[tsn] DeAngelo Seeking AHL Loan from Rangers [NOTE: *Warning in OP*]

[Capt]

If they let a 60pt defenseman walk in the off season you'd be calling Gorton incompetent either way.

 

He put up 60 pts, they tried to trade him (it was reported multiple times) and no one wanted him. So they signed him hoping to move him at a later point- instead he came into camp and acted like a tool which led to them just giving up on him.

 

Its been like 2 months I don't get why you keep harping on this point- I am sure they would have gotten something for him if they could have. This is, was and will continue to be on TDA.

 

 

Why am I harping on this point? Because this thread was reintroduced by the moderators here to discuss. So I'm discussing it.

 

Gorton's job is to manage the personnel of this franchise. It's his job to know when to trade an asset or not. If he traded him this summer for a 2nd round pick, of course he would have been questioned for getting a light return by the fans. So what? Fact is he got nothing and the situation 2 periods into his new contract was untenable.

 

Why do you keep on harping this situation being on TDA? Get past that, we are not relitigating that. Who it's on doesn't matter and I'm not redirecting blame on anyone else anyway. TDA doesn't just get to choose to be a part of the Rangers organization.

[josh]

Before there was a Lemon Law the consumer was at the mercy of the auto dealer and I think it's similar to this situation.

 

1. You see that shiny new car and you buy it in good faith that it works well.

2. When problems arise, you take it back to the dealer and they do some repairs for you.

3. A little while later you have more problems and go back to the dealer and they refuse to help you.

4. You're stuck with a car payment and a bad car.

 

Does this mean you made a bad decision in the first place?

 

I'd say no, and similarly the NYR organization saw ADA as a shiny vehicle to drive us to greatness. It didn't work out because the problem is with the car, not the owner.

 

In this case, they loaned the car (entry level contract), extended the loan (2nd deal), then this summer, knowing ALLLLLL of the problems, decided to purchase the car at full price. Then, when the same issue (let's say the rotors) came up the first month, you said "fuck it", and paid some one to tow it away.

[josh]

He's "The Stinky Car"

 

[video=youtube;-pEhqiCD27E]

[Capt]

Before there was a Lemon Law the consumer was at the mercy of the auto dealer and I think it's similar to this situation.

 

1. You see that shiny new car and you buy it in good faith that it works well.

2. When problems arise, you take it back to the dealer and they do some repairs for you.

3. A little while later you have more problems and go back to the dealer and they refuse to help you.

4. You're stuck with a car payment and a bad car.

 

Does this mean you made a bad decision in the first place?

 

I'd say no, and similarly the NYR organization saw ADA as a shiny vehicle to drive us to greatness. It didn't work out because the problem is with the car, not the owner.

 

Seriously Frank? The Rangers didn't have to resign him or even trade for him in the first place. They traded fro him knowing full well his history. They resigned him after having first hand knowledge of his "distraction" for years. You want to fully absolve the Rangers here from any responsibility in bringing him back?

 

The Rangers made a bad decision in the first place: trading for him

Than in the second place: resigning him to a one year show me contract

Than in the third place: resigning him to a two year deal this summer

Than in the fourth place: benching him 2 periods into the season

 

At anyone of these points they could have moved on from him without getting to the point of declaring him a lemon. So your analogy is awful

[Long live the King]

I can't believe we're doing this again

 

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[Scott]

So I guess the bottom line after all this is after 6 weeks there's still nothing new to see here at this time based on Seravalli's tweet.

[Capt]

I guess not. I wasn't here 6 weeks ago though.

[siddious]

Why am I harping on this point? Because this thread was reintroduced by the moderators here to discuss. So I'm discussing it.

 

Gorton's job is to manage the personnel of this franchise. It's his job to know when to trade an asset or not. If he traded him this summer for a 2nd round pick, of course he would have been questioned for getting a light return by the fans. So what? Fact is he got nothing and the situation 2 periods into his new contract was untenable.

 

Why do you keep on harping this situation being on TDA? Get past that, we are not relitigating that. Who it's on doesn't matter and I'm not redirecting blame on anyone else anyway. TDA doesn't just get to choose to be a part of the Rangers organization.

 

 

I dont know where you are getting that 2nd round pick for TDA from? My understanding was that no one wanted him in the off season.

[BlairBettsBlocksEverything]

Josh is saying it is horrible asset control, which it is. They fortunately can buy him out with minimal pain in the off season. Fact is though they had a 60 point defenseman that could run a powerplay with the best of them. The Rangers had been looking for that guy for 2 decades. Morris, Kotalik, Shttenkirk, Yandle, etc. Yes he had warts, warts that made him less desirable. If nobody wanted him then why give him anything close to what they gave him in contract? If they didn't want him or he had become so toxic why not just let him go? At the very least if he was so toxic and you were only giving him 2 periods and a slammed penalty box door why not trade him for whatever you can get for him.

 

Pete you are saying there was no takers for him. You're not saying that this summer nobody would take him at all, are you? Or is it the Rangers overvalued him and didn't get their asking price? Those are vastly different things. Hindsight is not hard on this one. He was on the end of his leash here this summer, obviously with how short it was 2 periods in. They can't be so stupid that they didn't think there would be another issue, so then why not take the best offer and move on?

 

The asset management here is almost criminal. Gorton should be following TDA out the door for this alone. Incompetent

 

sometimes you gotta view these things through a different lens. In this situation, it isn't about 'Assets' and treating players as just simple comodoties.

 

what we had was a talented young defenseman who had a career year but has some extra baggage. We signed him to a deal that, if he were able to replicate his year last season, would be an absolute steal, and we'd be happy it was two years instead of one. But the player didn't hold up his end of the bargain and became an issue and a distraction. It's been dealt with.

 

Assets don't fuck with the value of your other assets. having your car break down doesn't make your house worth any less.

 

ADA was not just a depreciating "asset" but management (in my opinion, rightfully) felt that he was going to bring the team down with him. So fuck it, get him away and move on. the minimal cap hit from an offseason buy-out will be offset and then some by bigger contracts coming off the books. ADA's career outlook is no longer the concern of the organization at this time and its not our job to find him a landing spot if nobody is going to pay the asking price

[Bugg]

Basically they're gonna make Tony D available in the Seattle draft, and if he isn't taken, write him a check for next season. Only variable that may change that would be a new coach. And that's no given either. A new coach may look at the defensemen on the squad and figure he doesn't need to deal with such nonsense either.

 

To that end would really help if Trouba started playing, say, better than replacement value/Neil Pionk levels of suck. Have an awful lot of cap $ tied up in 2 Ds who right now are giving them nothing and next to nothing.

[siddious]

Basically they're gonna make Tony D available in the Seattle draft, and if he isn't taken, write him a check for next season. Only variable that may change that would be a new coach. And that's no given either. A new coach may look at the defensemen on the squad and figure he doesn't need to deal with such nonsense either.

 

To that end would really help if Trouba started playing, say, better than replacement value/Neil Pionk levels of suck. Have an awful lot of cap $ tied up in 2 Ds who right now are giving them nothing and next to nothing.

 

No I dont think this is true. Gorton/JD seem to be done with him so I dont think who is coach matters.

 

Trouba is another topic all together.

[Scott]

Yeah, I don't think a new coach would matter here even a little Bugg.

 

As for Trouba whenever he's ready to step up and do better that would be great.

[LindG1000]

Buyout, unless something of worth is returned. Nothing else makes sense. Just get the most cap space you can next year. Eichel's 10 million coming in :slats:

 

Fuckin send him in the deal and let the Sabres decide if they want the risk or the nominal buyout.

[Capt]

I dont know where you are getting that 2nd round pick for TDA from? My understanding was that no one wanted him in the off season.

 

No trade was able to completed. Nobody knows what the Rangers were asking for him. It makes even less sense if the Rangers couldn't give him away in the off season for the Rangers to sign him to the deal they did. If nobody wanted him even for a 2nd round pick or worse than why not play hard ball with him? Why not let him go to arbitration and walk away from it?

 

What likely happened is that the Rangers were shopping him as a 60 point defenseman and asking for a return they could not get, partly because of the looming contract he was going to get and the cap due to the pandemic. So they signed him instead of losing him for pennies on the dollar. At that point his leash needs to be longer than 2 periods.

[Pete]

No trade was able to completed. Nobody knows what the Rangers were asking for him. It makes even less sense if the Rangers couldn't give him away in the off season for the Rangers to sign him to the deal they did. If nobody wanted him even for a 2nd round pick or worse than why not play hard ball with him? Why not let him go to arbitration and walk away from it?

 

What likely happened is that the Rangers were shopping him as a 60 point defenseman and asking for a return they could not get, partly because of the looming contract he was going to get and the cap due to the pandemic. So they signed him instead of losing him for pennies on the dollar. At that point his leash needs to be longer than 2 periods.

It wasn't. It was 5 games after that where he decided to open his mouth and get punched in it.

 

Why are we still litigating what "should have" or "may have" happened?

[BrooksBurner]

Fuckin send him in the deal and let the Sabres decide if they want the risk or the nominal buyout.

 

I mean, maybe, but the optics behind the Sabres taking back DeAngelo in the deal for their franchise player probably wouldn't sit well with the fans at this point. I can't see them doing it.

[Capt]

It wasn't. It was 5 games after that where he decided to open his mouth and get punched in it.

 

Why are we still litigating what "should have" or "may have" happened?

 

What’s the point of the thread then. Just end it and wait till the summer.

[Bugg]

It wasn't. It was 5 games after that where he decided to open his mouth and get punched in it.

 

Why are we still litigating what "should have" or "may have" happened?

 

In any workplace, there are days when things go awry and you simply have to keep your thoughts to yourself . Don't like the goalie making a mess; it's management's job to deal with that, not yours. Shut the fuck up and go home, see you at practice. That's being a professional. And he couldn't do it.

[Keirik]

It wasn't. It was 5 games after that where he decided to open his mouth and get punched in it.

 

Why are we still litigating what "should have" or "may have" happened?

 

Guy can punch a teammate but can’t save a beach ball. God I love being a Rangers fan

[The Dude]

Who is "they?" the report of what happened occurred well before they confirmed it. The only person who ruined his trade value is him. What were the Rangers supposed to do, lie?

 

??? According to some here including you, they lied about the Miller thing... They'll lie about a puck, but they can't lie and stop the GM from using scouts honor to hold himself to his own word by saying the guy he just signed has only one strike and he's gone??? You'd think that was only between the GM, the coaches and the player.. They couldn't "lie" about that?

 

They can't buy him out soon enough. I'm tired of the pot shots taken at this player in an effort to rile a portion of this place up.

[The Dude]

If they let a 60pt defenseman walk in the off season you'd be calling Gorton incompetent either way.

 

He put up 60 pts, they tried to trade him (it was reported multiple times) and no one wanted him. So they signed him hoping to move him at a later point- instead he came into camp and acted like a tool which led to them just giving up on him.

 

Its been like 2 months I don't get why you keep harping on this point- I am sure they would have gotten something for him if they could have. This is, was and will continue to be on TDA.

 

Reports were they tried to trade him prior to giving him the contract. The numbers for his supposed asking price were rival to Karlsson numbers. People here were ramping up his requests to likely be 7-8 million... Nobody was going to take him at that asking price. The guy took a VERY team friendly deal, and said he'd play anywhere for the team, was liked by the room, but the word used here is nuclear.

 

Yeah no.

[The Dude]

In any workplace, there are days when things go awry and you simply have to keep your thoughts to yourself . Don't like the goalie making a mess; it's management's job to deal with that, not yours. Shut the fuck up and go home, see you at practice. That's being a professional. And he couldn't do it.

 

??? Teammates rag each other and make comments EVERY SINGLE GAME. Being professional, is not punching the guy for speaking... Some players are deemed leaders for doing such things.

[Pete]

Why are we relitigating this?

 

ADA is gone. Everyone move on.

[Kevin]

Why are we relitigating this?

 

ADA is gone. Everyone move on.

I think because Georgiev sucks so hard and every one of us might have made similar comments that ADA said to him if we were playing with him. Shit I'd be roasting him if he was my 'C' league goalie and he played like he is.

 

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[BrooksBurner]

I think because Georgiev sucks so hard and every one of us might have made similar comments that ADA said to him if we were playing with him. Shit I'd be roasting him if he was my 'C' league goalie and he played like he is.

 

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This. And reportedly Georgiev is the one who turned the encounter physical. Sounds like he might have confidence and self esteem issues.