Vodka Drunkenski Posted October 28, 2018 Share Posted October 28, 2018 He?s a great complimentary first line player on just about any team. Size, speed, shot, physicality, net presence. And a few clutch playoff goals, too. Some of what he does doesn?t show on the scoresheet Closer to a first line player than anyone else on the team. He?s too inconsistent for me to be a first line talent. Maybe that could change if he gets some chemistry with some legit top flight talent, who knows Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
josh Posted October 28, 2018 Share Posted October 28, 2018 Welp, that’s the end of that discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunny Posted October 28, 2018 Share Posted October 28, 2018 Going to have to disagree with you here. He’s unlikely to be considered for the first line on most contending teams. For many of them he’d be unlikely to crack the 2nd line. But that’s just my opinion. I’m happy to agree to disagree. He's literally already been on the first line of a contending team. Year over year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrooksBurner Posted October 28, 2018 Share Posted October 28, 2018 To say Kreider is not capable of helping a team or being the difference between a team winning a Cup or not is incredibly short sighted. He isn't carrying a team to a Cup, but he is exactly the kind of player who can put a team over the top. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giacomin Posted October 28, 2018 Share Posted October 28, 2018 It’s worth pointing out that we didn’t get high end prospects in the McD deal. Gorton & co did well in identifying tier 2 prospects worth taking. I wouldn't call them Tier 2, Howden was raising eyebrows after being drafted in the 1st, averaging 1.6 PPG and unexpectedly getting the captaincy at Moosejaw and Team Canada. The Rangers targeted him from the get go. The rumor was the Rangers and Tampa thought Hajek was in the same untradeable category as Cal Foote. It appears teams had a higher ranking on Hajek than the mainstream press. It took adding JT Miller to get Hajek and make that deal happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodka Drunkenski Posted October 28, 2018 Share Posted October 28, 2018 I don?t think Howden is top end talent, still very good but I believe Hajek is, who the trade was centered around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gravesy Posted October 28, 2018 Share Posted October 28, 2018 He's literally already been on the first line of a contending team. Year over year. Go on and tell me which contending teams you think will be likely to trade for him and play him on the first line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gravesy Posted October 28, 2018 Share Posted October 28, 2018 To say Kreider is not capable of helping a team or being the difference between a team winning a Cup or not is incredibly short sighted. He isn't carrying a team to a Cup, but he is exactly the kind of player who can put a team over the top. Yes, but he’s probably not enough of a difference maker for teams to trade their best prospects to get him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
josh Posted October 28, 2018 Share Posted October 28, 2018 Go on and tell me which contending teams you think will be likely to trade for him and play him on the first line. Pittsburgh, TB, Boston, Toronto (not Washington) Maybe 2nd line for Nashville and Avs due to chemistry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gravesy Posted October 28, 2018 Share Posted October 28, 2018 Pittsburgh, TB, Boston, Toronto (not Washington) Maybe 2nd line for Nashville and Avs due to chemistry. That’s just crazy talk imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
josh Posted October 28, 2018 Share Posted October 28, 2018 That’s just crazy talk imo. Get crazy and tell me which team he doesn’t crack the top 6. This is just ironic coming from a guy using the handle Gravesy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gravesy Posted October 28, 2018 Share Posted October 28, 2018 Nashville has Forsberg and Arvidsson as their first 2 LWs. Boston have Marchand and DeBrusk. Sharks have Kane and Meier. Etc. Tampa possibly but I’m not sure he’s an upgrade on Palat and Gourde. If these guys were half as good as you seem to think we wouldn’t have needed a rebuild. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giacomin Posted October 28, 2018 Share Posted October 28, 2018 Nashville has Forsberg and Arvidsson as their first 2 LWs. Boston have Marchand and DeBrusk. Sharks have Kane and Meier. Etc. Tampa possibly but I’m not sure he’s an upgrade on Palat and Gourde. If these guys were half as good as you seem to think we wouldn’t have needed a rebuild. No he's not cracking Boston's or Nashville's top line, that is crazy talk. But if those two teams or the Avs want to really compete for the Cup they need a potent 2nd line. If not Tampa, Toronto and the Jets will swarm them in this year's playoffs because of potent scoring depth and speed. Sure he's an upgrade in Tampa and a need in Colorado and Vegas. The Avs think they are going to compete with the Jets and Preds this year. I didn't believe them either, but they are playing better than the Jets as of now. McKinnon is the beast of beasts. We are not sending him to Pitt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gravesy Posted October 28, 2018 Share Posted October 28, 2018 My problem here is that this is a guy who has broken 50 points once in his career, yet Im being told he’s a guy that would walk onto most contending teams 1st lines and they’d be willing to give up their farms to get him. Sorry, I don’t buy it. It’s textbook NY Rangers fanitis. He’s a pretty good player that could do a job for a number of teams. No more, no less. In my opinion, of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giacomin Posted October 28, 2018 Share Posted October 28, 2018 My problem here is that this is a guy who has broken 50 points once in his career, yet Im being told he’s a guy that would walk onto most contending teams 1st lines and they’d be willing to give up their farms to get him. Sorry, I don’t buy it. It’s textbook NY Rangers fanitis. He’s a pretty good player that could do a job for a number of teams. No more, no less. In my opinion, of course. If he can play at the consistent level he did after coming back (lighter) from the blood clot, he's more. He's entered his prime, he's healthy, so if he does not take that next step he appeared ready to take, then you're right. He's merely pretty good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giacomin Posted October 28, 2018 Share Posted October 28, 2018 He?s too inconsistent for me to be a first line talent. Maybe that could change if he gets some chemistry with some legit top flight talent, who knows We were hoping he'd pickup where he left off, but not yet. Still early, but it is time for more than excellent net front presence. Wish they had a legit top 6 RW on that line Appreciate the PM, I'm good. Glad we could let it go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunny Posted October 28, 2018 Share Posted October 28, 2018 It's not about whether he immediately slots in to a 1st line here or there. It's that he can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Posted October 28, 2018 Share Posted October 28, 2018 He’s a great complimentary first line player on just about any team. Size, speed, shot, physicality, net presence. And a few clutch playoff goals, too. Some of what he does doesn’t show on the scoresheet Closer to a first line player than anyone else on the team. I feel the same. How many goals would he have as Crosby's wing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4EverRangerFrank Posted October 28, 2018 Share Posted October 28, 2018 I feel the same. How many goals would he have as Crosby's wing? This is what I?ve been thinking about too. With legit talent, albeit high-end talent I think Kreider could score a hundred goals. The key is that his production would be dependent upon the work of others. He?s not the main scoring catalyst. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted October 29, 2018 Share Posted October 29, 2018 I don?t want another Spooner or Namestnikov, though. Potential top-end talent. Hopefully a team gets desperate at deadline and willing to do it. That's not what I mean. I'm talking about on the cusp prospects. Guys locked out due to depth or ready to play next season. On the Winnipeg note, think Appleton and/or Niku. Sent from my iPhone using Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile app powered by Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
josh Posted October 29, 2018 Share Posted October 29, 2018 That's not what I mean. I'm talking about on the cusp prospects. Guys locked out due to depth or ready to play next season. On the Winnipeg note, think Appleton and/or Niku. Sent from my iPhone using Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile app powered by Tapatalk And I assume that, but I demand more than a Howden type player. And top prospects are hard to come by. When dealing Kreider, with a year left, it needs to be a can’t miss prospect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted October 29, 2018 Share Posted October 29, 2018 And I assume that, but I demand more than a Howden type player. And top prospects are hard to come by. When dealing Kreider, with a year left, it needs to be a can’t miss prospect. Well, I doubt they're getting Vesalainen in any deal, so it's Appleton and Niku. After that, it's a sizable drop. Unless they look at roster players currently. Roslovic or Petan, maybe? Or, here's a crazy idea: with Laine and Connor both due new deals, what are the odds of Ehlers getting flipped? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gravesy Posted October 29, 2018 Share Posted October 29, 2018 It's not about whether he immediately slots in to a 1st line here or there. It's that he can. No, that's not the discussion. At least it's not the discussion I'm trying to have. The discussion is whether a contender would trade for him as a 1st line player and pay accordingly. I don't disagree he's a guy that can play up and down the lineup for most teams in the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Future Posted October 29, 2018 Share Posted October 29, 2018 It's not about whether he immediately slots in to a 1st line here or there. It's that he can. No, that's not the discussion. At least it's not the discussion I'm trying to have. The discussion is whether a contender would trade for him as a 1st line player and pay accordingly. I don't disagree he's a guy that can play up and down the lineup for most teams in the league. Kind of saying the same thing lol. I think the "First-line" idea is being overblown with Kreider. He's a bonafide top-6 player, and teams will pay for that at the deadline, whether he fits on the first line or not. Teams will pay a first-line price, but play Kreider on the second line, if it, effectively, gives them two first lines. Too early to say right now who is and isn't a contender, but Colorado, Nashville, Chicago, Carolina, Pitt, St Louis would all kind of fit in that mold, I think. I also wonder if there's something to be done with a Kreider/Panarin swap. Rangers get their guy, and CBJ gets a top-6 winger back for the playoffs. They're not a 1-for-1 in talent, but the economics of it might make some sense for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gravesy Posted October 29, 2018 Share Posted October 29, 2018 We'll see. I don't mind that Panarin idea. But the question then would be whether moving Kreider is a good idea if we're going the Panarin route. And obviously what one of the contenders would be willing to give up for Panarin at the deadline, which I imagine would be quite a lot for a team in win now mode. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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