way. It would be a mistake to pass on Kreider @ only 5 years to keep a career 35 point guy who was fortunate enough to play a year with Panarin.

 

Soon enough Zibanejad and Chytil will be the top 2 centers for quite some time.

 

The bolded narrative is tired and holds no water anymore. Panarin is having a career year on the worst team he's ever been on...With Strome. Fast is having a Fast year. With Panarin. It's about time to accept that the two players have chemistry and act accordingly.

 

Even of you signed Strome for 4 years and then let him go, that makes Chytil the 2nd line center at 24.

 

Regarding ADA, that's just math. Team has more D prospects than forward prospects. You trade from a position of strength. Move ADA for a LW.

 

Regarding Z and Chytil being the top 2 centers for "quite some time", Zib is probably one of my favorite players but that guy is 27 and imagining him being a top 1-2 center into his mid thirties is just unrealistic. He'll probably be the third line center by the middle of his next deal.

[BrooksBurner]

What comps do you have for Kreider at 5 years. If we give him 6 mil, that sure eats a lot of space moving forward if he drops off.

 

Anyone can drop off. I'm a bit more concerned with Strome dropping off than Kreider.