Future Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 not really. Also, it's not always a smart move for the defense to be playing how you explained. That creates a flat footed defenseman watching the puck or the player. if you are turned the opposite way and "preventing a man getting to the crease" usually means you have a hand or stick on him - and youll get called for that. Not the first time, or the 2nd time, but word will spread and officials will eliminate it from your game. Teams that do try to play this way get burned, too. Watching Pittsburgh, a lot of opponents d 'cheat' and stay down low. Penguins just stay to the outside, pass around because they , essentially, have a pp. The second those guys come out after the puck, 4 penguins crash the net. This is a wild extrapolation of what I've said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Future Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 You cant move guys out, regardless. Its a penalty. http://ingoalmag.com/technique/choosing-a-defensive-strategy-in-front-of-your-net-fronting-versus-net-side-positioning/ Choosing a Defensive Strategy in Front of your Net – Fronting versus Net-side Positioning This comes AFTER you've already allowed a guy to the front of the net. You've already lost the first battle at this point. Once a shot is on goal and there is a rebound, size and strength become important again. If net-front battles come in 3 parts there is getting to the net, positioning at the net, and competing for a rebound. You're only talking about the second one, and the first and third are both more meaningful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
josh Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 I mentioned everything. When I respond to a specific part, like crease clearing, yes, the discussion will be focused on just that. "protecting the net" involves a lot more than just 3 things, sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sod16 Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 Newsday reports that O'Gara's father at least is a die hard Islander fan. We don't need any kid who grew up chanting "1940" https://www.newsday.com/sports/hockey/rangers/rob-ogara-nick-holden-trade-1.16883025 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giacomin Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 Not to get too involved in this, but to offer a different semantical perspective... ...how about refering to it as "boxing out" and the way you use you size and body for positioning near the slot line and crease. It can even have more intricacies than boxing out does in hoops. Notice though, bigger guys get more rebounds. There is something to Foote have good size and he is supposed to be excellent in his own zone and with positioning. Ironically, he is criticized for not being gritty at all. Very clean player, can take a hit but does not deliver many. This discussion also does not take into account the type of D a team deploys. In the simplest term, is it more like AVs man-to-man D (where slowfooted D men can be more easily exposed?) or a zone D like the Bruins use? Sidenote - Holden will have to learn a whole new system before he gets steady 3rd pair minutes. I believe Roy deployed man D mostly too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThirtyONE Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 It's already gone away. Name one effective crease-clearing defenseman in the NHL today. Brayden Coburn? Is he even still playing? That role is gone. Size helps, maybe, in not getting knocked off the puck. Like Hayes. I'm not sure it has a lick of value in crease-clearing. Not anymore. Sent from my iPhone using Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile app powered by Tapatalk Ehh. I disagree. Canucks just resigned Erik Gudbranson and while the fans aren't happy with it and and analytics guys don't get it, goalies and teammates love the guy. Roberto Luongo said he was greatly missed in front of the net in Florida. Shea Weber is constantly named as one of the worst defenders to play against by opposing forwards. So, I think there is a place for it. It may not be super noticeable to fans but when your goalie is saying it and opposing players are saying it, there's something to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
josh Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 No one is saying to get rid of it. Just dont draft based on it. This team seriously lacks a big bodied defensemen that forces opponents to keep their head up when entering the zone. But the last thing I want to do is use a first round draft pick when we can get that guy off waivers, or for a 5th rd pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzy Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 We should have learned this with the Dylan McIlrath debacle. We have to go for a lethal forward/Franchise forward right now. ...and when I say lethal, I mean LETHAL....a player that make Ovechkin look like Hayes! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThirtyONE Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 No one is saying to get rid of it. Just dont draft based on it. This team seriously lacks a big bodied defensemen that forces opponents to keep their head up when entering the zone. But the last thing I want to do is use a first round draft pick when we can get that guy off waivers, or for a 5th rd pick. Oh, of course. I didn't realize that was the debate. I was just responding to the idea that a crease clearing defenseman doesn't exist. Draft skill, period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lefty9 Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 You cant move guys out, regardless. Its a penalty. http://ingoalmag.com/technique/choosing-a-defensive-strategy-in-front-of-your-net-fronting-versus-net-side-positioning/ Choosing a Defensive Strategy in Front of your Net ? Fronting versus Net-side Positioning http://668d3eaa831be4d52f0d515f.ingoalmagazine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/Fronting.jpg http://668d3eaa831be4d52f0d515f.ingoalmagazine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/Hertz-Positioning_.jpgevery game I watched ,I see defenders move players from in front of their net Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lefty9 Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 I don't think we where debating drafting a big defenseman,especially another mcilrath. In the first round Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 Yeah, so who should have been out there instead? McD, Smith, Girardi... Guys known to be better in their own end and more adept to maybe block a shot, clog a lane or not do something stupid with the puck. Scratch Girardi for that last one... Holden definitely got a bad rap. Much worse than he deserved, but he didn't belong on the ice that late in a playoff game more than once. He just didn't. The other options weren't much better but they were better at that time (I say that because now Smith stinks apparently -- cant believe nobody claimed him. They should try to bring him up and waive him again. Someone will bite).. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
josh Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 oh, last season? sure, a few more options, but you need at least 4 guys you can rotate in the final 4 minutes. We arent putitng DeAngelo, Shattenkirk out there. Smith will be fine. Bad season, not a bad player (still over rated, but not terrible) I expect a bounceback season from him next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 Ranger Lothbrok just posted on the McD message board that Valiquette thinks McD ends up in TB. Anyone think he’s privy to any kind of Ranger management talks? Sent from my iPad using Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile app powered by Tapatalk Id say he has ties and was told by management to say that, to drive the price up and create a bigger market than there really is for him. I'm not so sure the league thinks much of McD anymore. If they did, every team would be knocking down the door to get him. This supposed interest from Tampa as the front runner, makes me rather they keep him and try over the summer to dish him off. B grade prospects, draft picks and 27 year old small centers are not enough of a return. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Posted February 21, 2018 Share Posted February 21, 2018 oh, last season? sure, a few more options, but you need at least 4 guys you can rotate in the final 4 minutes. We arent putitng DeAngelo, Shattenkirk out there. Smith will be fine. Bad season, not a bad player (still over rated, but not terrible) I expect a bounceback season from him next year. This year? Holden should have been their allstar selection. This D stink/ stunk. Sadly, people thought it would be a powerhouse and an upgrade. They got worse. McD especially. In pretty sure the rest of the league noticed that as well, since hes still here and the rumor is some teams filler prospects for the Rangers captain and 1st pairing top D man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProxyCentauri Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 I didn't say Holden was bad at it. I said, when he is bad at it, it's because he's not focused, not because of anything physical. Kreider isn't one of the two or three best net-front scorers in the league without his size. At times the distances between both defenders and the 3.guy- usually a back-checking center- has been too large. Rangers have looked very unbalanced for elongated periods. And I think Holden has been part of that problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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