Filip Chytil Problem

[Kevin]

I've tried being patient with Chytil but he is creating a problem with this team.  The way this team is currently constructed, they need Chytil to provide offense.  Too often he coasts through games where he is just completely invisible.  He was given a chance with more talented players but so far it's amounted to 1 goal and 0 assists through 7 games.  Further, he's only managed a meager 13 shots during these games.  He is still suspect in the defensive zone, below average at the face-off dot, and too soft in the neutral zone and on the fore-check.  So what exactly is he if he isn't contributing offensively?  This is basically his 4th season as a Ranger.  I know he's still young but the improvement and consistency is still way off where he needs to be for this team.  I've never thought he was a center to begin with but maybe moving him over to wing allows him to create a little more offense?  His name has come up in the Toews/Kane thread and I would do a deal, centered around him, in a heartbeat for a real center or a more prolific scoring winger.

[Shane Falco]

3 minutes ago, Kevin said:

I've tried being patient with Chytil but he is creating a problem with this team.  The way this team is currently constructed, they need Chytil to provide offense.  Too often he coasts through games where he is just completely invisible.  He was given a chance with more talented players but so far it's amounted to 1 goal and 0 assists through 7 games.  Further, he's only managed a meager 13 shots during these games.  He is still suspect in the defensive zone, below average at the face-off dot, and too soft in the neutral zone and on the fore-check.  So what exactly is he if he isn't contributing offensively?  This is basically his 4th season as a Ranger.  I know he's still young but the improvement and consistency is still way off where he needs to be for this team.  I've never thought he was a center to begin with but maybe moving him over to wing allows him to create a little more offense?  His name has come up in the Toews/Kane thread and I would do a deal, centered around him, in a heartbeat for a real center or a more prolific scoring winger.

Honestly, my concern per game now is that he continues to damage his trade value lol. I really want the rangers to package him in a trade that will upgrade their 3C. He's just not it. I don't want a prospect back either. An established center please. Preferably who can win face offs. 

[Phil]

They need a Neiderreiter-for-Clutterbuck style deal. I'd happily give up his upside for a proven work rate.

[The Dude]

As inconsistent as he's been, you can also see that with injuries to himself and struggles throughout the team, the players he get to play with is never a consistent thing. He's basically playing with a different forward ever game. He doesn't get to build chemistry with anyone.  I see a litte there between Lafreniere and himself,  but Lafreniere is shuffled around as if Quinn were coaching. Which, I thought Gallant said he doesn't like to do?

I'd like to see Gauthier put back on a line with Chytil and Lafreniere.  It was going good last season.  Why not retry it?

 

I said in another thread, that I think he fits as a RW for Panarin. It would kinda get him to have to use his size out there and be a net presence as well as a shooting option  for the 2 right handers..

[Scott]

Agree with the first couple of posts here, I think he is what he's shown to be in his almost 200 games to date which Kevin sums up well. Underwhelming.

I also don't think you can ever get him to use his size, he's a soft player who's shown no signs of anything but being that. 

What is his upside really, his biggest one is probably his age at this point. His game hasn't grown much at all.

[Kevin]

12 minutes ago, Phil said:

They need a Neiderreiter-for-Clutterbuck style deal. I'd happily give up his upside for a proven work rate.

Absolutely.  I'd move him for Silfverberg with some retention.  Anaheim probably looking for young assets and we'll get a more proven commodity.

[siddious]

Can't say there isnt some disappointment in regards to his development. That first season it seemed like he had so much potential. I still think he will be a decent NHL'r I just dont know about 2C anymore. 

[Kevin]

Just now, siddious said:

Can't say there isnt some disappointment in regards to his development. That first season it seemed like he had so much potential. I still think he will be a decent NHL'r I just dont know about 2C anymore. 

Honestly, with the way his defensive game hasn't progressed, it's 2C or 2nd line wing for him or really nothing.  I just don't see the fit with the Rangers right now.  Move him to a team that can be a little more patient with him and hope he grows.  3C is definitely not the right spot.

[Scott]

Chytil while not the only one is certainly one of the main targets here, at least some/most of the top six soft guys have historically put up points. 

I don't see how they could remotely consider banking on him being the 2C of the future.

 

Edited October 26, 2021 by jsrangers

[Phil]

4 minutes ago, Kevin said:

Absolutely.  I'd move him for Silfverberg with some retention.  Anaheim probably looking for young assets and we'll get a more proven commodity.

The issue I have here is I'd like to move him for a natural center because I don't really want to force Goodrow into that role. I think he'd be fine, I just really like him on the Panarin line, and I like that he can roam around the lineup on the fly.

[siddious]

Okay except I dont think grit was the issue last night. 

 

 

[Phil]

4 minutes ago, siddious said:

Okay except I dont think grit was the issue last night.

Depends on how you define grit. I think it was absolutely an issue. The inability to change your game when you're met by guys standing up at the blue line all night is a grit problem. Because it's an indication your skilled players, who routinely coughed the puck up trying to make passes across it to gain entry, can only play one way.

[Kevin]

1 minute ago, Phil said:

The issue I have here is I'd like to move him for a natural center because I don't really want to force Goodrow into that role. I think he'd be fine, I just really like him on the Panarin line, and I like that he can roam around the lineup on the fly.

Ideally I think that's the right move too but just doing some casual surfing of capfriendly and looking at teams that I know should be sellers, there's really not a whole lot of centers that I would necessarily want right now.  Maybe the solution is to wait a bit longer and see what other teams fall into the seller category but, like Shane Falco wrote, you worry that Chytil's value just keeps diminishing. 

[Phil]

1 minute ago, Kevin said:

Ideally I think that's the right move too but just doing some casual surfing of capfriendly and looking at teams that I know should be sellers, there's really not a whole lot of centers that I would necessarily want right now.  Maybe the solution is to wait a bit longer and see what other teams fall into the seller category but, like Shane Falco wrote, you worry that Chytil's value just keeps diminishing. 

Christian Dvorak was probably the guy.

My guess is, like you said, they need to wait it out a while longer. I don't think his value will diminish. He's 22. Even with another 30-40 games, I think he maintains most of the attributes that other teams would find so attractive.

[Scott]

13 minutes ago, siddious said:

Okay except I dont think grit was the issue last night. 

 

 

I think while it wasn't as bad as years past I thought there was a lot of weak play last night and guys didn't battle hard along the boards at time etc. I think there's more grit thanks to the new guys and Trouba was aggressive last night for sure.  But Laf, Miller, Panarin (expected) just off the top were timid.  There were others too and I think it was enough to irk Gallant last , obviously.

I thought the Flames played with an edge for a team with some really undersized guys and I don't remember Lucic doing much at all. 

It was just a shit game all around and the effort wasn't there.

Phil's point is a good one too. It wasn't about not punching guys in the face. 

Edited October 26, 2021 by jsrangers

[Phil]

The Flames were also always one stride from the puck, which again means your skilled guys have to make quicker decisions. They need to dump more pucks in and hunt them down (and win those battles), to get away from the relentless forecheck. Again, grit issue. At least to me.

[The Dude]

32 minutes ago, jsrangers said:

Agree with the first couple of posts here, I think he is what he's shown to be in his almost 200 games to date which Kevin sums up well. Underwhelming.

I also don't think you can ever get him to use his size, he's a soft player who's shown no signs of anything but being that. 

What is his upside really, his biggest one is probably his age at this point. His game hasn't grown much at all.

When people talk about him using his size, it isn't about playing physical and checking. When I talk about using his size, I mean to get to the front and side of the net when he doesn't have the puck. I mean shielding the puck by using big body and carrying the puck anywhere and everywhere.  I mean he needs to fight for loose pucks more everywhere. 

I'm not entirely ready to give up on him. BUT, I think I'd be absolutely fine if they decided to trade him for a scoring right winger. 

I don't see the need to trade him for a legit 3C. Isn't why they signed Goodrow? I'm underwhelmed with Goodrow,  but I feel like that's just because I see his skillset as a better fit at center in a checking/shutdown role and not as a puck retriever on a skill line. 

[Scott]

10 minutes ago, The Dude said:

When people talk about him using his size, it isn't about playing physical and checking. When I talk about using his size, I mean to get to the front and side of the net when he doesn't have the puck. I mean shielding the puck by using big body and carrying the puck anywhere and everywhere.  I mean he needs to fight for loose pucks more everywhere. 

I'm not entirely ready to give up on him. BUT, I think I'd be absolutely fine if they decided to trade him for a scoring right winger. 

I don't see the need to trade him for a legit 3C. Isn't why they signed Goodrow? I'm underwhelmed with Goodrow,  but I feel like that's just because I see his skillset as a better fit at center in a checking/shutdown role and not as a puck retriever on a skill line. 

I agree with what you're saying here too, not always about hitting but to me he does neither of the two sides of the toughness coin. Shrug. 

Goodrow hopefully proves his worth over time but yeah, underwhelming in most games so far.  I don't think we're anywhere near close enough to not need him to produce all year long just to have him around to get us through the playoffs based on his experience. 

[siddious]

52 minutes ago, Phil said:

Depends on how you define grit. I think it was absolutely an issue. The inability to change your game when you're met by guys standing up at the blue line all night is a grit problem. Because it's an indication your skilled players, who routinely coughed the puck up trying to make passes across it to gain entry, can only play one way.

Doesn’t matter what filip Chytil does though when you’re top 2 lines refuse to play with “grit” as you’ve defined it in this instance. They’re a east/west playing team to the core. I don’t even know how you go about changing that without roster turn over. 

[Phil]

Then you go about doing it with roster turnover. By trading Chytil, for example.

[josh]

"Another one"

[Pete]

1 hour ago, josh said:

"Another one"

So what's your solution, what should we do with Chytil? Current role is not an option....

[josh]

But he's our best most recent Hartford success story...

[Pete]

2 minutes ago, josh said:

But he's our best most recent Hartford success story...

He is a Hartford success story, he's just not a Ranger success story.

And after so many people told me he was primed for a breakout season....

[josh]

Spread out the skill, spread out the size.

They didn't address getting a bigger, physical defensive C over the summer, so he's the option.

I liked the line with Laf and Blais. Thats a fine third line when you have size and physicality in your top lines.

He's still young. I guess we can re-adress at the deadline if this team is looking like a cup winner and that's the issue.