[brooks] Rangers Mishandling Ryan McDonagh Trade Has Been Lightning Boon

[Phil]

But more than three years later, the most intriguing part of the 2018 deadline trade in which the Blueshirts sent McDonagh and Miller to the Lightning isn’t so much that the Rangers, under then-general manager Jeff Gorton, whiffed on their evaluation of Libor Hajek as a must-have, difference-making, top-four defenseman, but that there was comparatively little interest in McDonagh when the Rangers placed him on the auction block.

 

This was no bidding war. Only a handful of teams were in on McDonagh, who was coming off a couple of down years, had been battered by injuries over the preceding four seasons and was a year away from unrestricted free agency. The two-playoffs rental at a club-friendly $4.7 million per did not hold much sway.

 

Tampa Bay was in from the start. Boston had initial interest, but that seemed to evaporate after the Bruins went all-in to pull off the rental deal for Rick Nash. Pittsburgh was in, but had little to offer. The Panthers were bidders, but weren’t willing to offer all that much in return.

 

Other than overrating Hajek, who is a serviceable third-pair guy about to be made extinct by some permutation of Zac Jones, Matt Robertson and a veteran import, Gorton’s mistake was plowing ahead with the trade instead of pulling back McDonagh and putting the captain back on the market at the time of the draft.

 

Again, though, the Rangers were certain they’d pulled off a coup in acquiring Hajek. In fact, they had to add Miller to the deal in order to get the defenseman. Imagine: McDonagh alone was not enough to get Brett Howden, a first-rounder and Hajek.

 

The truth is, McDonagh had peaked at age 24, plateaued at age 25 and began to decline at age 26. His eighth-place finish in the 2013-14 Norris balloting was the highest of his tenure in New York — and he slipped to 11th, 15th and 17th, respectively, the next three seasons.

 

His game never truly regained its glitter after he suffered his first separated shoulder on a cheap shot from Alexandre Burrows in the final minute of a two-goal victory in Vancouver late in the 2013-14 season. At that point, the defenseman had missed only two of a possible 248 career games.

 

After that, though, there was another left shoulder separation a month into the following season; at least one concussion while the subject of three different head shots; a broken foot during the 2015 conference finals on which he played three games; a broken hand that sidelined McDonagh for the start of the 2016 playoffs; and an upper body injury that sent him to injured reserve nearly three weeks before he was traded.

 

The injuries took their toll. Assuming the captaincy of a vessel that began to sink a year into his tenure took its toll. Shouldering the matchup-pair responsibility while partnered with Dan Girardi and then Nick Holden took its toll. Being expected to do everything took its toll. The shine was off the romance. McDonagh was a diminished asset at the wrong time.

 

The wrong time for the Rangers.

 

But the perfect time for the Lightning.

 

https://nypost.com/2021/07/10/rangers-mishandling-ryan-mcdonagh-trade-has-been-lightning-boon/

[LindG1000]

The obvious lesson is that separated shoulders aren't serious issues for high character leaders and we should buy low on Tarasenko to win a cup.

 

Right?

[ThirtyONE]

The obvious lesson is that separated shoulders aren't serious issues for high character leaders and we should buy low on Tarasenko to win a cup.

 

Right?

 

Lol. See, I think the lesson is SELL HIGH ON BUCH!

 

 

Larry likes to look back with 20/20 hindsight but I really don't think this deal was all that bad. Yeah, it hasn't really worked out in terms of Howden or Hajek (who also got hurt), but McDonaugh had really slipped and the Rangers were going in the wrong direction. If Lundkvist turns out to be anything (which he seems to be) the trade can still be salvaged.

 

Either way, not all trades are home runs. The Rangers targeted a couple guys that didn't work. You move on. Mac signed a shockingly low deal in Tampa, he was moved to the second pair and sheltered by Hedman. It really was the best of circumstances for him. I'm not bitter about it.

[josh]

Yea, imagine the Rangers under the McDonagh and Zuccarello contacts instead of Lafreniere, Kakko, Kravtsov, Lundkvist, et al.

 

Probably still have Hayes, Vesey and Skjei, too!

[Albatrosss]

Lol. See, I think the lesson is SELL HIGH ON BUCH!

 

 

Larry likes to look back with 20/20 hindsight but I really don't think this deal was all that bad. Yeah, it hasn't really worked out in terms of Howden or Hajek (who also got hurt), but McDonaugh had really slipped and the Rangers were going in the wrong direction. If Lundkvist turns out to be anything (which he seems to be) the trade can still be salvaged.

 

Either way, not all trades are home runs. The Rangers targeted a couple guys that didn't work. You move on. Mac signed a shockingly low deal in Tampa, he was moved to the second pair and sheltered by Hedman. It really was the best of circumstances for him. I'm not bitter about it.

 

i think that's the key. with us he was #1 D and was breaking down. in TB he was #2 and blossoming. he was overused with the rangers

[RichieNextel305]

It was the hardest piece to sell off during that purge because he was our biggest asset. And to look back and see how little we got for him (and then to add Miller) is extremely disappointing. Tampa was a gift given to him from above as far as landing spots go. We rode Mac hard during our long and grueling runs because he was so good, but his body was breaking. Just about anywhere else he would be the #1 pair guy he was here. Instead he winds up there, playing behind maybe the best defenseman in the league and he can kind of get lost on the radar a little bit. But man, was he outstanding in these playoffs.

 

I remember the rumored names when McDonagh was being floated around the block. And one of the rumored names was Sergachev. I think that’s who the Rangers badly wanted and couldn’t pry unfortunately.

[The Dude]

Sooooo, maybe we see what another coach can do with Hajek? How could Gorton be THAT far off with this guy?

 

It's not even losing on McDonagh that hurts the most. Miller would look really good on any wing here right now. Crap maybe even at center. I was always down on him and thought he underachieved here, but that was obviously a coaching issue as he exploded upon leaving here. And they took Namestnikov and did absolutely NOTHING with him. Didn't use him att all! Dropped him for nothing too and he went to other teams and produced at a decent clip for where he played. I forget. Was it a cap issue with him? Why didn't they try him with Panarin in ANY capacity? When that guy is on, he's a lot like what's missing from this roster.

 

It really makes you wonder about the Gorton regime. They hit on some acquisitions, but either completely whiffed on others or severely mismanaged others with poor coaching decisions.

 

How some players have been able to get their shit together elsewhere, makes you wonder a little bit about the younger players we want to move on from. Howden, Hajek, Gauthier even Chytil may really just need a new coach. I wasn't exactly on board with Gallant being the guy for the job, but I honestly think that he is the perfect fit for our Misfit players and for taking guys off the trash heap and putting them to use. I just hope he can deal with the star power. We had our top franchise forward refusing to play with out 2nd OA pick... We had a top 6 doing nothing the previous coach preached.

 

What happens if the coach clashes with our top guys? Is Gallant going to bend on his game plan when Panarin whines if he gets paired with a winger he doesn't want to play with?

 

Makes me wonder if bigger moves aren't coming and we see guys we didn't expect moved. Maybe they want Eichel because they want to move Zibanejad or Strome?

[LindG1000]

Sooooo, maybe we see what another coach can do with Hajek? How could Gorton be THAT far off with this guy?

 

It's not even losing on McDonagh that hurts the most. Miller would look really good on any wing here right now. Crap maybe even at center. I was always down on him and thought he underachieved here, but that was obviously a coaching issue as he exploded upon leaving here. And they took Namestnikov and did absolutely NOTHING with him. Didn't use him att all! Dropped him for nothing too and he went to other teams and produced at a decent clip for where he played. I forget. Was it a cap issue with him? Why didn't they try him with Panarin in ANY capacity? When that guy is on, he's a lot like what's missing from this roster.

 

It really makes you wonder about the Gorton regime. They hit on some acquisitions, but either completely whiffed on others or severely mismanaged others with poor coaching decisions.

 

How some players have been able to get their shit together elsewhere, makes you wonder a little bit about the younger players we want to move on from. Howden, Hajek, Gauthier even Chytil may really just need a new coach. I wasn't exactly on board with Gallant being the guy for the job, but I honestly think that he is the perfect fit for our Misfit players and for taking guys off the trash heap and putting them to use. I just hope he can deal with the star power. We had our top franchise forward refusing to play with out 2nd OA pick... We had a top 6 doing nothing the previous coach preached.

 

What happens if the coach clashes with our top guys? Is Gallant going to bend on his game plan when Panarin whines if he gets paired with a winger he doesn't want to play with?

 

Makes me wonder if bigger moves aren't coming and we see guys we didn't expect moved. Maybe they want Eichel because they want to move Zibanejad or Strome?

 

I think this is a bit of revisionist history. This was probably the one truly bad trade of the Gorton regime, and even then, in the moment, we got what was supposed to be a top4 D, a mid-six C with captain qualities, a guaranteed 1st, a guaranteed 2nd that could swing to a 1st, and a mid-six wing. That's actually a good return - what hasn't been good is that literally, against all odds, none of this panned out yet. Lundkvist can "saving grace" this trade.

 

AV clashing with Miller and Gorton dealing him only to fire AV weeks later is the biggest issue here; the second is that our scouts apparently really sucked at scouting the WHL and/or developing mid-tier players.

[The Dude]

It was the hardest piece to sell off during that purge because he was our biggest asset. And to look back and see how little we got for him (and then to add Miller) is extremely disappointing. Tampa was a gift given to him from above as far as landing spots go. We rode Mac hard during our long and grueling runs because he was so good, but his body was breaking. Just about anywhere else he would be the #1 pair guy he was here. Instead he winds up there, playing behind maybe the best defenseman in the league and he can kind of get lost on the radar a little bit. But man, was he outstanding in these playoffs.

 

I remember the rumored names when McDonagh was being floated around the block. And one of the rumored names was Sergachev. I think that’s who the Rangers badly wanted and couldn’t pry unfortunately.

 

I always thought they could have gotten a top 6 forward not named Mathews from Toronto. At the least Kapanen (he was dealt to Pitt for garbage and a 1st. There's no way Toronto wasn't interested.

[The Dude]

I think this is a bit of revisionist history. This was probably the one truly bad trade of the Gorton regime, and even then, in the moment, we got what was supposed to be a top4 D, a mid-six C with captain qualities, a guaranteed 1st, a guaranteed 2nd that could swing to a 1st, and a mid-six wing. That's actually a good return - what hasn't been good is that literally, against all odds, none of this panned out yet. Lundkvist can "saving grace" this trade.

 

AV clashing with Miller and Gorton dealing him only to fire AV weeks later is the biggest issue here; the second is that our scouts apparently really sucked at scouting the WHL and/or developing mid-tier players.

 

Not really revisionist history, when I'm suggesting that a new coach might be able to get something out of the 2 pieces from that trade that many have written off. There's gotta be more to these 2 players than we saw last year. They both looked more promising the year prior.

 

Not revisionist when they cut ties with Namestnikov so fast. I questioned it then, as did others.

 

I don't recall many being excited about the deal when it happened. Was anyone psyched about getting Howden? Everyone scratched their head at getting Namestnikov, thinking he was padded by playing with Tampas top forwards. Everyone was meh of Hajek. Many thought the conditional 1st should have been guaranteed due to giving them Miller.

 

Sorry, I don't consider this one revisionist history. Nobody was pleased with the return.

[Blue Heaven]

Gorton should have played hardball and pry Sergachev

[LindG1000]

Not really revisionist history, when I'm suggesting that a new coach might be able to get something out of the 2 pieces from that trade that many have written off. There's gotta be more to these 2 players than we saw last year. They both looked more promising the year prior.

 

Not revisionist when they cut ties with Namestnikov so fast. I questioned it then, as did others.

 

I don't recall many being excited about the deal when it happened. Was anyone psyched about getting Howden? Everyone scratched their head at getting Namestnikov, thinking he was padded by playing with Tampas top forwards. Everyone was meh of Hajek. Many thought the conditional 1st should have been guaranteed due to giving them Miller.

 

Sorry, I don't consider this one revisionist history. Nobody was pleased with the return.

 

You should, because you're looking at the whole thing in the context of being three years down the line, not what it was at the time. It's the textbook definition of revisionist history to do that.

 

Folks were disappointed because the return didn't include Sergachev or Point - rightfully so. The overwhelming thought at the time was that Howden was another Andersson who might actually be our future captain (before Andersson completely busted...actually, probably still accurate), that Hajek would be a cornerstone piece of the D in a mid-pair role, that Namestnikov was an exciting risk play that may work okay as a bridge to Andersson/Howden/Chytil and should have flip value, and the two picks were good adds, but that the Rangers should have done better and punched higher in the prospect system. Hard to remember that there was a time where we were excited to see these two play. but it was the case. For context, at the time, both were considered better prospects than Ryan Lindgren or Adam Fox.

 

Now, three years later, we know this wasn't the bill of goods we were sold. Howden has not at all progressed. Hajek has been passed on the depth chart by like five guys. Namestnikov had like half a good season and then disappeared. Seriously, at what point was he ever good with us or any of the other teams he ended up playing for? The six games he played with Landeskog and Mackinnon? Don't tell me Namestnikov was "Quinned" - he did the same "random hot start" thing with Ottawa and then shit the bed harder than a post-colonoscopy patient on ExLax. Lundkvist may work out, Henriksson probably won't.

[josh]

Namestnikov couldn’t play Quinn’s style, which Miller seems perfectly suited for.

[LindG1000]

Namestnikov couldn’t play Quinn’s style, which Miller seems perfectly suited for.

 

Shit, so did Howden and he couldn't do it.

[The Dude]

You should, because you're looking at the whole thing in the context of being three years down the line, not what it was at the time. It's the textbook definition of revisionist history to do that.

 

Folks were disappointed because the return didn't include Sergachev or Point - rightfully so. The overwhelming thought at the time was that Howden was another Andersson who might actually be our future captain (before Andersson completely busted...actually, probably still accurate), that Hajek would be a cornerstone piece of the D in a mid-pair role, that Namestnikov was an exciting risk play that may work okay as a bridge to Andersson/Howden/Chytil and should have flip value, and the two picks were good adds, but that the Rangers should have done better and punched higher in the prospect system. Hard to remember that there was a time where we were excited to see these two play. but it was the case. For context, at the time, both were considered better prospects than Ryan Lindgren or Adam Fox.

 

Now, three years later, we know this wasn't the bill of goods we were sold. Howden has not at all progressed. Hajek has been passed on the depth chart by like five guys. Namestnikov had like half a good season and then disappeared. Seriously, at what point was he ever good with us or any of the other teams he ended up playing for? The six games he played with Landeskog and Mackinnon? Don't tell me Namestnikov was "Quinned" - he did the same "random hot start" thing with Ottawa and then shit the bed harder than a post-colonoscopy patient on ExLax. Lundkvist may work out, Henriksson probably won't.

 

Again. NOBODY was excited about the return. It's not some new thought. Most here were questioning every aspect of the trade. Comparisons of Howden to Jeremy Bracco.... That's excitement? Your revision seems to be a little off man.

 

I think the rebuild excitement was more of the energy you speak of. NOT this trade return.

 

Namestnikov went to Ottawa and played pretty well on a team that had NOTHING. What would you expect? He did the same in Detroit this past season. But again... the Rangers getting him was questioned big time. You seem to remember people being excited about it?

 

 

So, I'm not sure about the attitude in this part of your post. I didn't like the move, but I also didn't like the total non effort to use him, since he was a part of the biggest sell since Leetch.. He's a serviceable player that can slot up and down any roster.

[Phil]

Gorton should have played hardball and pry Sergachev

 

He did play hardball. He wanted Hajek. He ended up having to throw in Miller just to get him.

[Capt]

The Miller part of the trade was awful from the start. It made zero sense then our now.

[LindG1000]

Again. NOBODY was excited about the return. It's not some new thought. Most here were questioning every aspect of the trade. Comparisons of Howden to Jeremy Bracco.... That's excitement? Your revision seems to be a little off man.

 

I think the rebuild excitement was more of the energy you speak of. NOT this trade return.

 

Namestnikov went to Ottawa and played pretty well on a team that had NOTHING. What would you expect? He did the same in Detroit this past season. But again... the Rangers getting him was questioned big time. You seem to remember people being excited about it?

 

 

So, I'm not sure about the attitude in this part of your post. I didn't like the move, but I also didn't like the total non effort to use him, since he was a part of the biggest sell since Leetch.. He's a serviceable player that can slot up and down any roster.

 

Again, the disappointment was not the guys we got - it was the guys we didn't. I don't understand why that's hard to understand - the disappointment on the return wasn't Howden and Hajek - it was "not Sergachev". Again, both Howden and Hajek were higher regarded at the time than Fox and Lindgren. They got five+ first round pick equivalence for McDonagh and Miller, didn't push hard enough for the right guy (Sergachev), added for whatever reason to get Hajek, and got massively unlucky that the whole thing aside from Lundkvist blew up in their faces. I don't remember people being excited, but I also never said they were, so not really sure where you got that from. I'm simply saying it was a decently equal value return that would probably have been better configured if we didn't insist on Hajek and blew up in our faces for a lack of development/good scouting.

 

As for Namestnikov, he got 16 minutes of ice time per game with us. He had random hot streaks interspersed with long ass cold streaks. Didn't he go something like 20 games without a point in 2018-19? He was wildly inconsistent and got dealt to Ottawa, where he proceeded to do the exact same damn thing - started white hot and just faded away. How much more of a chance do you get than that?

[josh]

Shit, so did Howden and he couldn't do it.

 

Howden wasn’t an ideal Quinn guy, he was just one of the few young guys to be able to fake it for awhile

[The Dude]

Again, the disappointment was not the guys we got - it was the guys we didn't. I don't understand why that's hard to understand - the disappointment on the return wasn't Howden and Hajek - it was "not Sergachev". Again, both Howden and Hajek were higher regarded at the time than Fox and Lindgren. They got five+ first round pick equivalence for McDonagh and Miller, didn't push hard enough for the right guy (Sergachev), added for whatever reason to get Hajek, and got massively unlucky that the whole thing aside from Lundkvist blew up in their faces. I don't remember people being excited, but I also never said they were, so not really sure where you got that from. I'm simply saying it was a decently equal value return that would probably have been better configured if we didn't insist on Hajek and blew up in our faces for a lack of development/good scouting.

 

As for Namestnikov, he got 16 minutes of ice time per game with us. He had random hot streaks interspersed with long ass cold streaks. Didn't he go something like 20 games without a point in 2018-19? He was wildly inconsistent and got dealt to Ottawa, where he proceeded to do the exact same damn thing - started white hot and just faded away. How much more of a chance do you get than that?

 

Ummmm

 

Hard to remember that there was a time where we were excited to see these two play. but it was the case. For context, at the time, both were considered better prospects than Ryan Lindgren or Adam Fox[/Quote]

 

Well, I hope this helps you remember. And, neither were regarded higher than Fox. Fox was on many people's radar when he was drafted by Calgary. Lindgren was regarded pretty low around here until he got called up. Something I never understood. People were saying he wasn't even on the radar and were using him as a throw in on trade proposals. The consensus here was that he wasn't very good and not a prospect anymore. Even with that said, most everyone scratched their head big time with the Hajek demand.. I think we look back, you'll see that's the case.

 

As for Namestnikov. I simply said they didn't give him a shot with Panarin. His first year he went from playing on the top line on a Stanley Cup favorite, to playing on a shit show rebuilding team. Yes, he did have a long drought, but it was understandable. He played 2 games the following season and was given away. They JUST got Panarin. They felt he was good enough to take in the trade and give up Miller, but they didn't use him. I don't remember who he played with the full year prior. I do remember being verry underwhelmed. Just thought it was an odd move NOT trying him in spots with Panarin and giving him away.

[Sharpshooter]

I understand the misuse of Namestnikov, but the fact that they traded McDonagh and Miller and the only active roster players they have to show for it are Hajek and Howden is really disappointing to say the least. Those were two of their best players they had to deal as far as the rebuild/restructure goes and just getting that back was a bummer. I'm hoping Lundqvist becomes a borderline Hall of Famer at this point to make me feel better about it. lol I understand McDonagh playing with Hedman helps too, and the shoulder injuries were a legitimate concern, but still, I don't know if that was the greatest asset management. No more deals with Yzerman, please.

 

Not only McDonagh, but seeing what Miller has turned into makes it even worse. He wasn't great with Tampa, so he did need another change, but what he's done with Vancouver is what I thought he'd be ultimately doing here.

[LindG1000]

Ummmm

 

 

 

Well, I hope this helps you remember. And, neither were regarded higher than Fox. Fox was on many people's radar when he was drafted by Calgary. Lindgren was regarded pretty low around here until he got called up. Something I never understood. People were saying he wasn't even on the radar and were using him as a throw in on trade proposals. The consensus here was that he wasn't very good and not a prospect anymore. Even with that said, most everyone scratched their head big time with the Hajek demand.. I think we look back, you'll see that's the case.

 

Go for it. Near every ranking back in the day had Fox, Howden, and Hajek in similar regards - in most cases, Howden above the other two and in many cases Hajek above Fox. You can find the receipts if you like. Keep in mind that Howden went 40+ spots before Fox, and Hajek went 20+ spots before Fox.

 

Also, "hard to remember that people were excited to see Howden and Hajek play" is a hindsight statement. There's nothing to "help me remember" here - at one point, people were excited to see Howden and Hajek get callups and play for the big club. Now, they are not.

 

As for Namestnikov. I simply said they didn't give him a shot with Panarin. His first year he went from playing on the top line on a Stanley Cup favorite, to playing on a shit show rebuilding team. Yes, he did have a long drought, but it was understandable. He played 2 games the following season and was given away. They JUST got Panarin. They felt he was good enough to take in the trade and give up Miller, but they didn't use him. I don't remember who he played with the full year prior. I do remember being verry underwhelmed. Just thought it was an odd move NOT trying him in spots with Panarin and giving him away.

 

Meanwhile, Panarin's had two straight career years without Namestnikov, and if I'm remembering correctly, Namestnikov was more a cap casualty than a "no chances given" move. Wasn't that right after we bought out Shattenkirk and had Brendan Smith shifting between forward and D?

[josh]

No, namestnikov asked for a trade

 

 

Oops - no, he said he was unhappy wth his situation and was traded after 2 games

[Phil]

The Miller part of the trade was awful from the start. It made zero sense then our now.

 

They grew disillusioned with him, according to Brooks. But they absolutely failed to move him for something meaningful.

[Ozzy]

I love Uncle Larry trying to throw salt in the wounds and stir us up with this one.

 

I'm actually happy for Big Mac. He played his ass off for us while he was here, and he's done great for Tampa. We'll get our chance, and when we do, this will be even older news....that still won't matter!

 

We traded Hall of Famer Mike Gartner away in '94 for Glenn Anderson, who's career was just about done. But since the Rangers won the Cup that year, that trade can hardly ever be questioned....this feels like Uncle Larry just putting a spur under our saddle and saying to his "hidden account" buddies up here, "Watch me make these guys get pissed off".

 

Nice try Larry, but I ain't taking the bait! :paddle: