paddynyc Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 I can't think of one good reason why the Isles wouldn't trade him at the deadline. Not one. And I can think of even fewer why JT would want to stay. I don't disagree with this, but trading him would look bad for this organization. If they keep him and then he leaves they can at least say they tried. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Future Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 I don't disagree with this, but trading him would look bad for this organization. If they keep him and then he leaves they can at least say they tried. Why? Spin it as a rebuild and you're fine. I mean, there's been a ton of discourse the last couple of months about how NY fans can buy a rebuild, I don't see why they wouldn't for the Isles, especially since their terrible anyways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjweimar Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 Well he's going to get a lot more than Toews, and he can get the same offer from a lot of teams. Any of the no income tax states could crush a NYI offer, in terms of money. Florida only has $64m committed to next year and has nobody of consequence up for a new contract. Vegas could make it rain. Dallas has only $57m committed to next year even WITH Spezza and Hanzal, but do need to pick up a couple of their ELCs. I actually think Dallas makes the most sense, because JT, Benn, Seguin, Radulov would be the best top-6 in the NHL. Spezza comes off the book after next year, or you can buy him out and save $5m to address depth immediately, if you need to. Attendance can't go down much more, and by the time the new arena is ready, JT will be, what, 31? They aren't going to draw until then anyways. The team could, in theory, be competitive by then (though I doubt it), but why would he want to wait another 3 years.Adding JT to Dallas would be massive imagine him Seguin, Benn, Radulov, Klingberg powerplay... but I believe Seguin and Klingberg will be up for raises soon Sent from my [device_name] using http://Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile app powered by Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Future Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 Adding JT to Dallas would be massive imagine him Seguin, Benn, Radulov, Klingberg powerplay... but I believe Seguin and Klingberg will be up for raises soon Sent from my [device_name] using http://Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile app powered by Tapatalk Seguin is up after next year, but Klingberg, Radulov and Benn are all locked up until at least 2021-22. But I don't think they'd have too much trouble getting him locked up, especially as Spezza comes off the books at the same time. The bigger question mark, I think, would be Esa Lindell. Luckily, Klingberg is only making $4.25, so that might drive down Lindell's cost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
josh Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 Why? Spin it as a rebuild and you're fine. I mean, there's been a ton of discourse the last couple of months about how NY fans can buy a rebuild, I don't see why they wouldn't for the Isles, especially since their terrible anyways. This is a team that has made the playoffs 3 times in the past 11 seasons. They have a franchise center. They are on the verge of being competitive every season, for a decade. This mentality shows a huge disconnect between recently spoiled Rangers fans and how organizations view success. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjweimar Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 Seguin is up after next year, but Klingberg, Radulov and Benn are all locked up until at least 2021-22. But I don't think they'd have too much trouble getting him locked up, especially as Spezza comes off the books at the same time. The bigger question mark, I think, would be Esa Lindell. Luckily, Klingberg is only making $4.25, so that might drive down Lindell's cost.That's a scary group Lindell is turning into a real good player, Klingberg is probably front runner for Norris, and Bishop has been at least decent Sent from my [device_name] using http://Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile app powered by Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Future Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 This is a team that has made the playoffs 3 times in the past 11 seasons. They have a franchise center. They are on the verge of being competitive every season, for a decade. This mentality shows a huge disconnect between recently spoiled Rangers fans and how organizations view success. The Islanders? Because they're not even close. They have exactly 2 - Barzal and Beauvillier - impact players under the age of 27, and we don't know what Barzal will be able to do against #1 d-pairs without JT to do all of the heavy lifting. They have 0 prospects making any impact in the A. Bailey is a FA you can't re-sign if JT comes back and Anders Lee isn't going to shoot 20% forever. Keeping JT would set them back a decade, and they're in a crappy place to start anyways. They have 1 good defender and no goalies. They are on the verge of being the worst team in the league and loaded with heavy contracts than they are a contender. Take away JT, and they're exactly the same as the Sabres. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
josh Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 That's something you say on a message board when you are trying to steal a team's top player. Most fans, management, players, will do what they can to get in the playoffs, especially when they are used to NOT being in the playoffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 The Islanders? Because they're not even close. They have exactly 2 - Barzal and Beauvillier - impact players under the age of 27, and we don't know what Barzal will be able to do against #1 d-pairs without JT to do all of the heavy lifting. They have 0 prospects making any impact in the A. Bailey is a FA you can't re-sign if JT comes back and Anders Lee isn't going to shoot 20% forever. Keeping JT would set them back a decade, and they're in a crappy place to start anyways. They have 1 good defender and no goalies. They are on the verge of being the worst team in the league and loaded with heavy contracts than they are a contender. Take away JT, and they're exactly the same as the Sabres. Why can't they just move the crappy contracts? It's been said here over and over again that players under 30 with bad contracts can be moved. It was the theory behind locking up Miller to a long term deal. Why is this any different? Why would the Isles dump the super star and keep the average guys with bad contracts moving forward? They're stuck with Ladd, but the others? I'd imagine they can be dumped. The Isles can't go into building a new arena with the premise of keeping the shit and cutting costs. I don't see that as a reasonable idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Future Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 That's something you say on a message board when you are trying to steal a team's top player. Most fans, management, players, will do what they can to get in the playoffs, especially when they are used to NOT being in the playoffs. I don't want the Rangers to sign JT soooo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Future Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 Why can't they just move the crappy contracts? It's been said here over and over again that players under 30 with bad contracts can be moved. It was the theory behind locking up Miller to a long term deal. Why is this any different? Why would the Isles dump the super star and keep the average guys with bad contracts moving forward? They're stuck with Ladd, but the others? I'd imagine they can be dumped. The Isles can't go into building a new arena with the premise of keeping the shit and cutting costs. I don't see that as a reasonable idea. What crappy contracts can they move? Who is going to trade for Cizikas, Clutterbuck and Boychuck? Those guys are worth nothing - maybe you can get lucky and dump one to a cap floor team. But the bigger problem than moving bad contracts is the additional contracts they'd have to give. In this offseason and the next, Bailey, Eberle, Lee and de Haan are all up. Those contracts would all start when these guys are 28, and they're all going to require term. If you keep them all, you're marginally better over the next year or two but still have no D and no goalie, and then, 4 years from now, you're paying them all big contracts when they're 32. With so much committed, you can't sign a big name D or a top goalie. Here's what it could look like to start 19-20. JT - $12m Bailey - $5.5m Ladd - $5.5m Lee - $6m Eberle - $6.5m Beauvillier - $4m Cizikas - $3.3m Clutterbuck - $3.5m Boychuk - $6m Leddy - $5.5m de Haan - $4m Greiss - $3.3m That is absolutely BRUTAL. $65.1m committed and you don't have a top D pair, a goalie, a third line, or Barzal locked up. It's a team that still wouldn't be able to keep pucks out of its own net, and would be stuck together way past 30. You also have to look at it not as keeping these guys in lieu of JT, it's keeping those guys plus the colossal return he'd get you, plus whatever parts you can add with the extra cap space. For $12m, you could, theoretically, sign an entire top D pair. Considering the fact that this is the worst defensive team in hockey by a mile, that might be a smart idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sod16 Posted February 2, 2018 Author Share Posted February 2, 2018 At least with the state of the Rangers we don't have to look at an Islander franchise in better shape. I'll be curious to see how ownership enjoys maintaining a cap maxed payroll with the guaranteed lowest gate in the league for the next three years. You don't have to be a Rangers fan to say that JT would be an idiot to sign with them. I doubt his agent is an idiot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paddynyc Posted February 11, 2018 Share Posted February 11, 2018 Bumping this back up with the fire sale do the Rangers make a move on Tavares when he becomes a UFA? Which would mean no Nash or Grabner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
josh Posted February 11, 2018 Share Posted February 11, 2018 Bumping this back up with the fire sale do the Rangers make a move on Tavares when he becomes a UFA? Which would mean no Nash or Grabner Signing Tavares means not resigning any UFA, and moving at least one other contract. It also mean the Rangers would be targeting guys that could be impact players in 1-2 seasons. He's not going to a team thats in full-rebuild, he's already done that most of his NHL career. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamsim67 Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 They need to get younger, and they need to get better on the defensive side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarryBiv Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 Sure. Swap Nash and Grabner for Tavaras. Where does that put them? 8th? Is that the goal? If the Rangers are going to rebuild, rebuild. This stop gap shit has been a problem since 2014. Spot on dude. The only way they would be better is to ADD Taveras TO Nash and Grabs. Nasher's discount becomes Grabs earned raise. Not the way to go. But we will, we are the Rangers. I say go ALL OUT, bye bye McD. Keep Zuccha for the fans we still need some leadership for the kids, and no one gives 100% more than he. Smith needs to get his shit together and if he does then losing McD wouldn't hurt quite as much. Getting these younger "studs" in return is what we need to get and get "yesterday"! I'm not getting any younger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrooksBurner Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 Signing Tavares means not resigning any UFA, and moving at least one other contract. It also mean the Rangers would be targeting guys that could be impact players in 1-2 seasons. He's not going to a team thats in full-rebuild, he's already done that most of his NHL career. How many competitive teams have the cap space to sign him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sod16 Posted February 12, 2018 Author Share Posted February 12, 2018 I think it is odd that the media has been in a frenzy about the Rangers' plans the past few weeks while being very quiet about Tavares. Are the Islanders really going to risk getting nothing for him? Why does there not seem to be a final push to sign him before the deadline? They'd be fools to expect a Stamkos from him if they don't sign him now. Very strange. May be things far more significant going on behind the scenes than anything going on with the Rangers, although I think if they were offering him on the trade market it would be immediately leaked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
josh Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 How many competitive teams have the cap space to sign him? You make the cap space to sign him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrooksBurner Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 You make the cap space to sign him. I don't think a bunch of upper echelon teams are looking to clear out 12 mill worth of cap space to sign him. Luckily for Tavares, the Leafs have cap space and that's where he will most likely be going if he leaves the Isles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
josh Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 Not sure how you can say teams wont make room for him, then list Toronto, who is in the worst cap situation in the league, moving forward... and they'd STILL sign him if they could. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 What crappy contracts can they move? Who is going to trade for Cizikas, Clutterbuck and Boychuck? Those guys are worth nothing - maybe you can get lucky and dump one to a cap floor team. But the bigger problem than moving bad contracts is the additional contracts they'd have to give. In this offseason and the next, Bailey, Eberle, Lee and de Haan are all up. Those contracts would all start when these guys are 28, and they're all going to require term. If you keep them all, you're marginally better over the next year or two but still have no D and no goalie, and then, 4 years from now, you're paying them all big contracts when they're 32. With so much committed, you can't sign a big name D or a top goalie. Here's what it could look like to start 19-20. JT - $12m Bailey - $5.5m Ladd - $5.5m Lee - $6m Eberle - $6.5m Beauvillier - $4m Cizikas - $3.3m Clutterbuck - $3.5m Boychuk - $6m Leddy - $5.5m de Haan - $4m Greiss - $3.3m That is absolutely BRUTAL. $65.1m committed and you don't have a top D pair, a goalie, a third line, or Barzal locked up. It's a team that still wouldn't be able to keep pucks out of its own net, and would be stuck together way past 30. You also have to look at it not as keeping these guys in lieu of JT, it's keeping those guys plus the colossal return he'd get you, plus whatever parts you can add with the extra cap space. For $12m, you could, theoretically, sign an entire top D pair. Considering the fact that this is the worst defensive team in hockey by a mile, that might be a smart idea. I forgot about this thread. I think Boychuk is actually pretty good. A very good compliment to a top pairing D man. Leddy as well. They will make about 500k to a mill more than they should, but its hardly a problem. DeHaan aint bad either. If these are the players you feel would be hard to move, I disagree big time. Cizikas isnt a good but its hardly crippling the organization if they give him what you suggest. Ladds deal is a killer. Eberle is not producing to that contract, and they have about a mill too much tied up in their goalie situation as it is. Im not sure whats so hard about dumping a contract or two. If teams are willing to take on David Clarkson and Nathan Horton contracts, I dont see how nobody would take Leddy, Cizikis, or Clutterbuck. Guys like Lee, they absolutely need to resign. Not sure about Eberle. They constantly have a rookie rotating into the lineup every season. So that can help them make decisions a little easier on some of these guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 You make the cap space to sign him. Like dumping Nash, McD, Miller, and possibly Zucc? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phillyb Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 Like dumping Nash, McD, Miller, and possibly Zucc? Effectively, yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrooksBurner Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 Not sure how you can say teams wont make room for him, then list Toronto, who is in the worst cap situation in the league, moving forward... and they'd STILL sign him if they could. http://www.spotrac.com/nhl/cap/2018/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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