Targets to Break the Rangers' Homogeneity?

Hyman would be great but he's doing to get PAID. That's probably a $6-7 million player, no?

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile app powered by Tapatalk

I never pay for Hyman.

AHAHAHAAHAHAHHAHHAHA

Yeah, I don't know if we could afford Hyman without other moves.

But if we're looking to add grit we probably shouldn't be thinking in the Tkachuk/Hyman/Greenway tier

and be looking to add in the Foligno/Simmonds tier.

It's whether you're looking to add grit in the top two lines (damn hard to find candidates without overpaying) or grit in the bottom two lines.

The Islanders Martin-Cizikas-Clutterbuck line is more than I'd want to spend

https://www.capfriendly.com/teams/islanders

but it's a pain in the ass to play against.

When you look at the Islanders their roster construction makes a lot of sense for the team identity.

With all our young players I don't think I've seen a team philosophy or identity take shape. Usually that's coach driven, but players need to be able to know their roles within a system.

I'm probably in the minority, but I would give up on Kakko and not bat an eyelash, so if it's Kakko, Robertson (I want Schneider), Chytil, and a 2021 first for Tkachuk and say Calgary's second, I'd do it. But I also have less hope in Kakko than most of you do.

I’d give up on him too. I’d give up on Buch though too so I’d give both Ottawa and Calgary the choice. I still think they’d decline anyway but I suppose it’s worth the chance.

I never pay for Hyman.

Same. I'm married, too.

I don't buy into the fact that homogeneity is the problem here. You think this team isn't a contender in two years if Trotz is the coach? DQ hasn't won a playoff game in the NHL - let's start there. Tampa won last year with a similar team, they didn't win bc Patrick Maroon showed up, I promise. They won because they lost enough times to put it all together.

Without any additions to fit the style of game Trotz asks? Nope, I'm not confident. Look at the teams he's coached. Look at the composition of the roster he won with. He's always had the proper mix of skill and toughness.

Tampa were no pushovers. We've been through this. Not a single defender under 6'0. Killorn, Paquette, Maroon, Coleman, Goodrow, Cernak, and Bogosian? The Rangers are not similar at all. The closest roster they compare to is Toronto's prior to last off-season.

I agree they were battle-tested, but they won because they had the right composition and roster mix. They already had Maroon and they added Goodrow and Coleman at the deadline if I recall. They didn't double, but tripled down on grit.

I say this, I’d be shocked if either Tkachuk were obtainable for anything less than STARTiNG with ALF. Despite his poor season I think he still has exponential value. Chytil no. Buch maybe, but why would either team trade a unicorn to obtain him when he’s easier to find? But I guess you could offer sheet Brady?

 

First thing is first. The team needs to stop pretending they aren’t hoping Chytil becomes Strome. They also have to decide now if they proceed ahead with 1c and 2c being Ziby and Strome for more than next year. Personally I give up on Chytil. Not because I think he won’t one day be someone but because you have to stop trying to hoard unrealized talent.

 

Address faceoffs. Have a 4th liner that’ll win a draw. I say Glendening. He’s great on faceoffs and is a place killer and happens to be a free agent this summer.

 

That’s another problem. Our top 6 can’t be the top 6, the top pp, and the top pk. They can’t be everything. The bottom 6 have to have a role outside of just being a shift to get the top 6 rest.

 

That’s all I got for now lol

That last paragraph is something I've been saying for years. I don't want my 1C killing penalties.

I don't believe any team could have any interest in Kreider, he's radioactive and has no upside at this point

All you can hope is that he was nursing an injury and still retains an amount of pride

If Halle Berry hit's the FA market, I'm paying for hyman. All day every day cap or no cap.

Add my name to the list of being open to moving Kakko even if he catches fire and almost puts up as many points as he did last season.

What I wouldn't give for a Lindholm/Tkachuk package. Maybe Calgary is ready to fully nuke it.

Buchnevich

Chytil or Strome

Kakko

Lundkvist

'21 1st

for

Lindholm

Tkachuk

Who says yes?

Why did they just let two buy low candidates like Anderson and Bennett just float on past?

Is FO of the same opinion?

Tkachuk would be ideal, but Foligno is probably realistic. Then, you have to get a second player of this mold that can play top 9. One guy isn't going to cut it.

If not Lindholm then I would look at Carolina’s Vinny Trocheck, he’s cap hit is 4.75 mil for next year but his actual salary is 6.25 mil. and Carolina is one of those cash strapped teams so I would think we could get him at a slight discount because of it. Trocheck has 38 puts in 37 gms, 83 hits & a 55% face-off win percentage.

The second guy I would sign Barclays Goodrow to be our 4th line center, he’s physical, has a 52% face-off win percentage and plays on the PK. Him or Sean Kuraly who is also physical and has a 50% face-off win percentage.

The 3rd would be Nick Foligno because of physicality and veteran leadership

With:Lafraniere-Zibenajad-Buchnevich,

Panarin-Strome-Kreider,

Foligno-Trocheck-Kravtsov,

Blackwell-Goodrow-Gauthier

Fox-Lindgren

Miller-Trouba

Any combination of Smith, Reunanen, Robertson, Jones, Schneider

Not to sure what the cap will be because Foligno, Goodrow, Smith are UFA and Buchnevich, Lindgren & Gauthier are RFA.

Sent from my iPad using Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile app powered by Tapatalk

If not Lindholm then I would look at Carolina’s Vinny Trocheck, he’s cap hit is 4.75 mil for next year but his actual salary is 6.25 mil. and Carolina is one of those cash strapped teams so I would think we could get him at a slight discount because of it. Trocheck has 38 puts in 37 gms, 83 hits & a 55% face-off win percentage.

 

The second guy I would sign Barclays Goodrow to be our 4th line center, he’s physical, has a 52% face-off win percentage and plays on the PK. Him or Sean Kuraly who is also physical and has a 50% face-off win percentage.

 

The 3rd would be Nick Foligno because of physicality and veteran leadership

 

With:Lafraniere-Zibenajad-Buchnevich,

Panarin-Strome-Kreider,

Foligno-Trocheck-Kravtsov,

Blackwell-Goodrow-Gauthier

Fox-Lindgren

Miller-Trouba

Any combination of Smith, Reunanen, Robertson, Jones, Schneider

 

Not to sure what the cap will be because Foligno, Goodrow, Smith are UFA and Buchnevich, Lindgren & Gauthier are RFA.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile app powered by Tapatalk

Are you saying to trade Chytil, Kakko & Lundkvist for Trocheck?

Seems a bit much to me.

Hyman would be great but he's doing to get PAID. That's probably a $6-7 million player, no?

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile app powered by Tapatalk

He's gonna be overpaid for sure. And a player like that who also cashes in by playing with elite players is a big no for me. We've been burned by players like that way too many times for me to ever be on board.

I really do think the Rangers hoped Lemieux could take that next step here and possibly be a top 6 winger. It's a shame that didn't happen.

Sorry, just saw my mistake. I meant Chytil or Kakko for Lindholm or Trocheck not both. Just take Blackwell out and put whichever 1 we don’t deal in Blackwells place. But as far as Lundkvist goes, we can’t count him as an NHL player just yet, pretty sure he will need to start the season in the AHL—I would think he needs to bulk up and learn our system. The reason I put Smith ahead of him is because he’s a vet. Reunanen, Jones & Robertson have ALL gotten a taste of our team/system having played games for us or haven been part of the taxi-squad.

But Chytil or Kakko for Lindholm or Trocheck without giving up our 1st Rd pick( I’m really waiting to see more reports on Mason MacTavish—MASON MCTAVISH, C, OLTEN (SL)——McTavish, a young Canadian who has found success overseas while playing in Switzerland. McTavish is an intelligent center who excels at scoring goals below the hash marks due to his ability to play in dirty areas, use spatial awareness in the offensive zone to find open areas of the ice, and has a quick release on his wrist shot to score goals). Yes!

Or cap wise we won’t have the money for Foligno, in that case Kakko or Chytil go in Folignos spot and Blackwell stays on the 4th line.

Sent from my iPad using Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile app powered by Tapatalk

I think if I'm breaking up the homogeneity of the team, I'd first look to get rid of one-trick ponies. Zibanejad and Buchnevich both play all around games. They excel all over the ice, good in every zone. They pressure the puck carrier. They PK. You win with guys like that. In the top 6, it leaves Panarin, Kreider, Strome, and probably either Kakko or Kravtsov as offensive guys that won't offer much defensively or physically. Panarin isn't going anywhere. Kreider would probably be most people's first choice, but I doubt he'd waive his NMC this early and I doubt the Rangers would even ask yet. At least one of Kakko or Kravtsov is very likely to be here for a long time. It really leaves Strome as the odd man out. And for me there's no question I choose Buchy over Strome. He's a better overall player.

Panarin - Zib - Buchnevich

Kreider/Lafreniere - X - Kravtsov/Kakko

Solve for X. They need a O'Reilly/Toews type at 2C. In fact, if Toews' health issues are resolved for next year, which reports are saying he will be ready next year, I would check in on him. He'd probably be relatively affordable trade wise, and can be cap retained. It's a likely downgrade from Strome offensively at this point, but an upgrade everywhere else that the Rangers need: experience, hockey IQ, leadership, faceoffs, going to the dirty areas, etc. He has 2 more seasons left on the contract. If he works out, he'll be 34 and can do a year or two at a time as cap space allows, and it gives the Rangers time to find/groom a successor (I think we might have him already: Morgan Barron). Chytil, Robertson, 2nd for Toews w/ 25% retained? I'd do it.

Good piece on Barron from last year, by the way: https://www.lohud.com/story/sports/nhl/rangers/2020/05/07/top-10-prospects-ny-rangers-no-8-morgan-barron/5177978002/

The Rangers took a chance on Barron late in the draft because he had certain traits that couldn't be taught.

 

"We knew he had the drive, we knew he had the size, (and) we knew he had really good IQ," assistant general manager Chris Drury said.

 

The next challenge for Barron was taking that 6-foot-3 frame and learning to use it to his advantage.

 

"The coaches have really helped me work at using my body and being able to physically beat defenders, in terms of being down low and taking the puck to the net, or finding a way to get to the net front for tips and rebounds and things like that," he said. "That's been a big, big step for me."

 

The result of bullying his way into those tough areas, along with a disciplined approach and what Schafer calls "a hard, heavy shot," was point production that exceeded many initial projections.

 

Barron racked up 34 points (15 goals and 19 assists) in 36 games as a sophomore and followed it up by averaging more than a point per game with 32 (14 goals and 18 assists) in 29 games as a junior.

 

Not only did Barron morph into a 2019-20 Hobey Baker finalist and the ECAC player of the year, but he's also been a finalist for the ECAC's best defensive forward award.

 

"I wanted to take that step and be relied upon as a top penalty killer," Barron said.

 

With his combination of size, smarts, defensive commitment and offensive savvy, Barron has positioned himself as a player the Rangers believe is ready to compete for an NHL spot — most likely on the wing, but he also has experience at center, with Schafer noting that he was one of Cornell's best on faceoffs.

Sound like traits we need on this team in the worst way?

PPG player in Hartford. 22. Time to get him a cup of coffee.

I think if I'm breaking up the homogeneity of the team, I'd first look to get rid of one-trick ponies. Zibanejad and Buchnevich both play all around games. They excel all over the ice, good in every zone. They pressure the puck carrier. They PK. You win with guys like that. In the top 6, it leaves Panarin, Kreider, Strome, and probably either Kakko or Kravtsov as offensive guys that won't offer much defensively or physically. Panarin isn't going anywhere. Kreider would probably be most people's first choice, but I doubt he'd waive his NMC this early and I doubt the Rangers would even ask yet. At least one of Kakko or Kravtsov is very likely to be here for a long time. It really leaves Strome as the odd man out. And for me there's no question I choose Buchy over Strome. He's a better overall player.

 

Panarin - Zib - Buchnevich

Kreider/Lafreniere - X - Kravtsov/Kakko

 

Solve for X. They need a O'Reilly/Toews type at 2C. In fact, if Toews' health issues are resolved for next year, which reports are saying he will be ready next year, I would check in on him. He'd probably be relatively affordable trade wise, and can be cap retained. It's a likely downgrade from Strome offensively at this point, but an upgrade everywhere else that the Rangers need: experience, hockey IQ, leadership, faceoffs, going to the dirty areas, etc. He has 2 more seasons left on the contract. If he works out, he'll be 34 and can do a year or two at a time as cap space allows, and it gives the Rangers time to find/groom a successor (I think we might have him already: Morgan Barron). Chytil, Robertson, 2nd for Toews w/ 25% retained? I'd do it.

Toews is another person I like. His contract sucks donkey balls though so even at 25% retained it's a big AAV. He's also a big risk in terms of health.

Toews is another person I like. His contract sucks donkey balls though so even at 25% retained it's a big AAV. He's also a big risk in terms of health.

Yup, but it expires when we need it to. It's totally dependent on his health for sure. Probably a long shot.

I think if I'm breaking up the homogeneity of the team, I'd first look to get rid of one-trick ponies. Zibanejad and Buchnevich both play all around games. They excel all over the ice, good in every zone. They pressure the puck carrier. They PK. You win with guys like that. In the top 6, it leaves Panarin, Kreider, Strome, and probably either Kakko or Kravtsov as offensive guys that won't offer much defensively or physically. Panarin isn't going anywhere. Kreider would probably be most people's first choice, but I doubt he'd waive his NMC this early and I doubt the Rangers would even ask yet. At least one of Kakko or Kravtsov is very likely to be here for a long time. It really leaves Strome as the odd man out. And for me there's no question I choose Buchy over Strome. He's a better overall player.

 

Panarin - Zib - Buchnevich

Kreider/Lafreniere - X - Kravtsov/Kakko

 

Solve for X.

All of this! Strome has performed well but definitely the odd-man out in my book too. Question becomes; Can changing 1 guy make enough of a difference according to the gist of this thread? I'd say we would need a similar change for 1 guy in the bottom six too. Replace two guys and we have something cooking.

^

 

All of this! Strome has performed well but definitely the odd-man out in my book too. Question becomes; Can changing 1 guy make enough of a difference according to the gist of this thread? I'd say we would need a similar change for 1 guy in the bottom six too. Replace two guys and we have something cooking.

Buch is on his way out regardless because of the overload at wing. I'm not seeing a world where Kravtsov and Kakko are moved before Buch. He's really a victim of his own success.

Regarding the team being homogeneous, you don't rectify that by blowing up what works. The 3rd and 4th lines are where you'd look to make a change because there's no real chemistry there. They are just 2 sets of 3 guys who play together.

^

 

All of this! Strome has performed well but definitely the odd-man out in my book too. Question becomes; Can changing 1 guy make enough of a difference according to the gist of this thread? I'd say we would need a similar change for 1 guy in the bottom six too. Replace two guys and we have something cooking.

I agree with you. I do not think a singular top 6 change is enough. The bottom 6 needs to change as well. I like Chytil, probably more than most on this board, but he cannot be the 3C next year if they want to be a (legitimate) playoff team. I think Lafreniere or Kreider is fine on the 3rd line. Kreider is a more north/south variety, and I think Lafreniere plays a more physical, go to the net brand of hockey. Is one of Kakko or Kravtsov ok on the right? One of Kakko or Kravtsov would be on my 2nd line next year. That leaves one left over for the third line. I don't think either is ideal there, but I think this might be one spot on the team where patience is required to see who takes the top 6 spot permanently. Trading either prematurely could be a very costly mistake. If you at least replace the center though, you change the complexion of the entire line.

To expand on what I would want to see next season:

Panarin - Zib - Buchnevich

Kreider/Lafreniere - X - Kakko

Lafreniere/Kreider - Y - Kravtsov

Rooney - Barron - Blackwell

To solve for Y, you could probably dive into UFA. Some older options I like are Krejci (as some have mentioned already) and Bozak. A couple of younger names I like are Phillip Danault and Nick Bonino, but I don't know what kind of term they'll be looking for.

I agree with you. I do not think a singular top 6 change is enough. The bottom 6 needs to change as well. I like Chytil, probably more than most on this board, but he cannot be the 3C next year if they want to be a (legitimate) playoff team. I think Lafreniere or Kreider is fine on the 3rd line. Kreider is a more north/south variety, and I think Lafreniere plays a more physical, go to the net brand of hockey. Is one of Kakko or Kravtsov ok on the right? One of Kakko or Kravtsov would be on my 2nd line next year. That leaves one left over for the third line. I don't think either is ideal there, but I think this might be one spot on the team where patience is required to see who takes the top 6 spot permanently. Trading either prematurely could be a very costly mistake. If you at least replace the center though, you change the complexion of the entire line.

 

To expand on what I would want to see next season:

 

Panarin - Zib - Buchnevich

Kreider/Lafreniere - X - Kakko

Lafreniere/Kreider - Y - Kravtsov

Rooney - Barron - Blackwell

 

To solve for Y, you could probably dive into UFA. Some older options I like are Krejci (as some have mentioned already) and Bozak. A couple of younger names I like are Phillip Danault and Nick Bonino, but I don't know what kind of term they'll be looking for.

If your solve is to put Panarin with Zib, then playing Kreider with Strome would get you what you want on the 2nd line. That combo was way more N/S when Panarin was out.

If your solve is to put Panarin with Zib, then playing Kreider with Strome would get you what you want on the 2nd line. That combo was way more N/S when Panarin was out.

It doesn't get what I want on the 2nd line though. Strome has grown exponentially offensively and by all accounts is a good teammate. There's no question a good portion of us were wrong about where his career path was going after last season, but he's the opposite of grit and below average defensively.

It doesn't get what I want on the 2nd line though. Strome has grown exponentially offensively and by all accounts is a good teammate. There's no question a good portion of us were wrong about where his career path was going after last season, but he's the opposite of grit and below average defensively.