[brooks] Rangers Should Not Trade Kevin Hayes

[Albatrosss]

cap is going up every year. so in 3 years 7mill against the cap is like 6 mill now. not saying that Hayes will get 7M

[josh]

what about Zib-Hayes 1-3 and Hughes at 2C? if they keep Hayes at 6M or under?

 

Yeah... if Hughes comes as expected. If he’s RNH, then we are in the same spot with a 3rd line C making $7m.

 

Additionally, have to remener that Hayes, traditionally, has been less effective with less icetime and inferior linemates.

I’ll play around with capfriendly on this one. But I don’t see Hughes to NY as likely.

[ThirtyONE]

cap is going up every year. so in 3 years 7mill against the cap is like 6 mill now. not saying that Hayes will get 7M

 

Money isn't the issue to me. To me, the issue is simply this:

 

- The Rangers are not contenders and not close to being contenders as they're arguably the worst team in the league this year.

 

- Kevin Hayes is in his prime RIGHT NOW. He'll be 27 at the end of the year which gives him roughly two or three more seasons of prime production.

 

- The Rangers will not suddenly go from league worst to cup contenders overnight. Not this year. Not next year. They probably won't even make the playoffs for another couple of seasons.

 

If all of these are true, then why would you want to keep Hayes? His value is as a trade piece, not as a #2 center on a bottom feeding team.

 

 

The other thing to think about is that if you trade Hayes and Zucc and whoever else, this team has a MUCH better chance of bombing down the standings and giving themselves a shot at a true franchise player. To me this is almost more important than anything. Jack Hughes, by all accounts, is a future star. And if we're going to suck, this year is a good year to suck the most.

[BrooksBurner]

If Hayes puts up 60 points he is getting close to Nylander money.

[Pete]

I?m not sold on Zib-Hayes 1-2.

 

The 2 years we?ve had that combo, well...

 

I?d much rather be wronged when they re-sign Hayes than resigning Zucc or overpaying Vesey and Fast

It's amazing that you blame the failures of the team on 2 players who weren't the problem...

If Hayes puts up 60 points he is getting close to Nylander money.

Nah. 5+ years older.

[josh]

Blaming? :rolleyes: sure bud. Try actually reading and stop interjecting your negative thoughts to trigger yourself.

 

 

Team lacks top end talent. A team can only have so many complimentary players. We have way too many. 1 is coming up on free agency and may fetch a hefty haul (and I don’t even care about draft picks).

[BrooksBurner]

Nah. 5+ years older.

 

Sure, but he will be a UFA with a lot more suitors and leverage than Nylander. 27 isn't that old from the perspective of a contending team. A 6 year deal takes him to 33...big deal.

[Pete]

Blaming? :rolleyes: sure bud. Try actually reading and stop interjecting your negative thoughts to trigger yourself.

 

 

Team lacks top end talent. A team can only have so many complimentary players. We have way too many. 1 is coming up on free agency and may fetch a hefty haul (and I don?t even care about draft picks).

We have 2 centers pacing 70ish points. Wake the fuck up.

[Pete]

Sure, but he will be a UFA with a lot more suitors and leverage than Nylander. 27 isn't that old from the perspective of a contending team. A 6 year deal takes him to 33...big deal.

27 isn't old for us.

 

If we can contend in 3 years, he's 30. We can't have a 30 year old on the team?

 

He won't have wear and year and doesn't depend on speed.

 

Not sure what issue is.

[josh]

Sure, but he will be a UFA with a lot more suitors and leverage than Nylander. 27 isn't that old from the perspective of a contending team. A 6 year deal takes him to 33...big deal.

 

Nylander cap hit should be the ceiling (6.9)

 

Nylander is making 7.5 per season, average. Hayes shouldn’t get that.

[josh]

We have 2 centers pacing 70ish points. Wake the fuck up.

 

Since when have you been an “on pace” guy?

 

Again, I’ve been saying the same thing the entire time -

I like Hayes, and I’ve liked what Zibanejad has been doing, just have a hard time believing these guys compare to top 1-2 combos around the league.

 

“But if we put 10 all stars around them” doesn’t count.

[BrooksBurner]

You guys are in for a surprise if Hayes gets to 60-65 points. 6.9 per is not a ceiling at that production level for a big 2 way center.

[BrooksBurner]

27 isn't old for us.

 

If we can contend in 3 years, he's 30. We can't have a 30 year old on the team?

 

He won't have wear and year and doesn't depend on speed.

 

Not sure what issue is.

 

I don't disagree, but I value him more as helping us get pieces to build up that defensive core, and possibly using the cap hit towards any top defenders that hit the market instead.

[Pete]

Since when have you been an ?on pace? guy?

 

Again, I?ve been saying the same thing the entire time -

I like Hayes, and I?ve liked what Zibanejad has been doing, just have a hard time believing these guys compare to top 1-2 combos around the league.

 

?But if we put 10 all stars around them? doesn?t count.

OK so answer me this.... When have you not thought anyone was over paid or thought a Ranger was worth paying?

 

Two 70 point centers who can both play D are better than MacKinnon as your #1 and fucking RNH as #2.

[josh]

Fast, Holden, & Kreider

 

I’d take MacKinnon and RNH over Zibanefad and Hayes.

Love MacKinnon. And a 2nd line center of RNH, Zibanejad or Hayes, sure.

[BrooksBurner]

I would trade Hayes and Zibanejad just for MacKinnon.

[Pete]

Fast, Holden, & Kreider

 

I?d take MacKinnon and RNH over Zibanefad and Hayes.

Love MacKinnon. And a 2nd line center of RNH, Zibanejad or Hayes, sure.

Holiday party, Josh?

[ThirtyONE]

I would trade Hayes and Zibanejad just for MacKinnon.

 

Same. I guess I've repped you too much recently. We're on the same page with all of this.

[BrooksBurner]

Same. I guess I've repped you too much recently. We're on the same page with all of this.

 

I am so tired of having high quantity without high quality. You really need both to win the Cup, but high quality is much harder to get.

[josh]

I would trade Hayes and Zibanejad just for MacKinnon.

 

The type of package for an upgrade I’d be praying for. Doesn’t need to be those two, necessarily, but yeah

[Vodka Drunkenski]

Sell high. His value to this team will never be higher than it is right now / this year's deadline.

 

I agree, need to trade him

[Zuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuc]

OK so answer me this.... When have you not thought anyone was over paid or thought a Ranger was worth paying?

 

Two 70 point centers who can both play D are better than MacKinnon as your #1 and fucking RNH as #2.

 

But Hayes and Zib has been 70 point players for 3 months only. MacKinnon alone is better than both of them together and RNH is also pacing 70 point and plays solid D too, so no - this is wrong. MacKinnon is actually pacing 125 points, so he's almost as productive as our two guys together. MacK&RNH is a MUCH better duo than Zib&Hayes.

 

Besides - do you really think both Zib and Hayes could be consistent 70 point players? Because if we're paying Hayes we have to rely on that. Hayes' 7m would be a lot of our cap, so we have to trust him then. Im just not sold on him yet, we all know how bad and annoying he can be. Players tend to play better when they're playing for a contract, why would that not be the case with Hayes?

 

If we sign Hayes for 7m and he goes back to last year Hayes' we're fucked. That would be like carrying the G/Staal contracts again.

[Pete]

But Hayes and Zib has been 70 point players for 3 months only. MacKinnon alone is better than both of them together and RNH is also pacing 70 point and plays solid D too, so no - this is wrong. MacKinnon is actually pacing 125 points, so he's almost as productive as our two guys together. MacK&RNH is a MUCH better duo than Zib&Hayes.

 

Besides - do you really think both Zib and Hayes could be consistent 70 point players? Because if we're paying Hayes we have to rely on that. Hayes' 7m would be a lot of our cap, so we have to trust him then. Im just not sold on him yet, we all know how bad and annoying he can be. Players tend to play better when they're playing for a contract, why would that not be the case with Hayes?

 

If we sign Hayes for 7m and he goes back to last year Hayes' we're fucked. That would be like carrying the G/Staal contracts again.

Fine RNH was a bad example but clearly the point is that I'd rather have a balanced offense.

 

I'm sure Josh wouldn't want RNH and McDavid because their the top 2 centers and aren't helping the team win...

 

It really comes down to if you think Hayes has a work ethic. He's starting to win me over.

 

It's nothing about him being old when we're ready to compete. That's nonsense.

[Dunny]

Yes, that's the general rule I've come to notice in the past six months. If the player is going to be 28 or older by the time the Rangers are "ready to compete" then he must go now.

 

For a late 1st rounder.

[Kevin]

I appreciate the things that Hayes does on the ice. This year his off-ice conditioning has allowed him to play at an even higher level than we've seen. I know it's a contract year and we've seen this type of behavior in the past by others (peaking when the $ is on the line) but I still feel Hayes is part of the answer to getting us to the Stanley Cup. I'd re-sign him.