Mercogliano Complicated Negogiations Expected on K'Andre Miller's Second Contract

[LindG1000]

If he can get that kind of payday and term elsewhere, I wouldn't begrudge him taking it. It'd absolutely suck for us, but our cap situation doesn't allow for Miller to get paid like a high-end #2 right now.

 

 

[jsm7302]

3 minutes ago, LindG1000 said:

If he can get that kind of payday and term elsewhere, I wouldn't begrudge him taking it. It'd absolutely suck for us, but our cap situation doesn't allow for Miller to get paid like a high-end #2 right now.

 

 

You're right, it doesn't and honestly he could be an Adam Fox on another team. Selling him for a RW with his same trajectory on a good or expiring contract next year would be fantastic roster management.

[LindG1000]

2 minutes ago, jsm7302 said:

You're right, it doesn't and honestly he could be an Adam Fox on another team. Selling him for a RW with his same trajectory on a good or expiring contract next year would be fantastic roster management.

I don't really want to do it, because we are so thin at LD as it is and I think Miller still has so much untapped potential, but I can't sit here and be mad at the dude if he wants to sign a 7 year 44 million dollar contract that drops him into free agency in his late 20s somewhere that isn't here. 

[Pete]

2 hours ago, Cash or Czech said:

Head back home? Are we trading him to Minnesota? They're losing Dumba and their cap situation is as fucked as ours.

I think they mean holding out. 

[BrooksBurner]

The contract projections are exactly why I was on the Trade Miller boat.

 

- He's got enough points as a defenseman that makes him expensive for what he provides defensively.

- Raw skill set, size and speed, is attractive to other teams via trade, increased trade value. Defensive shortcomings get overlooked by the shininess.

- Offensive upside capped in NY behind Fox as the primary offensive defenseman option, so his strength is blocked and will only get half-used here. That's bad business for both parties.

- Lindgren is a better, and cheaper, defense-first option, and they can't keep all of the current top 4 if they want to have enough $ at forward. Lindgren > Miller for this unit.

 

Cash the value in.

[jsm7302]

6 minutes ago, BrooksBurner said:

The contract projections are exactly why I was on the Trade Miller boat.

 

- He's got enough points as a defenseman that makes him expensive for what he provides defensively.

- Raw skill set, size and speed, is attractive to other teams via trade, increased trade value. Defensive shortcomings get overlooked by the shininess.

- Offensive upside capped in NY behind Fox as the primary offensive defenseman option, so his strength is blocked and will only get half-used here. That's bad business for both parties.

- Lindgren is a better, and cheaper, defense-first option, and they can't keep all of the current top 4 if they want to have enough $ at forward. Lindgren > Miller for this unit.

 

Cash the value in.

Get out of my head!!! Or pay rent!!!

[RangersIn7]

48 minutes ago, BrooksBurner said:

The contract projections are exactly why I was on the Trade Miller boat.

 

- He's got enough points as a defenseman that makes him expensive for what he provides defensively.

- Raw skill set, size and speed, is attractive to other teams via trade, increased trade value. Defensive shortcomings get overlooked by the shininess.

- Offensive upside capped in NY behind Fox as the primary offensive defenseman option, so his strength is blocked and will only get half-used here. That's bad business for both parties.

- Lindgren is a better, and cheaper, defense-first option, and they can't keep all of the current top 4 if they want to have enough $ at forward. Lindgren > Miller for this unit.

 

Cash the value in.

Are you in the “He will improve defensively” camp?

[Blue Heaven]

58 minutes ago, BrooksBurner said:

The contract projections are exactly why I was on the Trade Miller boat.

 

- He's got enough points as a defenseman that makes him expensive for what he provides defensively.

- Raw skill set, size and speed, is attractive to other teams via trade, increased trade value. Defensive shortcomings get overlooked by the shininess.

- Offensive upside capped in NY behind Fox as the primary offensive defenseman option, so his strength is blocked and will only get half-used here. That's bad business for both parties.

- Lindgren is a better, and cheaper, defense-first option, and they can't keep all of the current top 4 if they want to have enough $ at forward. Lindgren > Miller for this unit.

 

Cash the value in.

Lindgren will be cheaper this season, then he will be due a bump which he would probably be in the range of $5.5 million.  Wear and tear on his body is taking a toll, dude is getting hurt towards the end of the year/playoffs every year now.....Look at Girardi.  Short term Lindgren is better, long term, not so much.  

[Pete]

Unless you're getting a 65-75 point right wing for him, you don't move Miller because we don't have a backfill for him.

 

 

[RangersIn7]

21 minutes ago, Pete said:

Unless you're getting a 65-75 point right wing for him, you don't move Miller because we don't have a backfill for him.

 

 

And even that might be a reach…

 

Last I counted, they only have two LHD. 

[BrooksBurner]

6 minutes ago, RangersIn7 said:

Are you in the “He will improve defensively” camp?

 

Marginally, maybe. I see a faster version of Brady Skjei.

[BrooksBurner]

1 hour ago, Blue Heaven said:

Lindgren will be cheaper this season, then he will be due a bump which he would probably be in the range of $5.5 million.  Wear and tear on his body is taking a toll, dude is getting hurt towards the end of the year/playoffs every year now.....Look at Girardi.  Short term Lindgren is better, long term, not so much.  

 

That's fine with me. I've got no problems with a 6 year contract extension on Lindgren for age 26-32. Girardi signed a 6 year deal for ages 30-36. Big difference.

[The Dude]

4 hours ago, RangersIn7 said:

And even that might be a reach…

 

Last I counted, they only have two LHD. 

When did Robertson and Jones become non factors as far as future pieces?

 

Jones gets a pass because Gallant didn't want to use him on his 3rd pairing.

 

Robertson was all everyone has been talking about for 2 years now. But now he stinks? 

 

 

And hello? Hajek!!?? LOL.

 

[Pete]

Pang was on the Marek show recently talking about Vegas being the best defensive core in the league because they are all tall, can skate, and have long sticks. So it just causes a slog in the middle of the ice that's hard to get through, without being overly physical.

 

Think about the way defenses are trending before shipping Miller out. 

[Phil]

58 minutes ago, Pete said:

Pang was on the Marek show recently talking about Vegas being the best defensive core in the league because they are all tall, can skate, and have long sticks. So it just causes a slog in the middle of the ice that's hard to get through, without being overly physical.

 

Think about the way defenses are trending before shipping Miller out. 

 

100%. I have very little interest moving usable size. Miller has all the tools you want out of a potential top pairing defender. He needs structure. The rest is worth drooling over.

[LindG1000]

I don't think most of us (won't speak for ol' Larry Brooks there) want to ship Miller out so much as we're not seeing the path to keeping him if a team were to offer him that market value deal EvolvingHockey was throwing around.

 

You're not talking about shipping Goodrow out at that point. You're talking about Trocheck or Trouba and I imagine those are far trickier trades.

[BrooksBurner]

22 minutes ago, LindG1000 said:

I don't think most of us (won't speak for ol' Larry Brooks there) want to ship Miller out so much as we're not seeing the path to keeping him if a team were to offer him that market value deal EvolvingHockey was throwing around.

 

You're not talking about shipping Goodrow out at that point. You're talking about Trocheck or Trouba and I imagine those are far trickier trades.

Or Panarin, even with a few million retained.

[Albatrosss]

1 hour ago, Pete said:

Pang was on the Marek show recently talking about Vegas being the best defensive core in the league because they are all tall, can skate, and have long sticks. So it just causes a slog in the middle of the ice that's hard to get through, without being overly physical.

 

Think about the way defenses are trending before shipping Miller out. 

so keep Miller, trade Fox?

[Pete]

3 hours ago, LindG1000 said:

I don't think most of us (won't speak for ol' Larry Brooks there) want to ship Miller out so much as we're not seeing the path to keeping him if a team were to offer him that market value deal EvolvingHockey was throwing around.

 

You're not talking about shipping Goodrow out at that point. You're talking about Trocheck or Trouba and I imagine those are far trickier trades.

Which isn't going to happen. GMs don't do offer sheets. The ones that were done, haven't looked great.

[RangersIn7]

On 6/12/2023 at 7:16 PM, The Dude said:

When did Robertson and Jones become non factors as far as future pieces?

 

Jones gets a pass because Gallant didn't want to use him on his 3rd pairing.

 

Robertson was all everyone has been talking about for 2 years now. But now he stinks? 

 

 

And hello? Hajek!!?? LOL.

 

I’m not saying they’re non-factors.

 

What I’m saying, and I should have been more clear, I’d that they only have 2 PROVEN guys at LD.

 

We have no idea what Jones or Robertson will do at NHL level. 
 

Jones has less than 40 games of NHL experience. Plus, he’s an offensive guy and more of a puck moving type. Not exactly what’s required there.

 

Robertson fits the bill as to what is needed back there. But he’s yet to play a game in the NHL. 
 

Harpur is fine as the 7th guy. Brings size, and despite what his metrics say, he was actually better than what’s indicated from them and managed to play even hockey last year.

 

Ill add that of the 4 guys they brought in last year, the two I’d most want back are actually Mikkola and Motte. 
Im confident they’ll find a way to keep Motte. Not so on Mikkola. Which kind of sucks. I thought he performed so well for them last year. 
 

Damn COVID and flat cap!

 

Cap would be $5 million more than it is now, at least. Possibly $6-8 million more. And there would be no issues. 

[RangersIn7]

20 hours ago, Pete said:

Pang was on the Marek show recently talking about Vegas being the best defensive core in the league because they are all tall, can skate, and have long sticks. So it just causes a slog in the middle of the ice that's hard to get through, without being overly physical.

 

Think about the way defenses are trending before shipping Miller out. 

Miller is going to get better in his own end. Substantially I think. And he’ll benefit a lot from actually having a defensive system in place and all that comes with that. 
 

Hopefully Trouba too. 

[Pete]

27 minutes ago, RangersIn7 said:

Miller is going to get better in his own end. Substantially I think. And he’ll benefit a lot from actually having a defensive system in place and all that comes with that. 
 

Hopefully Trouba too. 

They all are going to get better. They'll have a system to support them when they make mistakes. 

[Sharpshooter]

If the cap could up $15 million or so in short order, that would be great.

[RangersIn7]

19 minutes ago, Sharpshooter said:

If the cap could up $15 million or so in short order, that would be great.

Cap was $81.5 in 19-20 when COVID hit.

 

Obviously, you don’t know the exact number, but based on history and what the average annual increase is, suffice to say, it would at least be in the $87-88 million range now. And we’d be looking at probably $90 million for next season.
 

To your point, there’s an increase coming in both the 24-25 and 25-26 seasons. Projection is around $87.5-88 million in 24-25 and then up above $90 million ($92.5 actually) for 25-26. 
 

No COVID, and that’s where we would be sitting at already, today. 
 

You won’t see $15 million.

But it looks like close to $10 million over the next two offseasons.

Edited June 14, 2023 by RangersIn7

[Ozzy]

I wanna see Harpur in a system that gives him more puck support.  He played pretty well with ZERO help last season.  I think he's going to be a lot better this season under Laviolette.  He's exactly the kind of player that works well with a good system in place.