Jeff Gorton Didn’t Think Tom Wilson Incident Would Cost Jobs

[BrooksBurner]

https://www.nbcsports.com/washington/capitals/former-rangers-gm-jeff-gorton-didnt-think-tom-wilson-incident-would-cost-jobs?cid=Yahoo&partner=ya4nbcs

 

Former New York Rangers general manager Jeff Gorton gave his perspective on the now-infamous Tom Wilson incident during a Capitals-Rangers game May 3, the chaotic aftermath in New York and the team’s hope for tougher players on the Cams and Stricks podcast Tuesday.

 

“I didn't think that night was going to be what it turned into where people are going to lose their jobs,” Gorton said. “And it's going to be forever remembered as what it is.”

 

 

When asked about the controversial statement the Rangers released criticizing the NHL directly, Gorton confirmed that it was written by the team’s ownership and its public relations staff without input from any of the team's hockey executives.

 

“I think that’s fair to say. You might have seen it the first time I did,” Gorton told the podcast hosts.

 

He said there was a lot of talk that week after the Caps-Rangers rematch about the team being proud of the physical way it responded.

 

“It’s probably not the way the league wanted it,” Gorton said. “But it was handled the way they needed to handle it.”

 

However, much like the rest of the world, Gorton did not anticipate that goalmouth scrum turning into a breaking point for the organization.

 

“I mean, obviously, I lost my job. It probably has to be more than that, I don't really know,” Gorton said. “But you can't tell me [Davidson], who loves toughness, didn't know we weren't tough.

 

“I could tell you that all the meetings we had, we talked with [former head coach] David Quinn about everybody, about getting tougher all the time here,” Gorton continued. “We also needed some of these young guys who are playing for us to have to deal with adversity, play through some of this stuff, see how they did with it, too.”

[SaveByRichter35]

Read that yesterday on Blueshirt Banter I think. Clearly Dolan being a sniving cunt.

[Phil]

No, clearly they fundamentally disagreed on the timing of everything.

 

There were numerous other statements he made that made it painfully evident he and JD intended to add physical players once they were comfortable building the team and determining who would stay and who would go:

 

"I get a kick out of people saying we lacked toughness and didn't know it. I knew we weren't that tough. I knew we had to get to it, but I knew we needed ice time for Chytil. Lafreni?re had to play. Kakko had to play a certain amount of minutes [to get him] where we wanted to."

 

"When you have nine, ten, eleven kids that have to play, you have to play them. Then you figure it out. Over time you become more of a team."

 

"Over time, yeah, [tough] guys are completely valuable. That's why you see #NYR go after Goodrow, Reaves. Guys that fill these roles and become more of a team."

 

--

 

The long and short of it is likely this: Dolan was furious watching them get abused. He wanted these infusions now. Gorton and JD likely saw a lot of what they wanted still coming in Schneider, Cuylle, and others, who would continue developing, leaving the team largely exposed (again) this season to suffer more growing pains. Dolan got his way.

 

They both planned to end up here. Dolan just wanted it a lot faster.

[jsm7302]

Gorton had good answers and didn't shy away from answering. I think it is pretty telling that their time frame didn't line up with Dolan but they both had the same goals in mind. Not sure why it wasn't squared away in a closed door meeting instead of a public shaming?

 

edit: Also not sure why some of the kids couldn't play in Hartford while an NHL team was iced with a formidable 4th line.

 

I'm much happier with Gallant but liked what Gorton and JD had going.

[Phil]

Why what wasn't squared away? He "joked" that he talks to JD still damn near every day. He's spoken zero words with Dolan since being fired. They're not mending that fence any time soon.

[jsm7302]

I meant instead of the firing, not instead of Gorton going on a podcast.

[Phil]

If you fundamentally disagree on the timing of a rebuild, that's not something you just "hash out." If the owner says "this is what I want," the GM has two choices. Give it to him, or convince him otherwise. Gorton did neither, and likely stuck to his guns with JD sticking by his side, ergo they're both fired.

[jsm7302]

If you fundamentally disagree on the timing of a rebuild, that's not something you just "hash out." If the owner says "this is what I want," the GM has two choices. Give it to him, or convince him otherwise. Gorton did neither, and likely stuck to his guns with JD sticking by his side, ergo they're both fired.

 

Fair enough and we as fans have what we asked for: A new coach, better direction, complete team and hopefully a 2022 playoff berth.

[Pete]

If you fundamentally disagree on the timing of a rebuild, that's not something you just "hash out." If the owner says "this is what I want," the GM has two choices. Give it to him, or convince him otherwise. Gorton did neither, and likely stuck to his guns with JD sticking by his side, ergo they're both fired.

 

That's a big leap. This sounds more like JD and Gorton didn't even know Dolan's timeline until they got fired.

 

There's nothing about this that "normal".

[Keirik]

Gorton lost his job by hiring Quinn in the first place and going into last offseason with no intention to actually try to win, not by failing to address toughness per say.

 

It kind of goes hand in hand but it just took a bit for the league to look at this roster and decide barbarism and forcing them to keep on the perimeter we’re the easiest two ways to make them fold. Is that on Gorton? Partly? Is that on Quinn? Partly. In the end, one is doing tv and the other is David Quinn.

[Pete]

Gorton lost his job by hiring Quinn in the first place and going into last offseason with no intention to actually try to win, not by failing to address toughness per say.

 

It kind of goes hand in hand but it just took a bit for the league to look at this roster and decide barbarism and forcing them to keep on the perimeter we’re the easiest two ways to make them fold. Is that on Gorton? Partly? Is that on Quinn? Partly. In the end, one is doing tv and the other is David Quinn.

This is more a narrative you're pushing than what actually happened.

 

They weren't trying to win? Come on. That's just ridiculous.

 

Furthermore, even if you want to push that narrative, that team had 3 rookies and 2 players in their 2nd year, a bunch of guys in their early 20s, and if you listen to the whole interview, they needed to give the young kids ice time and they weren't going to bring in any more players to block them. They wanted to see how they handled adversity, and the team folded (granted, they were missing their "tough" players when it happened).

 

So really, anyone saying you can rebuild in NY, and folks that say they'll be ok with losing as long as the kids get their reps... Are trying to sell some shit that I, for one, ain't buyin.

[Sharpshooter]

I just think it's totally a Dolan thing. I don't see things really changing if Gorton was still the GM with the exception of Quinn probably still being here. Perhaps Drury thought he should have been gone a year ago, and wasn't a great hire, or he was simply pressured into doing so, as much as I like Gallant. I still think they'd go ahead and add some toughness to the roster, that was a concern regardless of who the GM was. Also, maybe they knew that Drury was sought after so they wanted to fast track him for the job. Honestly, I'm not too mad that Gorton was fired, but I feel they did do JD dirty, and that bothers me more.

[ThirtyONE]

Gorton took a huge risk going for a true rebuild in NYC, not just because the fans are impatient but because the owner is a child. Yes, he got the approval from the top initially, but he had to know there was always a chance Dolan could fuck the whole thing up.

 

It was clear as day that the team wasn't tough enough. For two seasons that's been the main issue. It had been reported long before the Tom Wilson bullshit that Gorton and JD were going to make changes this summer to make this team into a team. to make the team tougher.

 

Why Dolan couldn't wait 2 weeks to allow them to do it, I don't think I'll ever understand.

 

Personally, I think Dolan flew off the handle about his 11m dollar player being slammed and then exacerbated the issue by embarrassing himself with the letter -- which was pretty much universally ridiculed around the league. Like a kid or a bully who gets embarrassed, they usually have to take it out on some one else, and he did.

 

Really great interview by the way. I don't think we've ever gotten such candid answers from anyone in the organization so soon after leaving.

[Sharpshooter]

I did kind of like Dolan coming out and targeting Parros and that whole department, I won't lie. lol It seemed to reverberate around the league and especially amongst other fans who were actually in support of the calling out. I think a lot of people knew that whole thing was handled poorly and I credit the Rangers for calling out the bullshit.

[Phil]

That's a big leap. This sounds more like JD and Gorton didn't even know Dolan's timeline until they got fired.

 

There's nothing about this that "normal".

 

Maybe, but I'm trying to parse this as best I can. It's a lot harder to believe Dolan simply decided "fuck it, I'm gonna my GM and President today for no reason," than it is to believe what I wrote. Especially when you read all of Gorton's quotes. The sheer volume of times he uses the phrase"over time," as pretext is a Dead giveaway in my mind.

 

 

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[Pete]

Gorton took a huge risk going for a true rebuild in NYC, not just because the fans are impatient but because the owner is a child. Yes, he got the approval from the top initially, but he had to know there was always a chance Dolan could fuck the whole thing up.

 

It was clear as day that the team wasn't tough enough. For two seasons that's been the main issue. It had been reported long before the Tom Wilson bullshit that Gorton and JD were going to make changes this summer to make this team into a team. to make the team tougher.

 

Why Dolan couldn't wait 2 weeks to allow them to do it, I don't think I'll ever understand.

 

Personally, I think Dolan flew off the handle about his 11m dollar player being slammed and then exacerbated the issue by embarrassing himself with the letter -- which was pretty much universally ridiculed around the league. Like a kid or a bully who gets embarrassed, they usually have to take it out on some one else, and he did.

 

Really great interview by the way. I don't think we've ever gotten such candid answers from anyone in the organization so soon after leaving.

Maybe, but I'm trying to parse this as best I can. It's a lot harder to believe Dolan simply decided "fuck it, I'm gonna my GM and President today for no reason," than it is to believe what I wrote. Especially when you read all of Gorton's quotes. The sheer volume of times he uses the phrase"over time," as pretext is a Dead giveaway in my mind.

 

 

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Personally, my guess is that it was brewing because of Dolan's impatience, and it came to a head with Wilson, the tweet, and Dolan probably wanted to shitcan Gorton... JD said it's his call not Dolan's (probably based on principle), so Dolan showed them both the door.

 

That's just my speculation based on what we've heard.

[Phil]

Sure, I can follow all of that, though I think the back to back snuff films that were the Islanders games we know Dolan was in attendance for were major contributing factors.

 

 

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[Pete]

Sure, I can follow all of that, though I think the back to back snuff films that were the Islanders games we know Dolan was in attendance for were major contributing factors.

 

 

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Right, agree. Brewing for awhile but came to a head with Wilson, then the tweet, that was the tangible friction point.

[josh]

It was time for a change. Both in management and the on ice product.

 

The Wilson incident represented what happened to this team for 2 seasons on a semi-regular basis.

[Phil]

Right, agree. Brewing for awhile but came to a head with Wilson, then the tweet, that was the tangible friction point.

 

100%, especially if that PR/Dolan message was sent out without even consulting the team's President. Pretty sure Dolan made up his mind right then and there, especially when JD and Gorton didn't implicitly back it and reportedly sought to distance themselves from it among other league officials and front office members.

[Bugg]

Read that yesterday on Blueshirt Banter I think. Clearly Dolan being a sniving cunt.

 

Leading the NHL in dead cap room year after year to not make the playoffs and watch your team bullied by Wison and the Islanders will do that. This was something that happened suddenly; the Canes pushed them around last August. And if DeAngelo was the uncoachable dick it appears he is, why didn't Gorton and JD cut bait last summer?There were too many nights when the top talent was pushed around and did nothing to not do something about it.

[Keirik]

This is more a narrative you're pushing than what actually happened.

 

They weren't trying to win? Come on. That's just ridiculous.

 

Furthermore, even if you want to push that narrative, that team had 3 rookies and 2 players in their 2nd year, a bunch of guys in their early 20s, and if you listen to the whole interview, they needed to give the young kids ice time and they weren't going to bring in any more players to block them. They wanted to see how they handled adversity, and the team folded (granted, they were missing their "tough" players when it happened).

 

So really, anyone saying you can rebuild in NY, and folks that say they'll be ok with losing as long as the kids get their reps... Are trying to sell some shit that I, for one, ain't buyin.

 

I’m not pushing a narrative. I’m giving my opinion on a message board. Yes they weren’t “trying” to win. That doesn’t mean they were throwing games. It means they were less concerned with getting each and every win and more concerned with getting experience and re-branding an identity for lack of a better word. It’s how Lundqvist eventually got to the point where he only played once every few weeks or so and eventually released. It’s why Quinn was hired in the first place. To rebrand and build for the long term, not specifically win today. It’s just my opinion. That’s all.

[ThirtyONE]

I’m not pushing a narrative. I’m giving my opinion on a message board. Yes they weren’t “trying” to win. That doesn’t mean they were throwing games. It means they were less concerned with getting each and every win and more concerned with getting experience and re-branding an identity for lack of a better word. It’s how Lundqvist eventually got to the point where he only played once every few weeks or so and eventually released. It’s why Quinn was hired in the first place. To rebrand and build for the long term, not specifically win today. It’s just my opinion. That’s all.

 

Well, I partially agree. Hank was the worst of the three goalies in that equation. He wasn't cut loose for a rebrand. He wasn't very good and the bench was full.

[Pete]

I’m not pushing a narrative. I’m giving my opinion on a message board. Yes they weren’t “trying” to win. That doesn’t mean they were throwing games. It means they were less concerned with getting each and every win and more concerned with getting experience and re-branding an identity for lack of a better word. It’s how Lundqvist eventually got to the point where he only played once every few weeks or so and eventually released. It’s why Quinn was hired in the first place. To rebrand and build for the long term, not specifically win today. It’s just my opinion. That’s all.

 

So Gorton got fired because he wanted to play the kids, to get them ice time regardless of wins, and Dolan didn't have patience for that. Seems folks here feel the same way.

 

Which is why I said, when people say you can rebuild in NY...You can't.

[BrooksBurner]

So Gorton got fired because he wanted to play the kids, to get them ice time regardless of wins, and Dolan didn't have patience for that. Seems folks here feel the same way.

 

Which is why I said, when people say you can rebuild in NY...You can't.

 

They didn't commit to the kids enough, and they weren't winning enough to justify that decision. The result was a wishy washy team with no clear direction or timeline, and a team that was getting manhandled physically. In retrospect, can't blame Dolan on this one for feeling how he feels about it.