LindG1000 Posted October 25, 2021 Share Posted October 25, 2021 7 hours ago, Keirik said: Besides, as much as I think it makes some sense, Toews is a shell of himself right now after whatever issues that kept him out last year. We really don’t need to trade a ton just to get some extra leadership. If we are just looking for that, we could probably look at Getzlaf for cheaper on an expiring contract closer to the deadline if we are in a solidified playoff position ready to make a run. No? Kane would be way too expensive. He’s not really on decline yet. I hear the concern, but it's real hard to say what Toews is right now because that Blackhawks team is absolutely putrid. It's also hard to say what you want Toews to be in this lineup; I'd guess you'd want him to be your 3c and actually play the 3c role. You run it through AZ as Phil said - you're talking 5.25M on the Hawks, 2.625 each on the Rangers and Coyotes. Yotes totally do it; it's a spend of 1.725 for a hit of 2.625 with a sweetener from the Rangers. At that price - and for the likely prospect/pick cost? Yeah, I'm all over it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keirik Posted October 25, 2021 Share Posted October 25, 2021 2 hours ago, G1000 said: I hear the concern, but it's real hard to say what Toews is right now because that Blackhawks team is absolutely putrid. It's also hard to say what you want Toews to be in this lineup; I'd guess you'd want him to be your 3c and actually play the 3c role. You run it through AZ as Phil said - you're talking 5.25M on the Hawks, 2.625 each on the Rangers and Coyotes. Yotes totally do it; it's a spend of 1.725 for a hit of 2.625 with a sweetener from the Rangers. At that price - and for the likely prospect/pick cost? Yeah, I'm all over it. My only issue with it would be the cost prospect wise and the such. I’m not sure we need a figure head leader as much as we might have needed going into this year. We seem to be finding a bit of a groove and having our older guys blossom a bit. I guess the upside is he could fill a 2c role next year when we lose Strome but I’m still not sure I would like losing too many pieces when no one really knows what he has left. He has played only a handful of games really since March 2020. Awful big of a game le even if it’s not at a big cap hit because it’s not like he’s the type that can come in and not be seen as captain serious. If he’s not leading though with production it’s not as big of a need though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lefty9 Posted October 25, 2021 Share Posted October 25, 2021 19 hours ago, Phil said: Toews is 33, not 43. But be has been I injured quite a bit ,he has played a lot of minutes and isn't the biggest guy,so I would be little worried Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangersIn7 Posted October 25, 2021 Share Posted October 25, 2021 (edited) There would have to be massive salary retention involved obviously. Chicago or a 3rd party would have to eat a boat load on the cap hit. Rangers can’t do it, even for 2 seasons, if they have to carry more than 50% of the cap hit. Price on Kane will be pretty damn high still. Yes he turns 34 in November, but he’s still very productive and that doesn’t look to change in the next 21 months. I’d be very interested in him. Very. Toews I’d want to wait and see. Not sure what he’s got left. As stated by others already I’m sure, he didn’t play hockey for an entire year due to illness and he’s gotten off to a very slow start thus far. Hard to gauge him just yet, as the Hawks are awful and he’s just getting his feet wet again. Have to give him time. I don’t know much about the illness he had/has, how it’s treated or if it can be cured or neutralized, nor how it might affect someone who is a professional athlete. But if either of them are interested in coming here, and they can get 50% retained, what’s the price??? Have to imagine it would be something in the realm of a 1st round pick, plus a couple of prospects. But who knows? Edited October 25, 2021 by RangersIn7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LindG1000 Posted October 25, 2021 Share Posted October 25, 2021 8 hours ago, Keirik said: My only issue with it would be the cost prospect wise and the such. I’m not sure we need a figure head leader as much as we might have needed going into this year. We seem to be finding a bit of a groove and having our older guys blossom a bit. I guess the upside is he could fill a 2c role next year when we lose Strome but I’m still not sure I would like losing too many pieces when no one really knows what he has left. He has played only a handful of games really since March 2020. Awful big of a game le even if it’s not at a big cap hit because it’s not like he’s the type that can come in and not be seen as captain serious. If he’s not leading though with production it’s not as big of a need though. For sure, but realistically, it's a cost in futures at this point and requires a lot of dominoes to fall to make it plausible anyway. The Blackhawks seem like they're hurtling toward blowing it up, and if they do - "what's Kane/Toews worth to a team for 18 months?" is the key question. This offseason was a colossal fuckup for the Hawks, and the sole saving grace they're going to have is that they can trade Kane, Toews, and maybe Fleury on name recognition alone to start a rebuild. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted October 25, 2021 Share Posted October 25, 2021 Toews has a $4M signing bonus due next summer. Then $2.9M base salary. Double retention brings his cap hit to $2.5M and the teams being asked to reduce his AAV are only on the hook for $1.45M (CHI) and $725K (ARI) respectively. It's entirely doable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LindG1000 Posted October 25, 2021 Share Posted October 25, 2021 5 minutes ago, Phil said: Toews has a $4M signing bonus due next summer. Then $2.9M base salary. Double retention brings his cap hit to $2.5M and the teams being asked to reduce his AAV are only on the hook for $1.45M (CHI) and $725K (ARI) respectively. It's entirely doable. The money is very doable. The trade....no idea. Way too early to tell what Toews is after such a crazy long amount of time off the ice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted October 25, 2021 Share Posted October 25, 2021 2 minutes ago, G1000 said: The money is very doable. The trade....no idea. Way too early to tell what Toews is after such a crazy long amount of time off the ice. That's why I said next summer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LindG1000 Posted October 25, 2021 Share Posted October 25, 2021 2 minutes ago, Phil said: That's why I said next summer. The Blackhawks may want to move faster than that - it's really all on how quickly they realize how bad that team is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzy Posted October 25, 2021 Share Posted October 25, 2021 6 minutes ago, G1000 said: The Blackhawks may want to move faster than that - it's really all on how quickly they realize how bad that team is. Maybe the trade deadline this season...by then we'll have a better feel for how Toewes is going to fare, and if he'll be a good add for a solid playoff run. I like Toewes a lot, and he has an immense amount of experience, leadership, a few rings and HOLD IT.....wait a second!!! He can win faceoffs!! LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted October 25, 2021 Share Posted October 25, 2021 1 hour ago, G1000 said: The Blackhawks may want to move faster than that - it's really all on how quickly they realize how bad that team is. OK, well, even if that's the case, it's still worth it. The math doesn't change, it just carries over for one more year. The whole goal would be to have him under contract at 75% off for a run next season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keirik Posted October 25, 2021 Share Posted October 25, 2021 2 hours ago, G1000 said: The Blackhawks may want to move faster than that - it's really all on how quickly they realize how bad that team is. I think they fire the coach before traded two icons anyway. I can’t imagine he gets too much more time. 4th season as HC and there doesn’t seem to be a ton of progress really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzy Posted October 25, 2021 Share Posted October 25, 2021 47 minutes ago, Phil said: OK, well, even if that's the case, it's still worth it. The math doesn't change, it just carries over for one more year. The whole goal would be to have him under contract at 75% off for a run next season. We would go from being, what used to be one of the weaker teams up the middle to arguably one of the most feared!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted October 25, 2021 Share Posted October 25, 2021 I mean, there's an argument to be made that Toews is a significant upgrade on Chytil. Zibanejad/Strome/Toews is a playoff-contending center group. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzy Posted October 25, 2021 Share Posted October 25, 2021 33 minutes ago, Phil said: I mean, there's an argument to be made that Toews is a significant upgrade on Chytil. Zibanejad/Strome/Toews is a playoff-contending center group. Zibby/Strome/Toewes/Rooney.....that's got some serious potential in my estimation!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albatrosss Posted October 25, 2021 Share Posted October 25, 2021 accept you're thinking of Toewes from like 7 years ago Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cash or Czech Posted October 25, 2021 Share Posted October 25, 2021 Even in 2019-20, two seasons ago, the season before his injury, he put up 60 points in 70 games and 9 points in 9 playoff games. Yes, he's a risk because of injury. But it's not like he's been on a downward spiral for years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winter Posted October 26, 2021 Share Posted October 26, 2021 On 10/24/2021 at 12:11 PM, Phil said: Get a second team (Arizona) involved to get him to $2.5M~ and they can absolutely afford it. Like, can they do Krav to ARI, Chytil+ to CHI, each eating 50%, and Toews to NYR? Doesn't seem that difficult. If this happening then we're out on Kane or Toews and they'd be in TB ... its how they roll. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keirik Posted October 26, 2021 Share Posted October 26, 2021 7 hours ago, Xander said: Even in 2019-20, two seasons ago, the season before his injury, he put up 60 points in 70 games and 9 points in 9 playoff games. Yes, he's a risk because of injury. But it's not like he's been on a downward spiral for years. You’re right. He hasn’t. But you still can’t take away a lack of play I’m trying time for an entire season and just discount it. I’d buy pennies on the dollar. If not, then pass please. We could just as easily find another guy at a diff point. Getzlaf likely would be available at the deadline for less. Hell, even Toews would cost less at that time too. Or as I suggested maybe the other Strome. Lots of options. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwoMinutesForNothing Posted October 27, 2021 Share Posted October 27, 2021 Don't know how desirable these guys will be now that Beach is saying they knew. Kane is also a pretty trash person to begin with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Posted October 27, 2021 Share Posted October 27, 2021 Not sure who'd be looking at 21 year olds to be whistleblowers on a team with 30 year old Boynton, Hossa, Madden and Campbell... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwoMinutesForNothing Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 Well I mean probably anybody who looked around the room to see who had the "C" on his chest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keirik Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 Blackhawks just fell to 0-21-1 tonight I think Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 1 hour ago, TwoMinutesForNothing said: Well I mean probably anybody who looked around the room to see who had the "C" on his chest. Yea we can have a debate on if 21 year olds should have a C, but that's for another thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H-Dreamer Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 7 hours ago, Pete said: Yea we can have a debate on if 21 year olds should have a C, but that's for another thread. There's a debate to be had what he could have done differently 10 years ago, but the statements he made yesterday really don't look good either. Certainly don't want him anywhere near the Rangers now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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