Ozzy Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 6 minutes ago, josh said: I think both are skating better, and making quicker on-ice decisions than last season. I do think Quinn had them throwing more pucks on net. Both Kakko and Lafreniere seem like they are trying to find someone to pass it to. They need to start taking more shots, shoot through some screens, maybe get a lucky bounce. They're stuck thinking everything needs to be a backdoor pass for a tap in. Shoot the fucking puck. They both average 1 shot per game in January. I agree, Josh. Neither of them shoot the damn puck! It may be them trying to be to unselfish, and trying to be a good team mate...Fuck that! Shoot the damn thing on goal. Last night Laf hit Gauthier dead on the tape for the tying tally, and Goat blew it! Laff's had chances, and opportunities to get on the scoresheet. That's the good part. They're not going in....that isn't! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Posted January 28, 2022 Author Share Posted January 28, 2022 (edited) If you go back to the year 2000, that's 20 #1OA besides Lafreniere, and the list of players who were not considered to be integral to their team's success or considered the best player on their team is about 3 guys long. Thats a fucking joke. 2000 New York Islanders Rick DiPietro 2001 Atlanta Thrashers Ilya Kovalchuk 2002 Columbus Blue Jackets Rick Nash 2003 Pittsburgh Penguins Marc-Andre Fleury 2004 Washington Capitals Alexander Ovechkin 2005 Pittsburgh Penguins Sidney Crosby 2006 St. Louis Blues Erik Johnson 2007 Chicago Blackhawks Patrick Kane 2008 Tampa Bay Lightning Steven Stamkos 2009 New York Islanders John Tavares 2010 Edmonton Oilers Taylor Hall 2011 Edmonton Oilers Ryan Nugent-Hopkins 2012 Edmonton Oilers Nail Yakupov 2013 Colorado Avalanche Nathan MacKinnon 2014 Florida Panthers Aaron Ekblad 2015 Edmonton Oilers Connor McDavid 2016 Toronto Maple Leafs Auston Matthews 2017 New Jersey Devils Nico Hischier—Still their C 2018 Buffalo Sabres Rasmus Dahlin 2019 New Jersey Devils Jack Hughes 2020 New York Rangers Alexis Lafreniere 2021 Buffalo Sabres Owen Power TBD Edited January 28, 2022 by Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangersIn7 Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 1 hour ago, Ozzy said: I agree, Josh. Neither of them shoot the damn puck! It may be them trying to be to unselfish, and trying to be a good team mate...Fuck that! Shoot the damn thing on goal. Last night Laf hit Gauthier dead on the tape for the tying tally, and Goat blew it! Laff's had chances, and opportunities to get on the scoresheet. That's the good part. They're not going in....that isn't! This kid and Kakko are both going to be excellent. It’s just going to take more time than people want to wait. Long-term, it probably advantageous somewhat in terms of the salary cap. 2nd contracts for these two should be much more affordable and team-friendly. If they were lighting up the scoreboard every night and setting the stat sheet on fire, it could get expensive very fast. Obviously yes, we would all prefer they be scoring and producing more offensively, but we should not be upset with what we are getting nor are we anywhere near a point of panic with either of them. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 54 minutes ago, RangersIn7 said: This kid and Kakko are both going to be excellent. It’s just going to take more time than people want to wait. Long-term, it probably advantageous somewhat in terms of the salary cap. 2nd contracts for these two should be much more affordable and team-friendly. If they were lighting up the scoreboard every night and setting the stat sheet on fire, it could get expensive very fast. Obviously yes, we would all prefer they be scoring and producing more offensively, but we should not be upset with what we are getting nor are we anywhere near a point of panic with either of them. I hope you’re right but what exactly are you seeing from them that makes you feel this confident? I’ve been looking for flashes and there really hasn’t been much. Honestly if they pan out to be middle 6 at this point it’d be a success. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 1 minute ago, Kevin said: I hope you’re right but what exactly are you seeing from them that makes you feel this confident? I’ve been looking for flashes and there really hasn’t been much. Honestly if they pan out to be middle 6 at this point it’d be a success. Exactly, but there was a nice pass night to a plug that didn't get converted. I mean a pass, a pass. And they happen once every 7-8 games on average were he sets somebody up for a slam dunk and we all hold onto there it is there's that sign of amazing skill. Not and end to end rush, not something like this Zegras kid shows 10x's more often. The will and the ability to take over the play at a critical time in the game. While also having the ability to deliver where you sit back and go holy shit he's on a different planet skill wise than both our tough(?) to play against along the boards guy and donut boy. Imagine if our two showed any glimpses of that kind of skill even once not even asking for as often as Zegras does. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jdog99 Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 (edited) It seems most likely to me that the Kakko and Laf disappointment so far has to be related being on the big stage in NYC. Or maybe our culture. I mean these guys skill and work ethic is still apparent, and there were basically ZERO red flags coming into this league. They'd be performing better within another franchise. Edited January 28, 2022 by Jdog99 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cash or Czech Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 2 minutes ago, Jdog99 said: It seems most likely to me that the Kakko and Laf disappointment so far has to be related being on the big stage in NYC. Or maybe our culture. I mean these guys skill and work ethic is still apparent, and there were basically ZERO red flags coming into this league. They'd be performing better within another franchise. But they aren't on the "big stage" Lafreniere is on the 3rd line. Kakko has tagged along with both the Zib/Kreider line and the Panarin/Strome line. There's no pressure to perform. We are succeeding without them. But there's no sense that if Kreider or Panarin or someone went down with injury, they could step up and replace at least some of that offensive output. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Posted January 28, 2022 Author Share Posted January 28, 2022 I mean I'll say Kakko has shown improvement and skill, just no production. Lafreniere...Work ethic? Maybe? He's willing to hit, kinda....but I can't say that a kid who's out of breath after 35 seconds, always looks gassed wide mouthed sucking wind, never carries the puck to the tough areas of the ice, etc really has work ethic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 (edited) 3 hours ago, Kevin said: You obviously don’t remember Kakko’s first season. He had absolutely no idea what to do in the defensive zone. He could have scored 100 even strength goals himself and still ended up a minus. What Quinn did for him that first year into the second year was a minor miracle. What he needs to do now, though, is learn to adapt his lack of foot speed into some type of offensive threat. There are plenty of guys that have done it but they were probably always a little slower and knew ways to make it work. In Finland Kakko had enough room where it wasn’t particularly noticeable until stepped onto the ice with the best of the best. I don't care if my 2nd OA scoring prospect looks lost in the defensive zone in his rookie season. I care if he gets scoring chances and can carry a line on his own. Get his feet wet and do what he does best, then adapt his game defensively. The fucking kid has looked miserable out there. He is stuck in thinking that he can't take chances or be creative. If that's good coaching at work...? I believe the Quinning has had a lasting effect on them. They don't show one skill that they were drafted for. Edited January 28, 2022 by The Dude Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 37 minutes ago, Jdog99 said: It seems most likely to me that the Kakko and Laf disappointment so far has to be related being on the big stage in NYC. Or maybe our culture. I mean these guys skill and work ethic is still apparent, and there were basically ZERO red flags coming into this league. They'd be performing better within another franchise. Is it still apparent? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 3 hours ago, Ozzy said: I agree, Josh. Neither of them shoot the damn puck! It may be them trying to be to unselfish, and trying to be a good team mate...Fuck that! Shoot the damn thing on goal. Last night Laf hit Gauthier dead on the tape for the tying tally, and Goat blew it! Laff's had chances, and opportunities to get on the scoresheet. That's the good part. They're not going in....that isn't! Gauthier missed one, Strome missed a feed, so and so missed a feed and it's everyone else's fault that he can't get points. Does this fuckin kid not realize he too can shoot the puck? Carry the puck? Go the the net with the puck? Belly aching that nobody has been burying his passes seems to be a common thing. Where can someone find a chart for where players go when they are on the ice? Where they shoot from, or maybe where they pass from? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 52 minutes ago, Jdog99 said: It seems most likely to me that the Kakko and Laf disappointment so far has to be related being on the big stage in NYC. Or maybe our culture. I mean these guys skill and work ethic is still apparent, and there were basically ZERO red flags coming into this league. They'd be performing better within another franchise. I respectfully disagree especially on Laf, I would be concerned about his respiratory system at this point when he's gassed at the sign of the ice. He's so lucky to have been drafted by a team with vets who can carry his non-production while he searches for his next breathe. Him and Kakko not being productive players will hurt this team, you can't have a 1 and a 2 that become just jags and not have that have a negative ripple effect through the line up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jdog99 Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 (edited) 3 hours ago, The Dude said: Is it still apparent? I mean, sure theyre not producing and dont stick out. But you can definitely still see the high end skill with some of the passes laf makes and some above average puck carrying. Keeping the Shootout alive the other night was certainly something. Kakko shows some impressive puck possession and passing ability too from what i can tell. Edited January 28, 2022 by Jdog99 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangersIn7 Posted January 30, 2022 Share Posted January 30, 2022 I’ll be the first to acknowledge that if these two, along with Chytil, were producing offensively, they’d be in much better shape. But I’m honestly not worried. The ability and skill are there. Furthermore, no one said anything regarding either of those two coming into the league and being heavily productive in their first 100-150 games, which is where both of them still are. See where they’re at towards the end of next season and make your evaluation then, when they’ve both got 200-250 NHL GP under their belts. Chytil is another story. Now on the one hand, Chytil doesn’t have the level of ability or ceiling and the expectations attached to him that the other 2 have. But he’s at 250 games at this point and still hasn’t shown much in the way of producing. Its a shame Blais got injured as I thought in the brief sampling, the line of Chytil-Blais-LaFreniere looked good together and their might have been something there. I don’t think they should give up on Chytil. It’s still pretty early and he’s still so young. He’s signed through next season and I have no issue with them keeping him around through then, but if he went elsewhere in a trade, I’d be ok with that too. Continued patience with the other 2 is what’s needed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cash or Czech Posted January 30, 2022 Share Posted January 30, 2022 5 hours ago, RangersIn7 said: I’ll be the first to acknowledge that if these two, along with Chytil, were producing offensively, they’d be in much better shape. But I’m honestly not worried. The ability and skill are there. Furthermore, no one said anything regarding either of those two coming into the league and being heavily productive in their first 100-150 games, which is where both of them still are. See where they’re at towards the end of next season and make your evaluation then, when they’ve both got 200-250 NHL GP under their belts. Chytil is another story. Now on the one hand, Chytil doesn’t have the level of ability or ceiling and the expectations attached to him that the other 2 have. But he’s at 250 games at this point and still hasn’t shown much in the way of producing. Its a shame Blais got injured as I thought in the brief sampling, the line of Chytil-Blais-LaFreniere looked good together and their might have been something there. I don’t think they should give up on Chytil. It’s still pretty early and he’s still so young. He’s signed through next season and I have no issue with them keeping him around through then, but if he went elsewhere in a trade, I’d be ok with that too. Continued patience with the other 2 is what’s needed 1OA 1st NHL Season production Alexis Lafreniere: 56gp 12-9-21 Jack Hughes: 61gp 7-14-21 Rasmus Dahlin: 82gp 9-35-44 Nico Hischier: 82gp 20-32-52 Auston Matthews: 82gp 40-29-69 Connor McDavid: 45gp 16-32-48 Aaron Ekblad: 81gp 12-27-39 Nathan MacKinnon: 82gp 24-39-63 Nail Yakupov: 48gp 17-14-31 Ryan Nugent-Hopkins: 62gp 18-34-52 Aside from Hughes, 1OA are expected to step in right away and be contributors. Hasn't been the case for Lafreniere. His closest comparison was Hughes, who actually started producing in year two unlike Laf. TBH it's really not able to be explained away. He stinks right now. He needs to get in better shape and do more on the ice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-ERIK- Posted February 2, 2022 Share Posted February 2, 2022 Rangers are 10-0 in games Laffy scores a goal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJWantsTheCup Posted February 2, 2022 Share Posted February 2, 2022 All of Lafreniere’s goals have come at five-on-five. Only 30 players have scored as many as 10 goals at five-on-five. Beyond that, Lafreniere left the ice ranked 31st in the NHL with 1.13 five-on-five goals per 60:00 among players with at least 500 minutes. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzy Posted February 2, 2022 Share Posted February 2, 2022 12 minutes ago, RJWantsTheCup said: All of Lafreniere’s goals have come at five-on-five. Only 30 players have scored as many as 10 goals at five-on-five. Beyond that, Lafreniere left the ice ranked 31st in the NHL with 1.13 five-on-five goals per 60:00 among players with at least 500 minutes. Kid's gonna be a winner! If we hung with Kreider all these years, the least we can do is give this fucking kid a chance!! LOL 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuc Posted February 2, 2022 Share Posted February 2, 2022 35 minutes ago, RJWantsTheCup said: All of Lafreniere’s goals have come at five-on-five. Only 30 players have scored as many as 10 goals at five-on-five. Beyond that, Lafreniere left the ice ranked 31st in the NHL with 1.13 five-on-five goals per 60:00 among players with at least 500 minutes. He's also 2nd on the team with 10 ES goals and 4th in GWG goals (3). This while averaging only 13:33 minutes pr game (8th on the team by forwards). His assists numbers are really weird. He's had a bit of bad luck, but he really struggles to impact the game besides a few "easy" goals. 12 assists in 100 NHL games after 77 assists in 52 games in the QMJHL. He's frustrating to watch and he clearly has issues to resolve, but he's gonna be fine. Give him time and eventually more ice time and maybe some PP1 minutes and he'll produce closer to a 1OA than he has so far. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsm7302 Posted February 2, 2022 Share Posted February 2, 2022 1 hour ago, RJWantsTheCup said: All of Lafreniere’s goals have come at five-on-five. Only 30 players have scored as many as 10 goals at five-on-five. Beyond that, Lafreniere left the ice ranked 31st in the NHL with 1.13 five-on-five goals per 60:00 among players with at least 500 minutes. Really hope this means there is a chance and some promise. We can forgo that a few of those goals were open net faux pas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted February 2, 2022 Share Posted February 2, 2022 It was nice to see him finally rip a backhand past the goalie last night rather than a empty net putt. He does get to the right spot which would be hard to teach. Bet he's first in line at the buffet pre/post game too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albatrosss Posted February 2, 2022 Share Posted February 2, 2022 2 years from now no one is going to remember how he scored those goals. 1 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
josh Posted February 2, 2022 Share Posted February 2, 2022 thankfully he didnt take as long as Zibanejad to get over the COVID shit. The legs seem to be back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlairBettsBlocksEverything Posted February 2, 2022 Share Posted February 2, 2022 Gonna toss a grenade in the thread and run away and not come back in 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangersIn7 Posted February 2, 2022 Share Posted February 2, 2022 On 1/30/2022 at 6:48 PM, Cash or Czech said: 1OA 1st NHL Season production Alexis Lafreniere: 56gp 12-9-21 Jack Hughes: 61gp 7-14-21 Rasmus Dahlin: 82gp 9-35-44 Nico Hischier: 82gp 20-32-52 Auston Matthews: 82gp 40-29-69 Connor McDavid: 45gp 16-32-48 Aaron Ekblad: 81gp 12-27-39 Nathan MacKinnon: 82gp 24-39-63 Nail Yakupov: 48gp 17-14-31 Ryan Nugent-Hopkins: 62gp 18-34-52 Aside from Hughes, 1OA are expected to step in right away and be contributors. Hasn't been the case for Lafreniere. His closest comparison was Hughes, who actually started producing in year two unlike Laf. TBH it's really not able to be explained away. He stinks right now. He needs to get in better shape and do more on the ice. All those guys, save for Yakupov, got top-6 minutes as rookies. And even he got more ice time than LaFreniere. While I’m in favor of guys earning those minutes, with top picks, many teams just run them out there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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