pws85nyr Posted July 10, 2021 Share Posted July 10, 2021 You know what, the more I read about the English fans behaviours after the group stages the more I want to retract some of my earlier statements. It’s pretty appalling and as an Englishman I’m pretty ashamed (booing of anthems aside as you all know my thoughts on that). It’s odd because these fans haven’t been in the stadiums since the early to late 90’s. Wembley has been a bit of a library over the past decade or so since the renovation (and clamp down on hooliganism). Very family orientated and watered down so to speak. So I guess with Covid and children perhaps not being vaccinated etc. it has shifted back to old habits. Great atmosphere at times, but too much bullshit from a bunch of idiots. But this is the sign of the times back home since Brexit, toxic island right now in places. Contributed to the reasons why I immigrated. Perhaps I’m out of touch having lived abroad for 4 years now. Such a shame. I want the team to win because they deserve it, and more so Southgate, but don’t do it for the fans if this is how they are gonna behave. Do it for yourselves. Anyways, I was quick to defend them so felt it only right to call them out to when deserved. Also, Hungary got a 2 game ban for their abuse so fair play UEFA, as I was complaining about double standards but clearly there aren’t on this occasion. England rightly finned for the laser incident (again I disagree re the anthem and think Gary Neville’s comments were spot on). That being said, COME ON ENGLAND (“it’s coming home” is getting old and I loved Schmeichel’s comments on it lol, so true and pretty arrogant IMO). Sent from my iPhone using Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile app powered by Tapatalk 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keirik Posted July 10, 2021 Share Posted July 10, 2021 You know what, the more I read about the English fans behaviours after the group stages the more I want to retract some of my earlier statements. It’s pretty appalling and as an Englishman I’m pretty ashamed (booing of anthems aside as you all know my thoughts on that). It’s odd because these fans haven’t been in the stadiums since the early to late 90’s. Wembley has been a bit of a library over the past decade or so since the renovation (and clamp down on hooliganism). Very family orientated and watered down so to speak. So I guess with Covid and children perhaps not being vaccinated etc. it has shifted back to old habits. Great atmosphere at times, but too much bullshit from a bunch of idiots. But this is the sign of the times back home since Brexit, toxic island right now in places. Contributed to the reasons why I immigrated. Perhaps I’m out of touch having lived abroad for 4 years now. Such a shame. I want the team to win because they deserve it, and more so Southgate, but don’t do it for the fans if this is how they are gonna behave. Do it for yourselves. Anyways, I was quick to defend them so felt it only right to call them out to when deserved. Also, Hungary got a 2 game ban for their abuse so fair play UEFA, as I was complaining about double standards but clearly there aren’t on this occasion. England rightly finned for the laser incident (again I disagree re the anthem and think Gary Neville’s comments were spot on). That being said, COME ON ENGLAND (“it’s coming home” is getting old and I loved Schmeichel’s comments on it lol, so true and pretty arrogant IMO). Sent from my iPhone using Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile app powered by Tapatalk That’s pretty awesome of you to take a few extra seconds and try to look at it objectively. Good luck in the final. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H-Dreamer Posted July 10, 2021 Share Posted July 10, 2021 Speaking of Southgate: Hard to take him serious, I mean does he really think his 20-something players think about the War? Did he really use it to motivate them? Why not bitter defeats against Germany in the actual sport they are playing, there is enough of those to go around. But I guess he is trying to win over some people, who didn't like him so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pws85nyr Posted July 10, 2021 Share Posted July 10, 2021 Speaking of Southgate: Hard to take him serious, I mean does he really think his 20-something players think about the War? Did he really use it to motivate them? Why not bitter defeats against Germany in the actual sport they are playing, there is enough of those to go around. But I guess he is trying to win over some people, who didn't like him so far. I must say that seems very unSouthgate like so I am a little sceptical. Is says associated press but do you know which one or have the full article? i.e. is it the Daily Mail being racist assholes again and taking a quote out of context in a manner that suits their agenda. Idk. That being said if it was said and meant, and in that context, it’s fucking idiotic as you rightly point out. Sent from my iPhone using Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile app powered by Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pws85nyr Posted July 10, 2021 Share Posted July 10, 2021 Yeah just saw the article in full, seems legit. Don’t get that quote. I mean, it’s probably factually correct, but kind of ignorant to ignore the horrendous impact the commonwealth had around the world and colonialism. Just don’t know why you would say that. Back in 1966 I can understand that comment, to an extent, as it would have been their generation. But I bet you can count in one hand the people in the stadium who lived through WW2. Sent from my iPhone using Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile app powered by Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H-Dreamer Posted July 10, 2021 Share Posted July 10, 2021 Yh, the children of the war generation are retirement age these days, their children are in their 40s and late 30s, it's already the next generation that is playing nowadays. It's just such a weird mindset to have and it comes just after we talked about people like that a few days ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pws85nyr Posted July 11, 2021 Share Posted July 11, 2021 Yh, the children of the war generation are retirement age these days, their children are in their 40s and late 30s, it's already the next generation that is playing nowadays. It's just such a weird mindset to have and it comes just after we talked about people like that a few days ago. Oh I agree. And my grandad served in WW2. I love Germany, and all the Germans I have ever met have been awesome. This is utterly ridiculous. We aren’t all dick heads I promise! Sent from my iPhone using Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile app powered by Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pws85nyr Posted July 11, 2021 Share Posted July 11, 2021 “I think there are historic things that we should be proud of,” he said. “We’ve had unbelievable inventions in this country. We’ve had standards of decency, I suppose, that would be expected.” “At heart I go back to the values that my parents gave me and treating people as you would want to be treated. Just respectful, really.” “But also people have tried to invade us and we’ve had the courage to hold that back. You can’t hide that some of the energy in the stadium against Germany was because of that.” “I never mentioned that to the players but I know that’s part of what that story was. There is an intertwining of all those things, that generations of… respect for our elders and just values I think we should have.” “We have so many things here that we should be proud of that we probably underestimate that.” https://www.google.ca/amp/s/www.the42.ie/gareth-southgate-england-history-5491328-Jul2021/%3famp=1 A bit more context (I’m sure I’ve posted this all wrong as I have no idea how to do it lol). Having read the article in full, it just seems a poor choice of words/examples from Southgate, and it’s very odd as it has nothing to do with football as you rightly say. Could have used far better examples (although this was not used with the players he said, not that it matters). His comment re the fans at the game probably aren’t wrong but that’s precisely the problem as we discussed. Why fans several generations later would care about this (in the context of sport) is beyond me. All in all probably his only slip up that I have seen, certainly recently, and a poor choice of examples and poorly worded. Not a great look from a non English perspective I agree (or any perspective really), and not going to endear you to neutrals. I love how we English always forget we have invaded half the world and caused irreparable damage…so stupid. Sent from my iPhone using Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile app powered by Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodka Drunkenski Posted July 11, 2021 Author Share Posted July 11, 2021 Italy England tied going into the 70th minute, good game so far Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H-Dreamer Posted July 11, 2021 Share Posted July 11, 2021 Well, the old meme of England in Penalty shootouts is back. Weird choice by Southgate to have the youngest players on the team shoot most of them and what do you know, they miss. I hate this new style of shooting anyway, the shooter shouldn't be allowed to slow down like that, glad it didn't work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albatrosss Posted July 11, 2021 Share Posted July 11, 2021 I expected a much better game from England. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karan Posted July 11, 2021 Share Posted July 11, 2021 Italy was unsurprisingly the stronger team in regulation, and should've pulled this off within 120 minutes. But I expected better from England in the shootout, they were unexpectedly poor. 3 straight misses? Some very questionable decisions by management to put those shooters in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keirik Posted July 11, 2021 Share Posted July 11, 2021 I think the better team won. It hurt England to score so early I think. They were better once the game was tied again but the momentum was turned already. Thought the referee had a few interesting non decisions but I'm happy he wasn't falling for all the diving by either team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keirik Posted July 11, 2021 Share Posted July 11, 2021 Italy was unsurprisingly the stronger team in regulation, and should've pulled this off within 120 minutes. But I expected better from England in the shootout, they were unexpectedly poor. 3 straight misses? Some very questionable decisions by management to put those shooters in. Having Kane go first was a mistake to me. I don't know how you let your 3,4,5 pk takers be an average age of like 20. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albatrosss Posted July 11, 2021 Share Posted July 11, 2021 Having Kane go first was a mistake to me. I don't know how you let your 3,4,5 pk takers be an average age of like 20. And the comentator said they were put in the game just for that reason, for a shootout. Ironically none of them could score. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albatrosss Posted July 11, 2021 Share Posted July 11, 2021 I think the better team won. It hurt England to score so early I think. They were better once the game was tied again but the momentum was turned already. Thought the referee had a few interesting non decisions but I'm happy he wasn't falling for all the diving by either team. Italy usually dives their way to victories but today the ref was having none of it, which was good to see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pws85nyr Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 Better team won. We reverted to 2018 tactics and it cost us. Back to old ways. This is what makes us English. But I feel for the boys who missed and the vitriol soon to follow. Nobody deserves that, they had the balls to step up. Sent from my iPhone using Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile app powered by Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LindG1000 Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 Better team won. We reverted to 2018 tactics and it cost us. Back to old ways. This is what makes us English. But I feel for the boys who missed and the vitriol soon to follow. Nobody deserves that, they had the balls to step up. Sent from my iPhone using Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile app powered by Tapatalk What was Southgate thinking putting three kids up in 3-4-5 - two of which were brought on in the 120th minute! - when he had Sterling and Grealish and Shaw? I get it if you want Saka or Rashford or Sancho to take 1-2, but putting a 19 year old in the hero spot in a cup final is fucking nuts. It's worse yet that the three misses came from black players - the racism being spewed at them is....deeply disturbing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pws85nyr Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 What was Southgate thinking putting three kids up in 3-4-5 - two of which were brought on in the 120th minute! - when he had Sterling and Grealish and Shaw? I get it if you want Saka or Rashford or Sancho to take 1-2, but putting a 19 year old in the hero spot in a cup final is fucking nuts. It's worse yet that the three misses came from black players - the racism being spewed at them is....deeply disturbing. The last part is what concerns me. The other part. Who knows. He clearly made the subs to take penalties which is fine. I don’t doubt he asked them. And they had the balls. My only gripe is HOW Rashford took his penalty, you miss you miss, but take it properly. You save 2/5 you expect to win. Age has nothing to do with it necessarily. With penalties you are either confident or not and Southgate is going to ask who wants to shoot where. We just aren’t good enough at them. Complacency, cocky, nerves etc., it is what it is. I guess we have to chalk it up to experience as usual. But I fear for those boys for the racism and vitriol to come. What a sorry world we live in. I’m upset, but we lost and deservedly so. Just deal with it. I’ve had some beers, some whiskey, some food, and consoled with family and friends. Don’t go that route. But sadly this will fall on deaf ears (see Beckham and Southgate etc.). Sent from my iPhone using Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile app powered by Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LindG1000 Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 The last part is what concerns me. The other part. Who knows. He clearly made the subs to take penalties which is fine. I don’t doubt he asked them. And they had the balls. My only gripe is HOW Rashford took his penalty, you miss you miss, but take it properly. You save 2/5 you expect to win. Age has nothing to do with it necessarily. With penalties you are either confident or not and Southgate is going to ask who wants to shoot where. We just aren’t good enough at them. Complacency, cocky, nerves etc., it is what it is. I guess we have to chalk it up to experience as usual. But I fear for those boys for the racism and vitriol to come. What a sorry world we live in. I’m upset, but we lost and deservedly so. Just deal with it. I’ve had some beers, some whiskey, some food, and consoled with family and friends. Don’t go that route. But sadly this will fall on deaf ears (see Beckham and Southgate etc.). Sent from my iPhone using Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile app powered by Tapatalk Can't even fault Saka and Sancho - those were well taken penalties that Donnarumma did well to stop. Agreed on Rashford though - he tried to be too cute and it bit him in the ass. He won that battle - Donnarumma gave his move away. Don't try to be cute about that - slot it where he didn't intend to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pws85nyr Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 Can't even fault Saka and Sancho - those were well taken penalties that Donnarumma did well to stop. Agreed on Rashford though - he tried to be too cute and it bit him in the ass. He won that battle - Donnarumma gave his move away. Don't try to be cute about that - slot it where he didn't intend to go. If you aren’t good enough to do that technique don’t do it. Nothing wrong with power and precision. Or just old fashioned down the middle. I will never ever understand this and it baffles me coaches don’t drill this into our players. Where is Matt Le Tessier when you need him. Sent from my iPhone using Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile app powered by Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keirik Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 What I blame Southgate for is not using Grealish in a pk and putting Kane first of all places when your best guy goes 4th (not 5th because it may never get to him if it goes all wrong). Rashford is a no brainer to take a pk though. He has taken plenty of big penalties for United so no qualms with that. Sancho after never playing is insane. That’s a lot on a young man for his country in that spot. Sako is odd because you didn’t use Grealish first who has played many bigger games in his club career. Especially considering you subbed him in for extra time. Sako should be like the 7th guy or so. No Sterling either? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keirik Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 Btw , for those in the mood for a good documentary on English football, watch One Night in Turin. It’s on Amazon but not sure if prime Narrated by Gary Oldman. About the 1990 World Cup for England, very good though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H-Dreamer Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 I think the idea of Kane going first is, to calm the nerves of everyone else, by starting with a sure goal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4EverRangerFrank Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 England had it going in those first few minutes and that first goal was craziness. The rest of the first half? They allowed Italy to ‘pass’ their way back into the game with good possession. Second half was entertaining and on pins and needles. This post-game crap is wholly unacceptable though. Kicking Italy fans? Really? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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