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Hurricanes Reportedly Want Top-Six Forward 'ASAP'

Phil

By Phil
in Hockey Around the Globe

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Phil BSBH Legend

Phil

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The Carolina Hurricanes reportedly aren't done trying to bolster their group up front after failing to acquire William Nylander.

 

"I can tell (you) Carolina - which really, really, really wanted to get in on Nylander and never really got that shot - they want a top-six forward ASAP, and they've got the surplus on defense to make it happen," TSN's Pierre LeBrun said on Thursday's edition of "Insider Trading."

 

Carolina is deep on the back end, boasting the likes of Jaccob Slavin, Dougie Hamilton, Justin Faulk, and Calvin de Haan, in addition to Brett Pesce and Trevor van Riemsdyk.

 

The Hurricanes' forward depth has taken a hit due to injuries, with Jordan Staal being ruled out of Friday's game against the Anaheim Ducks due to a concussion and Micheal Ferland still dealing with a head injury of his own.

 

https://www.thescore.com/news/1671979

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Pete BSBH Legend

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Kreider for Pesce? Never.

 

He's got 3 points in 18 games this season, played under 20 min a night and has 56% O-zone starts. He's a good 2nd pair guy, but thats it. Not giving up Kreider for that.

 

Well, "under 20 minutes"...19:23. He's only a third pair guy because he's behind Dougie Hamilton and Justin Faulk. There's really no shame in that. He'd probably be a solid compliment to Skjei.

 

The good thing about him is that he's cost controlled for 3 more years. I don't think I'd do Krieder straight up, but it's certainly the starting point of a package. I'd try to grab a center from them, Drury or the Finnish guy that P/G in the AHL and then trade Hayes. They're in win now mode, apparently.

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Zuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuc BSBH Legend

Zuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuc

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But surely they’re not giving you Pesce for a rental. Or am I missing something here.

I mean, I don’t love the idea of Kreider for Pesce, but he’s basically the only top 6 guy we have to trade bar rentals.

 

Canes have a shitload of cap and have their top 4 locked in for the next 2 seasons (no one over 27y, so can re-sign aswell). TVD is a solid bottom pair player and they have guys like Fox in the system. Resigning Hayes shouldn't be out of the picture? Staal on the wrong side of 30 now aswell.

 

They won't trade Pesce for a rental Zuc or Hayes, but they would for a signed Hayes.

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Zuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuc BSBH Legend

Zuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuc

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Well, "under 20 minutes"...19:23. He's only a third pair guy because he's behind Dougie Hamilton and Justin Faulk. There's really no shame in that. He'd probably be a solid compliment to Skjei.

 

The good thing about him is that he's cost controlled for 3 more years. I don't think I'd do Krieder straight up, but it's certainly the starting point of a package. I'd try to grab a center from them, Drury or the Finnish guy that P/G in the AHL and then trade Hayes. They're in win now mode, apparently.

 

yeah I know, thats why I said he's a good 2nd pair player. But I'm still not trading Kreids for him. Pesce and a 1st? Maybe.

 

I really don't want to trade Kreids tho. So I would probably say no to a lot lol.

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Pete BSBH Legend

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yeah I know, thats why I said he's a good 2nd pair player. But I'm still not trading Kreids for him. Pesce and a 1st? Maybe.

 

I really don't want to trade Kreids tho. So I would probably say no to a lot lol.

 

I don't see them giving a first, but I'd rather have a recent pick who's a little closer to the NHL.

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Future BSBH Mite

Future

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Pesce is a huge miss in a trade for Hayes. It would have to be Pesce and Fox, at least, for me to think of moving Hayes. You absolutely have to get high upside back with Hayes, or you've wasted him.

 

The issue with Pesce is that he's an upgrade defensively over anyone on our right side, so on this team, you throw him on the first pair, but he's a third pair defender and there's no sign that he's more than that. Buffalo tried the same shortcut with Gorges and Scandella. Long term, he's still a guy who you'd need to upgrade on to be a real contender, so what's really the point?

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Phil BSBH Legend

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He's a third pair defender on the Hurricanes. Because he plays behind Hamilton and Faulk.

 

I agree it's a stretch to hope he can simply step into a first-pairing role successfully, but there's no doubt in my mind he would instantly become the team's most reliable RD.

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He's a third pair defender on the Hurricanes. Because he plays behind Hamilton and Faulk.

 

I agree it's a stretch to hope he can simply step into a first-pairing role successfully, but there's no doubt in my mind he would instantly become the team's most reliable RD.

Being stuck behind Faulk is like being stuck behind Pionk.

 

 

 

Basically.

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Pete BSBH Legend

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He's the third pair defender the same way Kucherov and Point are "just second liners" and McD is a Norris Candidate and a "second pair" guy.

 

His TOI, OZ% DZ% and metrics are in the realm of Dougie Hamilton (not that I think he's Hamilton), but he gets no PP time.

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Phil BSBH Legend

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aHR0cDovL3d3dy5zcGFjZS5jb20vaW1hZ2VzL2kvMDAwLzAwMC8xMjYvb3JpZ2luYWwvY2hpbGUtZWFydGhxdWFrZS1lYXJ0aC1kYXlzMi0xMDAzMDItMDIuanBn

 

Sorry, I'm not seeing it. They're similar players insofar as they are both offense first, but Faulk's metrics are infinitely more palatable. I recognize that some of this comes from Pionk's usage as a top-pairing player (which we both agree he is far from), but that's only been true of this season. Neither is a particularly large sample size, but if you look at his last two seasons in which he's effectively played about 30 games each, his relative metrics are astronomically bad.

 

So, even if you want to dispell the notion that he looks worse because of his usage this season, how do you square that with the fact that in a nearly identical sample size, he had a minus-6.3 CF rel and FF rel last season? Please don't try to sweep all of this up to a 60% dZS either. Because it's basically three percentage points higher than the one he has now.

 

Faulk, meanwhile, shows positives in both for his career (albeit just barely).

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Future BSBH Mite

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He's the third pair defender the same way Kucherov and Point are "just second liners" and McD is a Norris Candidate and a "second pair" guy.

 

His TOI, OZ% DZ% and metrics are in the realm of Dougie Hamilton (not that I think he's Hamilton), but he gets no PP time.

Joke's on you. Kucherov and Point is the first line, Stamkos and Gourde is the 2nd (semantics, FTW).

 

Define "in the realm of," because Dougie plays 1:30 more per game at 5v5 and has a 62.2% Corsi compared to Pesce at 55.3% while, presumably, playing against the better competition. And not for nothing, but Pesce is the absolute worst of the Canes' regulars in Rel CF. Pesce is their top PKer.

 

Pesce is basically a younger, slightly worse version of Tanev/Vlasic/Torts Girardi. You can throw them on the first pair, sure, but they're not really #1 defenders and don't move the needle for a rebuilding team at all. They're the kind of guys who are pretty much always available if you need one. I'm not trading Hayes for that.

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Sorry, I'm not seeing it. They're similar players insofar as they are both offense first, but Faulk's metrics are infinitely more palatable. I recognize that some of this comes from Pionk's usage as a top-pairing player (which we both agree he is far from), but that's only been true of this season. Neither is a particularly large sample size, but if you look at his last two seasons in which he's effectively played about 30 games each, his relative metrics are astronomically bad.

 

So, even if you want to dispell the notion that he looks worse because of his usage this season, how do you square that with the fact that in a nearly identical sample size, he had a minus-6.3 CF rel and FF rel last season? Please don't try to sweep all of this up to a 60% dZS either. Because it's basically three percentage points higher than the one he has now.

 

Faulk, meanwhile, shows positives in both for his career (albeit just barely).

I was kidding lol.

 

Though I don't think Faulk is nearly the player he was in 2015.

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Pete BSBH Legend

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Joke's on you. Kucherov and Point is the first line, Stamkos and Gourde is the 2nd (semantics, FTW).
Nope.

 

Define "in the realm of," because Dougie plays 1:30 more per game at 5v5 and has a 62.2% Corsi compared to Pesce at 55.3% while, presumably, playing against the better competition. And not for nothing, but Pesce is the absolute worst of the Canes' regulars in Rel CF. Pesce is their top PKer.

 

Pesce is basically a younger, slightly worse version of Tanev/Vlasic/Torts Girardi. You can throw them on the first pair, sure, but they're not really #1 defenders and don't move the needle for a rebuilding team at all. They're the kind of guys who are pretty much always available if you need one. I'm not trading Hayes for that.

Well, you only look at Corsi and I gave 3 other categories, but whatever.

 

Pesce is one of the only player on the Canes who is on the + side of the ledger, and I know we all like to cling to Corsi and shit on +/-, but when one guy is +4 and another guy -8, that's a something to note. Slavin is also -13, make of that what you will.

 

Vlasic or Tanev might be a good comparable, but especially with Vlasic you're de-valuing him and over-valuing Hayes. Pesce is cost known and fills a need (stability on D). I don't think I really want to pay Hayes what he's going to get, and obviously the deal would probably not be 1:1, anyway.

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