[tsn] DeAngelo Seeking AHL Loan from Rangers [NOTE: *Warning in OP*]

[Phil]

They = management. They delivered an ultimatum. Just trade him at that point, for whatever. I don't believe for one second they didn't have offers before all this shit went down, even if they were meh offers. If you're at the point of delivering an ultimatum, pull the trigger before it's too late. Then instead of keeping a lid on it and putting him in the press box for any number of reasons, they publicly send him home and say he's not welcome anymore? Yikes...awful asset management on this one.

 

Again as opposed to what, lying?

[Blue Heaven]

They = management. They delivered an ultimatum. Just trade him at that point, for whatever. I don't believe for one second they didn't have offers before all this shit went down, even if they were meh offers. If you're at the point of delivering an ultimatum, pull the trigger before it's too late. Then instead of keeping a lid on it and putting him in the press box for any number of reasons, they publicly send him home and say he's not welcome anymore? Yikes...awful asset management on this one.

 

Wasn’t it out there that after the Rangers signed him that they were looking to trade him and nothing materialized?

 

 

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[BrooksBurner]

Again as opposed to what, lying?

 

It shouldn't have gotten to the point it did. They should have traded him the second they thought he deserved an ultimatum. And, no, not lying, but how about taking at least a raincheck on overindulgent truth telling? They killed any chance they had left to trade him. Teams don't usually air the dirty laundry of players they need/want to trade.

[BrooksBurner]

Wasn’t it out there that after the Rangers signed him that they were looking to trade him and nothing materialized?

 

 

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Do you believe that nobody wanted a 60 point defenseman? I don't. That's hog wash to cover their skin because they played it poorly.

[Phil]

It shouldn't have gotten to the point it did. They should have traded him the second they thought he deserved an ultimatum. And, no, not lying, but how about taking at least a raincheck on overindulgent truth telling? They killed any chance they had left to trade him. Teams don't usually air the dirty laundry of players they need/want to trade.

 

Oh, I see what you are saying -- you're talking about well before the fight. Yes, they probably should have literally not brought him back, but they were always weighing a 60-point player against the problems he brought off the ice. They gambled and got burned.

[Keirik]

fantastic asset management.

 

Management benched him 2 periods into the season for slamming a penalty box door in an already frustrating 4-0 blowout then sat him for games after re-signing the guy for two years. He struggled with that. They then gave him some hidden ultimatum and out of nowhere made it public like clowns. Just ridiculous lol

 

The entire NHL is not going to help out this group of management when they’ve already proven to be incompetent in many aspects anyway especially when they make things public. Just look at the McD trade. Put out an ad in the paper saying we are dumping players then ask teams what they can get only to get raped in a laughable trade? Trade pieces AND give a boatload to Trouba KNOWING HE ONLY WANTS TO PLAY HERE. The league sees this shit.

 

There were like 6 or so teams that could even afford him cap wise when this happened if that. Of those 6 maybe 1 was in a position where ADA would help a playoff run. The rest were the Senators and Red Wings of the world who aren’t in a position to need ADA right now regardless of any interest. They could just wait until he’s bought out and get him for even less pennies than they would have via trade.

[Phil]

Wasn’t it out there that after the Rangers signed him that they were looking to trade him and nothing materialized?

 

 

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Before. They signed him when whatever trade talks they were having fell through, or simply never materialized. But we're rapidly approaching relitigation again.

[Phil]

Management benched him 2 periods into the season for slamming a penalty box door in an already frustrating 4-0 blowout then sat him for games after re-signing the guy for two years. He struggled with that. They then gave him some hidden ultimatum and out of nowhere made it public like clowns. Just ridiculous lol

 

The entire NHL is not going to help out this group of management when they’ve already proven to be incompetent in many aspects anyway especially when they make things public. Just look at the McD trade. Put out an ad in the paper saying we are dumping players then ask teams what they can get only to get raped in a laughable trade? Trade pieces AND give a boatload to Trouba KNOWING HE ONLY WANTS TO PLAY HERE. The league sees this shit.

 

There were like 6 or so teams that could even afford him cap wise when this happened if that. Of those 6 maybe 1 was in a position where ADA would help a playoff run. The rest were the Senators and Red Wings of the world who aren’t in a position to need ADA right now regardless of any interest. They could just wait until he’s bought out and get him for even less pennies than they would have via trade.

 

Fewer. But, yes, once bought out, he'll be a lot more attractive. Namely because you're looking at around $1 million in AAV in all likelihood, and one-year. Easy to walk away from.

[CBrowningPI]

I am one of the minority that thinks the Rangers FO screwed up an excellent player. They should have kept quiet about any ultimatum or not made one. A silly incident in their tunnel should have been kept quiet and his trade value would still be high. Pretty much the whole team liked the guy and he could have apologized to Georgiev and the team and it would be over with. But Gordon had to step in and make it a bigger deal than it was. Just stupid. IMO.

[Phil]

We're not relitigating this, guys. Find a way to talk about where we're going, not why we're here.

[Capt]

Regardless of anyone's feelings about TDA, the Rangers look like fools here. The Rangers actions of benching and ultimatums don't make sense after bringing him back for 2 years. If it had soured to the point to need to issue these warnings 2 periods into the season then why didn't they move him long before this ever materialized. You can make excuses for management and that's fine but in the end it all adds up the same. They had a decent asset and watched it evaporate to the point where it's going to cost them other assets to get rid of him. It's really unforgivable.

[BrooksBurner]

We're not relitigating this, guys. Find a way to talk about where we're going, not why we're here.

 

Buyout, unless something of worth is returned. Nothing else makes sense. Just get the most cap space you can next year. Eichel's 10 million coming in :slats:

[Phil]

Regardless of anyone's feelings about TDA, the Rangers look like fools here. The Rangers actions of benching and ultimatums don't make sense after bringing him back for 2 years. If it had soured to the point to need to issue these warnings 2 periods into the season then why didn't they move him long before this ever materialized. You can make excuses for management and that's fine but in the end it all adds up the same. They had a decent asset and watched it evaporate to the point where it's going to cost them other assets to get rid of him. It's really unforgivable.

 

No, it won't. They can buy him out for pennies.

 

 

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[josh]

[Capt]

No, it won't. They can buy him out for pennies.

 

 

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A buyout is money and cap space. While maybe not a lot in the grand scheme of things. We are talking about a defenseman who was coming off a 60 pt season and in his mid 20’s. One of the better power play guys around. Maybe they were never getting what the blues got for shattenkirk in a trade or what we gave up for yandle. However they could have got at least something for him if the situation was so toxic

[Pete]

ADA was on his last try when he got here. 3rd team since the draft, everyone knew his history, and even when he got here there was a series of events. They tried to trade him last summer, coming off his best season, and couldn't find a taker. That's where the fuck up was, not getting anything for him and getting him off the team in the off season. How they handled it afterwards, they were just reacting to ADAs own behavior.

[Phil]

A buyout is money and cap space. While maybe not a lot in the grand scheme of things. We are talking about a defenseman who was coming off a 60 pt season and in his mid 20’s. One of the better power play guys around. Maybe they were never getting what the blues got for shattenkirk in a trade or what we gave up for yandle. However they could have got at least something for him if the situation was so toxic

 

I get all that but it's mitigated to non-issue IMO. The cap charges will barely register on the radar. He's an issue now at $4M+ -- he won't be at a few hundred K for a couple of seasons.

 

 

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[Capt]

Josh is saying it is horrible asset control, which it is. They fortunately can buy him out with minimal pain in the off season. Fact is though they had a 60 point defenseman that could run a powerplay with the best of them. The Rangers had been looking for that guy for 2 decades. Morris, Kotalik, Shttenkirk, Yandle, etc. Yes he had warts, warts that made him less desirable. If nobody wanted him then why give him anything close to what they gave him in contract? If they didn't want him or he had become so toxic why not just let him go? At the very least if he was so toxic and you were only giving him 2 periods and a slammed penalty box door why not trade him for whatever you can get for him.

 

Pete you are saying there was no takers for him. You're not saying that this summer nobody would take him at all, are you? Or is it the Rangers overvalued him and didn't get their asking price? Those are vastly different things. Hindsight is not hard on this one. He was on the end of his leash here this summer, obviously with how short it was 2 periods in. They can't be so stupid that they didn't think there would be another issue, so then why not take the best offer and move on?

 

The asset management here is almost criminal. Gorton should be following TDA out the door for this alone. Incompetent

[Pete]

Josh is saying it is horrible asset control, which it is. They fortunately can buy him out with minimal pain in the off season. Fact is though they had a 60 point defenseman that could run a powerplay with the best of them. The Rangers had been looking for that guy for 2 decades. Morris, Kotalik, Shttenkirk, Yandle, etc. Yes he had warts, warts that made him less desirable. If nobody wanted him then why give him anything close to what they gave him in contract? If they didn't want him or he had become so toxic why not just let him go? At the very least if he was so toxic and you were only giving him 2 periods and a slammed penalty box door why not trade him for whatever you can get for him.

 

Pete you are saying there was no takers for him. You're not saying that this summer nobody would take him at all, are you? Or is it the Rangers overvalued him and didn't get their asking price? Those are vastly different things. Hindsight is not hard on this one. He was on the end of his leash here this summer, obviously with how short it was 2 periods in. They can't be so stupid that they didn't think there would be another issue, so then why not take the best offer and move on?

 

The asset management here is almost criminal. Gorton should be following TDA out the door for this alone. Incompetent

That's not exactly what I said. I said the Rangers couldn't find a taker, which may mean that yes, their asking price may have come into play.

 

I'm sure there's a team that might want him and may take a chance on him as UFA, but not right now at his cap hit—and the Rangers don't want to take a bad deal back, so we are where we are. The only thing that's clear is that no team wants him around their young players.

[siddious]

Josh is saying it is horrible asset control, which it is. They fortunately can buy him out with minimal pain in the off season. Fact is though they had a 60 point defenseman that could run a powerplay with the best of them. The Rangers had been looking for that guy for 2 decades. Morris, Kotalik, Shttenkirk, Yandle, etc. Yes he had warts, warts that made him less desirable. If nobody wanted him then why give him anything close to what they gave him in contract? If they didn't want him or he had become so toxic why not just let him go? At the very least if he was so toxic and you were only giving him 2 periods and a slammed penalty box door why not trade him for whatever you can get for him.

 

Pete you are saying there was no takers for him. You're not saying that this summer nobody would take him at all, are you? Or is it the Rangers overvalued him and didn't get their asking price? Those are vastly different things. Hindsight is not hard on this one. He was on the end of his leash here this summer, obviously with how short it was 2 periods in. They can't be so stupid that they didn't think there would be another issue, so then why not take the best offer and move on?

 

The asset management here is almost criminal. Gorton should be following TDA out the door for this alone. Incompetent

 

If they let a 60pt defenseman walk in the off season you'd be calling Gorton incompetent either way.

 

He put up 60 pts, they tried to trade him (it was reported multiple times) and no one wanted him. So they signed him hoping to move him at a later point- instead he came into camp and acted like a tool which led to them just giving up on him.

 

Its been like 2 months I don't get why you keep harping on this point- I am sure they would have gotten something for him if they could have. This is, was and will continue to be on TDA.

[josh]

If they let a 60pt defenseman walk in the off season you'd be calling Gorton incompetent either way.

 

He put up 60 pts, they tried to trade him (it was reported multiple times) and no one wanted him. So they signed him hoping to move him at a later point- instead he came into camp and acted like a tool which led to them just giving up on him.

 

Its been like 2 months I don't get why you keep harping on this point- I am sure they would have gotten something for him if they could have. This is, was and will continue to be on TDA.

 

None of this disproves that it was bad asset management.

 

 

We're talking about losing a young 60 pt defenseman entering his prime, not for nothing, but have to buy him out.

Forget your love or hate for the guy, his view, etc - that's horrible asset management.

[Capt]

That's not exactly what I said. I said the Rangers couldn't find a taker, which may mean that yes, their asking price may have come into play.

 

I'm sure there's a team that might want him and may take a chance on him as UFA, but not right now at his cap hit—and the Rangers don't want to take a bad deal back, so we are where we are. The only thing that's clear is that no team wants him around their young players.

 

How is that clear? Because nobody wanted to take him on loan to their AHL team? They don't own his rights so they maybe they just don't want him taking valuable ice time from guys they are trying to develop. You're probably right that some teams think that way but every team's situation is different and to make a blanket statement like that is not fair.

 

There are many factors to why he hasn't been moved which you touched upon. Contract is a huge one especially within a flat cap. It's just not as simple as he's a terrible person.

[josh]

I imagine the AHL options were extremely limited. Most teams are playing only a few teams due to travel restrictions. this shortened COVID season was a factor

[4EverRangerFrank]

Before there was a Lemon Law the consumer was at the mercy of the auto dealer and I think it's similar to this situation.

 

1. You see that shiny new car and you buy it in good faith that it works well.

2. When problems arise, you take it back to the dealer and they do some repairs for you.

3. A little while later you have more problems and go back to the dealer and they refuse to help you.

4. You're stuck with a car payment and a bad car.

 

Does this mean you made a bad decision in the first place?

 

I'd say no, and similarly the NYR organization saw ADA as a shiny vehicle to drive us to greatness. It didn't work out because the problem is with the car, not the owner.

[josh]

If they let a 60pt defenseman walk in the off season you'd be calling Gorton incompetent either way.

 

He put up 60 pts, they tried to trade him (it was reported multiple times) and no one wanted him. So they signed him hoping to move him at a later point- instead he came into camp and acted like a tool which led to them just giving up on him.

 

Its been like 2 months I don't get why you keep harping on this point- I am sure they would have gotten something for him if they could have. This is, was and will continue to be on TDA.

 

That's just not true. DeAngelo's personality was a known commodity, as proven time and time again by people pointing out his past. His issues that led to his departure were the same issues as in the past - the penalty was a repeat offense, and saying stuff in the lockerroom isnt something new either.