LindG1000

Right, seeing as my last post was apparently not clear enough... The thread about Tony being waived was closed because it became an endless circlejerk. This thread is about trading Tony DeAngelo and the return, not the mechanics of his leaving, not the perceived grievances, not whining about cancel culture or whatever the fuck being held accountable for your actions is called today, not the behind the scenes stuff that led up to it, and not the bullshit that other thread descended into. Do not turn this thread into the other thread. Stay on topic.

We've literally beaten this to death and ran it in circles already. Any news on the trade?

Nope. And NHL.tv obeys its lovely blackout rules. So I'm stuck with Pee Air.

Gauthier, I think.

God I fucking hate Pierre McGuire.

It's not so much "is he better" more than it's "how he plays" Guy is a meat and potatoes kind of player. We're not exactly swimming in them.

Now you're getting it. It's not just one or two little mistakes. As the front office said, repeatedly, it's a long history of consistent issues that ranged from generally normal stuff to threatening fans on Twitter. You're right, but when you're part of a team, your assessment as a worker is more than what you do in your chief job responsibility. Like, for example, how you carry yourself when you're asked to take on different responsibilities for a bit. Or, how you treat you team. Or how you respond to feedback. Let's take your buddy Greg. He fucked up, and I'm betting you showed him how to not make that mistake again, yeah? I'm betting he was grateful for the feedback even though he knows he fucked up. And, I'm betting he didn't throw a hissy fit and make you the bad guy about it, then constantly bring it up for weeks after. By the by, the analogy you're looking for here is not an All Star CF with a gold glove award struggling. Baseball actually had someone quite like Tony DeAngelo. It's John Rocker. Young guy, gets a crack at the show, is lights out, but cannot fucking control himself and washes out. I've already gone over the stats; at best, he's struggling, at worst, he quit on the team. It's almost impossible to be as bad defensively as he's been and stay in the NHL, especially if you're going to stop scoring too.

Fuck that. With that mustache, you'd need to run a background check against the sex offender database.

And has a mustache that would make an ice cream truck driver blush.

Oh, sure. I just don't see him ever really being a 30/30 guy or something; he had one really good year in Juniors and that's about it. He's a pain in the ass with some decent talent.

So your argument is that Tony is being singled out for being a Trump supporter and unless they prove otherwise, you're right, despite the long, confirmed history of general displeasure with Tony dating back to roughly last March of poor play, poor sportsmanship, poor representation of the brand and organization, being a poor teammate, and generally, a paper trail that would get any of us shitcanned. That's not an argument that really flows well at all.

I think this is Vince Mercogliano's podcast, New Ice City

If you'd like to defend his play by blaming the rest of the team, you're missing the part where he's part of the team and if he's such a key offensive cog, why he didn't do anything to change that. As I said in another post, you could have given him a pass, but based on what he's been doing, it'd just skip right over his stick and into the neutral zone. If you'd like to defend his play with outcomes...by all means. I'm all ears, because his outcomes paint the picture of a lazy, uninterested, and frankly, bad player. If you'd like to defend his play with the past, it's worth noting that what he did last year and what he's been doing since the bubble appear to be very different things. He's lost his spot on the PP to Fox. He's lost ice time to everyone from K'Andre Miller to Anthony Bitetto and Libor Hajek and Jack Johnson. That's not just coaches decision, because each and every one of them have done better than he has in those very spots. It's him. It's his play. It's his attitude. He's the common factor in everything happening "to" him. If your argument is that the Rangers could get more for him without doing what they did? Yeah, you're right. They also could have gotten more for him if he wasn't such an unrelenting asshole that trading for him came with such risks. Possible, sure. Likely, no. Nobody said that there's a long rift between the two. The issue is that DeAngelo has a long history of being an unbearable asshole, and again, the Georgiev incident was the last straw for him in New York.

I wouldn't expect Bennett to be that guy that suddenly goes off and pops a few 50+ point seasons in a row, but I'd love it if he were, say, a Nick Bonino or Mike Fisher type for us. Higher end 3C who can swing up the lineup and play a physical game.

So, what you're saying is that you've got a workplace that tolerates swearing and the occasional mistake. That's great for you. Was that the first time Greg fucked up? Is he going to do it again? Or is this Greg's latest in a string of fuck-ups and you or your supervisor are just too dense to fire him? I didn't realize there was specific exceptionalism to reality when it came to pro sports. Poor performance doesn't get managed in pro sports? Mistakes don't have consequences? Being an asshole to your teammates and a liability to the company isn't the same, because he's an athlete? In one respect, you're right. He's a public figure, which holds him to a higher standard, not a lower one. I know the analogy just shoots holes in the narrative you like, but it holds up for a reason. Right, because the obvious "or whatever he was at" after that clearly meant it was intended to be taken as a serious number. The overarching point that you seem completely unwilling or unable to process is that this isn't about one event. It's about a long, long string of events, of which we're seeing just the tail end of. If you think he's being cut for slamming a door and making a snide comment, you're confidently incorrect.

No, it's not. Fair point.

Man, they DID. They had the conversation after his benching. They probably had this conversation when they acquired him too. Complete speculation, but I'm willing to bet they had it at least once more at some point between those two. There's only so many times you can tell a guy to get his head on straight before you stop thinking about how fucking talented he is and start thinking about whether or not he's actually worth the headache. Bluntly, ADA is stupid talented and is still the fourth most important RD in the organization. He doesn't see it that way, but it's absolutely the case. I think they did. That's why they were desperately trying to trade him before and after the contract. I don't think they were under much of any delusion besides "fuck, if we take this guy to arbitration, we're never trading him". They'd have had to publicly assassinate the guy; his value would have been shot. There's only so much you can do. He's been this way since he was 16. It's been 9 years. Nothing's changed. Quinn was literally the only coach that reached him, and even then, getting even remotely tough on ADA...he snapped right back. He needs to want to be helped before you can just give it to him. You can just keep giving him a pass, but if it's anything like the other passes he's gotten since last March, they'll hop right over his stick and out of the zone anyway. Again, speculation, but I think you're right that there's almost certainly an element of "what are we going to lose if we don't just cut bait now?" to this.

You're conveniently ignoring the constant repeated refrain from MSG leadership that this was a long string of events for DeAngelo. And, again, we do not know what happened with Georgiev. He might have been fined. He might have lost starts. We have no idea. DeAngelo might have said something to him that half the team heard and they all agreed Georgiev went lightly on him. What we do know is this: No guy should be allowed to just go around his workplace talking shit to his co-workers, actively hurting his team outcomes both on-ice and off, acting like a poor teammate when he doesn't get his way, disrespecting his boss, and goading his teammates into fights. You want to work somewhere like that?At your workplace, does that stand? Do you think it should? It's honestly painful watching some of you twist yourselves into pretzels to defend any of this behavior solely to get angry at...what? Just to stan whatever perception of cancel culture makes it okay to be a dick to all your coworkers with no consequences?

That's not his argument. His argument is that he was bad at his job. Which - if he can't deal with in-game bad breaks without throwing a tantrum, can't take feedback, he can't control his emotions, he can't not be a dick to his teammates, and apparently, can't even do what we're paying him to do on the ice (seriously, go look at his play this year and tell me he was doing his job with a straight face) - yeah, he's bad at his job.

We don't know what discipline Georgiev faced, nor do we know what the history is. The only reason we know pieces of DeAngelo's history is because apparently it had gotten bad enough that he's now gone. Unless, of course, you think it appropriate for organizations to air their HR dirty laundry in the media?

It's a matter of time, imo. He's not really doing anything wrong; he's just getting foiled by bad timing or good saves. It's not a great start, but the last few games have looked way, way better. He needs a PPG or two here and he'll be right as rain.

I don't understand why this is so hard to grasp. An issue that basically boiled down to "well, he never got over strike 30 so we finally chucked him after strike 31" isn't the reason why we're here. It's because there were actually 31 (or whatever) strikes. Look, push to shove, the best take I've heard so far on DeAngelo was Sean McIndoe - "It's so sad that cancel culture has gotten to the point where being bad at your job and getting in a fistfight with your coworker gets you fired." Because...yeah, he was playing like rotten garbage, and he clearly couldn't compartmentalize it like a professional. His team looks leaps and bounds better without him on the ice. The superstar forward and starting goalie are literally making fun of him and having fake goalie-skater fist fights post-win. Let's not sit here and pretend that his being out of the locker room hasn't fundamentally changed something, because it's painfully obvious it has. If you don't think what DeAngelo did, even in the short term, was all that bad - just imagine you pulled the same thing at your work - how would your boss handle that?

It's this, so much. He's been an NHLer for years now, and he signed with his hometown team on a bargain basement deal, fought his way up from the taxi squad, and frankly, has played two exemplary games with two very different partners. He's got such a personality too. He really is a kid living his dream in every way, he knows it, and he's not afraid to just live in the moment. As an aside, I learned that his fan nickname on the Preds and Jets was "Potato", which is both kinda funny and gives very new meaning to Jack Johnson's injury status in our GDT

This guy is fuckin' great. What an interview.