Official Fire Quinn Thread

--

From another board. Hilarious but the sad part is it's true.

I repeat what I already wrote in the thread about last game:

PP for the Sabres, game is tied. Sam Rosen: "Rangers have Jack Johnson on, with Trou-...they score!!!" I laughed so hard and felt terrible while doing it. This time even a lottery pick wouldn't be worth watching such kind of terrible hockey, because with all the limitations due to Covid the next NHL draft will be like shooting into the darkness.

I repeat what I already wrote in the thread about last game:

 

PP for the Sabres, game is tied. Sam Rosen: "Rangers have Jack Johnson on, with Trou-...they score!!!" I laughed so hard and felt terrible while doing it. This time even a lottery pick wouldn't be worth watching such kind of terrible hockey, because with all the limitations due to Covid the next NHL draft will be like shooting into the darkness.

My thoughts on the Johnson thing.. Let me preface this by saying the guy is obviously done in the NHL and its my belief that as the season goes on we will see less and less of him. But on the flip side you cant sign a guy then not give him a chance to play. It's early in the season, even after a bad game or 3 you have to give him the option to bounce back if you want to get any positive use out of him. It's bad optics for future signing if he has one bad stretch and gets perma-benched. With that said who else do you play on the PK? Has DeAngelo even showed up for the season yet? Miller Fox and Lindgren cant play 60 minutes.

Ill give Quinn shit if after 10-15 games hes still a regular.

Trouba on the other hand... ive made my opinion on him well known in the past. The guy should be a staple to the third pair.

My thoughts on the Johnson thing.. Let me preface this by saying the guy is obviously done in the NHL and its my belief that as the season goes on we will see less and less of him. But on the flip side you cant sign a guy then not give him a chance to play. It's early in the season, even after a bad game or 3 you have to give him the option to bounce back if you want to get any positive use out of him. It's bad optics for future signing if he has one bad stretch and gets perma-benched. With that said who else do you play on the PK? Has DeAngelo even showed up for the season yet? Miller Fox and Lindgren cant play 60 minutes.

 

Ill give Quinn shit if after 10-15 games hes still a regular.

 

Trouba on the other hand... ive made my opinion on him well known in the past. The guy should be a staple to the third pair.

How can you staple Trouba to the 3rd pair? DeAngelo has been worse.

Honestly, team wide outside of a handful of guys, it's been a complete shit show. Buchnevich, Fox, Chytil, and maybe Lindgren are the only guys who seemed ready to play hockey this year.

I've no real love or hatred for Quinn, but I will say this much: this team has lacked structure and posture every day he's been here. He strikes me as a wonderful person and motivator, but a poor tactician and strategist, and the fact that this many high-profile young players don't seem to be making very much progress is a stain on his tenure in my eyes. It's not just the losing, either. Losing is something all young teams do, but losing this boringly and in this uninspired a manner just isn't acceptable.

That we can effectively count the team out of games they're trailing in going into the third period is damning of his coaching ability. That the Rangers come out flat as a board in most games is damning of his coaching ability. That Lafreniere and Kakko look like plugs, rather than first- and second-overall offensive dynamos respectively, is damning of his coaching ability. Hell, that he's entering his third NHL season and hasn't seemed to carve out a stable of reliable soldiers is damning of his coaching ability.

Barring a total collapse here, or a mutiny, I'd imagine he still gets a lot more time to figure things out, but I'm getting pretty close to being wholly welcome of a coaching change.

this is a pipe dream.. Quinn isn't going anywhere. Just read JD's thoughts on the team and its progress from before camp, I don't think upper management viewed this team as a playoff squad in my reading between the lines.. And it appears to be the correct take.

Quinn has made some questionable moves from a line construction and lineup setting perspective. But this team has been awful because Zib, Strome, and Kreider have been non existent. Panarin has been a shell of what we saw last year. ADA a non factor and Trouba is still wildly inconsistent.. Sprinkle in some really bad goaltending and you have a dogshit and anit-freeze smoothie..

Coaching is one of the few professions where you get fired for guys who get paid exponentially more than you, not doing their jobs. Buch is the only guy in the top 6 playing like these games count, not going to win many games with that level of compete. Its embarrassing for the players if the coach needs to get them to play to their potential

I've no real love or hatred for Quinn, but I will say this much: this team has lacked structure and posture every day he's been here. He strikes me as a wonderful person and motivator, but a poor tactician and strategist, and the fact that this many high-profile young players don't seem to be making very much progress is a stain on his tenure in my eyes. It's not just the losing, either. Losing is something all young teams do, but losing this boringly and in this uninspired a manner just isn't acceptable.

 

That we can effectively count the team out of games they're trailing in going into the third period is damning of his coaching ability. That the Rangers come out flat as a board in most games is damning of his coaching ability. That Lafreniere and Kakko look like plugs, rather than first- and second-overall offensive dynamos respectively, is damning of his coaching ability. Hell, that he's entering his third NHL season and hasn't seemed to carve out a stable of reliable soldiers is damning of his coaching ability.

 

Barring a total collapse here, or a mutiny, I'd imagine he still gets a lot more time to figure things out, but I'm getting pretty close to being wholly welcome of a coaching change.

Pretty spot on. You can look back on the two previous Quinn rating threads we had and see the gripes about Quinn are exactly the same today as they were in his first year. That's pretty alarming to me. Where is the growth of both him and this team? Look, it was noble to try and build everything from the ground up in terms of coaching as well as players but some groups need someone to look towards for answers. We don't have that dominant captain like player for answers thsgs been there, done that which is fine. But then you better have a coach that has some answers. Quinn just looks like he's out of ideas half the time and throws darts at a board to see what to try next.

Coaching is one of the few professions where you get fired for guys who get paid exponentially more than you, not doing their jobs. Buch is the only guy in the top 6 playing like these games count, not going to win many games with that level of compete. Its embarrassing for the players if the coach needs to get them to play to their potential

But isn't that what, coaching is? To have answers when things aren't going well and reinforce them when they are enough so that things never get to the point where a 4 game winning steak is followed up by a 7 game losing streak. To help get the players to play to their potential, out thrm I n situations where they succeed, have a philosophy that compliments your teams strengths, etc.

this is a pipe dream.. Quinn isn't going anywhere. Just read JD's thoughts on the team and its progress from before camp, I don't think upper management viewed this team as a playoff squad in my reading between the lines.. And it appears to be the correct take.

There's a world of difference between "I don't think upper management viewed this team as a playoff squad," and what we're seeing, which not only positions them as a lottery club, again, but presents a near nightly lack of compete and effort up and down the lineup. When that lack of effort is visible in seemingly stalled progress from potential young, franchise players to $40 and $50+ million dollar investments, there's a serious problem afoot.

Quinn has made some questionable moves from a line construction and lineup setting perspective. But this team has been awful because Zib, Strome, and Kreider have been non existent. Panarin has been a shell of what we saw last year. ADA a non factor and Trouba is still wildly inconsistent.. Sprinkle in some really bad goaltending and you have a dogshit and anit-freeze smoothie..

 

Coaching is one of the few professions where you get fired for guys who get paid exponentially more than you, not doing their jobs. Buch is the only guy in the top 6 playing like these games count, not going to win many games with that level of compete. Its embarrassing for the players if the coach needs to get them to play to their potential

Yes, and this is all still the responsibility of the coach to figure out. When this many things aren't functioning all at once, there's only so much of that you can mitigate away with cries of "no camp" and "Covid."

There's a world of difference between "I don't think upper management viewed this team as a playoff squad," and what we're seeing, which not only positions them as a lottery club, again, but presents a near nightly lack of compete and effort up and down the lineup. When that lack of effort is visible in seemingly stalled progress from potential young, franchise players to $40 and $50+ million dollar investments, there's a serious problem afoot.

 

 

 

Yes, and this is all still the responsibility of the coach to figure out. When this many things aren't functioning all at once, there's only so much of that you can mitigate away with cries of "no camp" and "Covid."

Totally agree here. If the team isn't engaging, that's on the coach for not getting this team ready to play. Lots of teams are dealing with COVID and had short camps, and they don't look like this team. Watching tis team, there is no spark, no urgency in a shortened season. And its not 1 or 2 players, it's a majority of the team.

Also, we all know the saying "Show me a good coach and I'll show you a good goalie."

The Ranger goalies have not been good, and that makes everything else worse.

Also, we all know the saying "Show me a good coach and I'll show you a good goalie."

 

The Ranger goalies have not been good, and that makes everything else worse.

100%.

Hey guys, I gassed up the bus for the ride to the GW bridge. Who’s getting on?

Cut me free when you guys get there!! I'll be the guy hanging from the center span!!! ;)

I know people think the captaincy is overrated or whatever, but I think it's damming that we haven't had one in 3 years.

I mentioned it last night but I wish Gorton and Co. could have brought some real, honest vets in here to help steer the ship in stormy weather. Koivu. Thornton. Perry. Whoever. Guys who have actually won something or accomplished something in their careers. Great, you wanna call Zib a leader, that's awesome, but he didn't figure out how to work out until the summer of 2019. He's still a kid himself.

the teams that go far have some age. They have guys who can run a room. That's not the coaches job.

People have shit on Quinn for being a college coach in the NHL but he's coaching a college-aged team right now.

How much would a decision on Quinn be Gorton's and how much would it be JD's call? Whatever JD has said in interviews, he's not vested in Quinn, as Gorton is.

The Rangers suddenly went from pretty lame to winning when Sheshty got hot, and now they are back to pretty lame when he's not hot. It's no coincidence.

With even "solid" goaltending we are probably looking at a 3-2-1 start at the absolute worst. That's even with the disengaged play and bizarre line combo switching.

I'd love more structure and a better collective mindset.. But I don't see them making a move unless things get much worse.

 

People have shit on Quinn for being a college coach in the NHL but he's coaching a college-aged team right now.

Well, that's still on the coach to have this team playing better than what they are. What's on Gorton is two fold. First, hiring a college coach that has zero NHL experience to coach NHL players with zero to minimal experience as well. Second is not bringing in any real veterans to show the ropes. Having said that, Gorton expected some of our other guys to step up. Kreider, Ziby, Panarin, et al. Especially Kreider. Dude has been in the league for 10 years almost. Previously they had some other leaders in Staal and Henrik but they ran them out of town. This idea that it's a bunch of college kids though is overblown. They are young, but 15 of the roster players are 24+ years old. By that age, you are getting close to who you actually are as a professional.

I just think this team is at a pretty big crossroads. If we end up basement dwellers all year, I don't see how Quinn keeps his job. Then you bring in someone else depending who is available and start with a new message that could take another year or two before it really sets in. That's a nightmare setback. If you do something THIS season, you wake the players up and give them the rest of this year to adjust to a new system and start next year completely fresh with new philosophy already in place.

This year in my opinion was a make or break year for playoffs. You need progression. It cannot be 3 straight years of spinning wheels rollercoaster seasons and expect that to ever change in the future just by age development.

Well, that's still on the coach to have this team playing better than what they are. What's on Gorton is two fold. First, hiring a college coach that has zero NHL experience to coach NHL players with zero to minimal experience as well. Second is not bringing in any real veterans to show the ropes. Having said that, Gorton expected some of our other guys to step up. Kreider, Ziby, Panarin, et al. Especially Kreider. Dude has been in the league for 10 years almost. Previously they had some other leaders in Staal and Henrik but they ran them out of town. This idea that it's a bunch of college kids though is overblown. They are young, but 15 of the roster players are 24+ years old. By that age, you are getting close to who you actually are as a professional.

 

I just think this team is at a pretty big crossroads. If we end up basement dwellers all year, I don't see how Quinn keeps his job. Then you bring in someone else depending who is available and start with a new message that could take another year or two before it really sets in. That's a nightmare setback. If you do something THIS season, you wake the players up and give them the rest of this year to adjust to a new system and start next year completely fresh with new philosophy already in place.

 

This year in my opinion was a make or break year for playoffs. You need progression. It cannot be 3 straight years of spinning wheels rollercoaster seasons and expect that to ever change in the future just by age development.

First of all, Hank and Staal were not "run out of town." They sucked pretty bad and have for the last few years. Their careers are over at this point.

But this team was going to miss the playoffs this year, no matter what. Division is way too hard. I think that's a pretty honest assessment. It's not make or break, and in fact JD has said over and over again that throughout this process there are setbacks. Two steps forward, one step back kind of thing. "It's a process."

So far this season feels like the step back we were all hoping didn't exist, but inevitably always does.

I don't blame Gorton for hiring Quinn. I think Quinn has done a good job. This team had no business being as good as they were last year. But they lucked into two top-end prospects and they need to treat them as such. I'm sure they never planned on that, but the plan has changed. Lafreniere and Kakko are the next faces of the Rangers franchise. Not Panarin. Not Zibanejad. Not Fox. Shesterkin. Miller, etc. Kakko and Lafreniere are the two players opposing teams will have to game plan for. Mackinnon and Rantanen. Marner and Matthews. But the Rangers don't seem to recognize that because they think they're better than they are.

All those guys mentioned were basically handed the keys to their respective teams. They were on the ice when they needed a goal. On the ice when they needed a stop. On the PP. On with an extra skater. That's how those guys learned to play the game. Even if they failed, they were the best players on the team so they just continued to go out and learn.

The Rangers are SO LUCKY to have Lafreniere. I know Kreider just signed, but I'm sorry, he's a 3rd liner on this team now. Lafreniere should be on the 1st line with Zibanejad.

Rangers are LUCKY to have Kakko. He should be on the 2nd line. With Panarin.

Give. These. Kids. A. Chance. Let them make mistakes. That's part of the deal. I know the Rangers want to "win now" but the plan has changed with these two prospects.