Report Vitali Kravtsov Requests Trade Ahead of Trade Deadline

[Phil]

10 minutes ago, Tomas Sandstrom said:

Tough situation...VK has done himself no favors...and with team in win-now mode, there's little room to develop a guy who night in and night out is giving you next to nothing.  Especially this time of year, when we start to hone in on a playoff run, buttoning things up.  

 

Hopefully Drury can pull off a deal...something like a solid 4th line center and a first round pick for Krav (and if you have to throw in a sweetener, so be it).

 

I am sure there are GM's out there who believe this kid can be a solid contributor moving forward, and would take a shot.

 

As you said, he's a pick from the previous regime...in all sports, these things happen when there is a regime change.  "System Fit" is a real, tangible thing.  Sometimes players simply don't fit the system you are trying to run.  That really has nothing to do with how talented (or not) the player is.  From the player's perspective, life is a hell of a lot easier when you play in a system that fits your style and strengths.  This seems like a situation where VK really doesn't fit the system GG is running, and the Rangers don't have the ability right now to allow him to possibly grow into a role.  VK also has done himself no favors by his actions.  So a divorce may be the best outcome for both sides here.

 

I don't even think it goes that far, to be honest, because GG has no system. "Let the players handle it," is his system. It's why he favors veterans so heavily over rookies who he can't trust to not get exposed.

 

But otherwise, I agree. This is just a case of a player holding over from whatever happened before who clearly isn't much of a fit here, stylistically, or really practically (because he's still developing), so it just makes sense to move on. It's best for both parties. Others from that same draft class have already been dealt, like Martin Kaut, Ty Smith, and Nils Lundkvist.

I have no idea who the hell they're going to deal him for, but my bet is they'll want to recoup the loss via picks (like Andersson), and/or through a player in a similar position who just needs a change of scenery. I'd have suggested Barret Hayton, but he seems to have figured it out.

[LindG1000]

Push to shove, it's a draft pick. Buffalo has three 2nd rounders this season - their own, Philly, Vegas. Theirs and Philly will be in a similar range - figure in the 38-45 or so - one of those picks for Kravtsov makes some sense.

[LindG1000]

 

[jsm7302]

Good for him; it seems Drury probably got a behind the door request prior to this and then when that didn't work, he said, " LET ME OUT OF HERE!". Kid wants to play. (Total assumption on my part)

 

Edit: Trade him across the river to the Debs so he can burn us for the next decade!

Edited February 13, 2023 by jsm7302

[Br4d]

1 hour ago, Pete said:

Athletes need reps, so why would you play him 7 minutes a night and have it take 200 games for him to get there, when you can play him 15 minutes a night and he can get there in 100 games?

 

Because the Rangers are a good team in contention for a cup.

 

You don't give young players a blank check on teams that are fighting to get over the top unless those young players have shown *production*.

 

Potential is for rebuilding teams or teams that have no other choice due to depth or injury concerns.

 

I'm not in agreement with everything that GG has done this season but he makes a very valid point when he says that he is doing the things that most help the Rangers win right now.  That's his primary job with a roster that has this much talent and depth.

 

Much like Chytil and Kakko and Lafreniere Kravtsov isn't playing for the kind of team that will just throw regular shifts at him without regard to his production.  Those teams aren't making the playoffs this year.

[Phil]

34 minutes ago, LindG1000 said:

 

 

I mean, it's the right call. He almost certainly needs to be somewhere else to see if he can find his NHL legs because for a slew of reasons, he's just well behind the rest of his draft class on physical development and NHL acclimation time. The Rangers are no longer in that development stage and have aggressively shifted to win-now mode. They don't have the time or luxury of waiting around much longer.

[jsm7302]

39 minutes ago, LindG1000 said:

Push to shove, it's a draft pick. Buffalo has three 2nd rounders this season - their own, Philly, Vegas. Theirs and Philly will be in a similar range - figure in the 38-45 or so - one of those picks for Kravtsov makes some sense.

^This will be Brooks article tomorrow. Good job!

[BrooksBurner]

38 minutes ago, LindG1000 said:

Push to shove, it's a draft pick. Buffalo has three 2nd rounders this season - their own, Philly, Vegas. Theirs and Philly will be in a similar range - figure in the 38-45 or so - one of those picks for Kravtsov makes some sense.

Quite frankly, one mid-2nd shouldn’t be good enough for a 9 OA who has performed well in the K, and honestly hasn’t looked bad in very limited NHL time. 2 2nds might move the needle though, with one of the 2nds being conditional on some performance metric they want to agree upon. 25 points next season?

[BrooksBurner]

1 minute ago, jsm7302 said:

^This will be Brooks article tomorrow. Good job!

I’ll let you know

[Tomas Sandstrom]

I feel as if VK was the biggest "loser" from the fallout of JD and Gorton being fired.  At least as far as players go.

 

To me, that signaled the owner throwing down the gauntlet and saying "Time to Win Now".

 

One of the consequences to that was very little tolerance for non-productive players getting playing time in the NHL.  The thing is, guys like Chytil, Kakko, Laf, K'Andre, Schneider, etc. while certainly not at their ceiling in terms of career productivity, they weren't liabilities.  So they continue to get in the lineup.  Thus they continue to improve.

 

VK was caught in a different situation.  So, without the luxury of time on a rebuilding team, it necessarily meant that if he wasn't productive, and was deemed to be a liability, he simply wasn't going to play.  And he's done himself no favors by his own words and actions.

[Phil]

6 minutes ago, BrooksBurner said:

Quite frankly, one mid-2nd shouldn’t be good enough for a 9 OA who has performed well in the K, and honestly hasn’t looked bad in very limited NHL time. 2 2nds might move the needle though, with one of the 2nds being conditional on some performance metric they want to agree upon. 25 points next season?

 

I feel like this is going to be Andersson + as a framework.

 

Andersson basically just went for the second (Cuylle). I think they'll want that here, too, but with a sweetener of whatever stripe — a 4C for now, some other prospect they really like, whatever.

[Sod16]

I think the market for him will be a low 1st or high 2nd, about 25-40 overall.  As for him being a former 9th, it should be remembered that he was an out of the box pick who had been expected to go mid to high teens.

[Phil]

OP and title updated to better reflect the situation.

[Pete]

36 minutes ago, Br4d said:

 

Because the Rangers are a good team in contention for a cup.

 

You don't give young players a blank check on teams that are fighting to get over the top unless those young players have shown *production*.

 

Potential is for rebuilding teams or teams that have no other choice due to depth or injury concerns.

 

I'm not in agreement with everything that GG has done this season but he makes a very valid point when he says that he is doing the things that most help the Rangers win right now.  That's his primary job with a roster that has this much talent and depth.

 

Much like Chytil and Kakko and Lafreniere Kravtsov isn't playing for the kind of team that will just throw regular shifts at him without regard to his production.  Those teams aren't making the playoffs this year.

Then why play Kravtsov at all? And when you do, why play him in situations where he'll have the least amount of success, thereby putting the team in a bad position and hurting their chances of winning?

 

Like I said before, it's rationalizing irrational behavior.

[siddious]

1) he will Be and needs to be traded

2) hopefully a rw that can fill that 2rw spot comes in 

3) drury rushing this isn’t an issue any more.. I don’t think this guys value is going up since he’s not getting played anyway. Get what you can for him. 

[Tomas Sandstrom]

3 minutes ago, Pete said:

Then why play Kravtsov at all? And when you do, why play him in situations where he'll have the least amount of success, thereby putting the team in a bad position and hurting their chances of winning?

 

Like I said before, it's rationalizing irrational behavior.

 

True...

 

But it's also one of those things where you are kind of hoping there will be a spark.  Truth is, if VK was productive, that would be awesome for this team.  They can certainly use another reliable scoring RW.  So, you do what you can and try to see if you can get there.  Problem with that, is if he doesn't play well, it not only hurts the team, but hurts the player and his confidence.  Sort of a damned if you do / damned if you don't situation here.

 

And lets face it, games in Nov, Dec, and Jan are very different than games in March, April, May...

 

 

[Br4d]

1 hour ago, Pete said:

Then why play Kravtsov at all? And when you do, why play him in situations where he'll have the least amount of success, thereby putting the team in a bad position and hurting their chances of winning?

 

Like I said before, it's rationalizing irrational behavior.

 

If you play him for any reason you give him a chance to show something.  I have no idea why he was on the ice in Tarasenko's first game with the Rangers.  I could suggest a lot of possibilities related to having a prominent and polished fellow Russian in his first game with the team but really who knows why GG gave him a good slot that night?

 

If he'd scored a goal or assisted on one maybe he would have been in the lineup the next night also.

 

The Rangers are probably one of the top 5 teams in the NHL right now.  It's tough for a young guy to break in on that kind of roster.

Edited February 13, 2023 by Br4d

[Valriera]

I don’t think you trade this guy at the deadline. He’s our depth forward for this playoff run if one of the top 9 gets injured and he slots in just fine to any of those spots for at least two periods until the bench gets short in the third.

 

I understand he wants to play and he’s well within his rights to want to play, but he burned that card last year. Now is still the time to put the work in and show something when your chance comes up, like all three kids did last year in the playoffs 

[Pete]

55 minutes ago, Valriera said:

I don’t think you trade this guy at the deadline. He’s our depth forward for this playoff run if one of the top 9 gets injured and he slots in just fine to any of those spots for at least two periods until the bench gets short in the third.

 

I understand he wants to play and he’s well within his rights to want to play, but he burned that card last year. Now is still the time to put the work in and show something when your chance comes up, like all three kids did last year in the playoffs 

If he's here past the deadline, what kind of level of effort do you think you're getting from him after he asked for a trade?

 

Yeah, one would think that he knows he's playing for his next contract, however this is a guy who historically self-sabotages. 

[Br4d]

If the Rangers are seriously considering trading Kravtsov they should give him a shot at some ice and tell him to make his market.

 

That'll tell them a lot about where his head is right now.

 

I kind of have a gut feeling that going back to Russia last year cut off one of his big opportunities in the NHL and it is not that clear he'll get another.  He was headed to the AHL to start but the Rangers had difficulty at RW all season until they made the early and late deadline deals for Vatrano and Copp.  It's pretty clear that he'd have been called up and given a real shot at some point as Kakko was invisible for parts of the season and the depth at RW was terrible.

[CBrowningPI]

I think VK has been/is an insurance player for an injury that never happened. If Kappo gets injured in the next month, everyone will be pissed we don't have VK anymore. But if the kid still thinks he's better then he's shown, get his ass away from the lockerroom asap.

[Pete]

2 hours ago, Br4d said:

 

If you play him for any reason you give him a chance to show something.  I have no idea why he was on the ice in Tarasenko's first game with the Rangers.  I could suggest a lot of possibilities related to having a prominent and polished fellow Russian in his first game with the team but really who knows why GG gave him a good slot that night?

 

If he'd scored a goal or assisted on one maybe he would have been in the lineup the next night also.

 

The Rangers are probably one of the top 5 teams in the NHL right now.  It's tough for a young guy to break in on that kind of roster.

I just went back and looked and it feels like there were plenty of time VK didn't play after a win. GG probably the only coach in the NHL who changes the lineup after a decisive victory like he did over the weekend.

 

Sure, you can argue it worked, but it's more Panarin than anything.

[The Dude]

5 hours ago, Phil said:

 

I mean, I get it. I just really think this is an unwinnable situation for both parties. The player needs to play, because he fucked himself by quitting years ago. He's well behind where he needs to be, and needs runway to figure it out. Which is why he needs to be traded, because the flip side of that coin is that the Rangers are in win mode, not development mode. They have little time, if any, to bring him along and give him the rope he needs to find his NHL legs.

 

I have little doubt he'll be traded. They key now is just getting a good return so you aren't left with egg on your face—again— as an organization. I think they're largely using the Othmann class as a new line of demarcation and just moving forward from there. The guys they took prior under the old scouting group either succeeded or didn't, but there's basically a new baseline that's been established. VK is a hold over until he's finally moved on from and then we can level set again.

Not agreeing with the past regime take. If that's the case the kid line would be gone, Miller,  Schneider. Shestyorkin too. There's a ton here that took very long to develop after being drafted by Gorton. Drury being his assistant GM had hands on everyone here. 

 

This is a spoiled coach who is putting a kid over the coals. 

 

Kravtsov has been playing well IMO. With the little icetime he gets and the few chances to play,  this scratching and bullshit post game commentary, (to me) screams of a guy who is throwing a tantrum and wants a certain player here. 

 

This "not developing players" stuff is pretty much bunk too.  He has zero issue using square pegs for round holes with Vesey and Goodrow,  but can't give a prospect time with the top players to ride coattails and learn?  Is the production THAT much more consistent from Vesey? In just over double the amount of games and a shit ton more icetime,  Vesey only has 6 more goals than the sporadic rookie. Kravtsov has been looking pretty solid defensively and HAS been going to the hard areas. 

 

Gallant wants another Gallant guy and is not giving a crap about the organization. Kravtsov fits perfectly fine in any top 9 spot UNTIL a legit RW who can slot up and down the top 9 is brought in. He's trying to force this grinder/ hard worker type into a spot that it isn't really needed. 

 

He's going to get his way. Some schmoe of a 4th liner will be added and Vesey or Goodrow will once again- slot up-  despite it being evident all year, that they don't belong there. 

[Phil]

 

[BrooksBurner]

4 minutes ago, Phil said: