Evaluating What We Have (Part 1): Vinni Lettieri

[jjweimar]

Thanx for the clarification. I guess most NHL forwards fit that category, no?

 

 

Go Rangers

No most nhl forwards do not fit that category. The majority are not high volume shooters at all.

 

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[LONG LONG LONG TIME FAN]

Then what is a low volume shooter?

[josh]

I could be mistaken but I believe a low volume shooter is an old, old wooden ship used during the civil war era.

[Sod16]

Obviously, there was little point in having him up and playing on the 4th line, as that is not a role that he can ever fill well. There will be roster spots to bring him back next week. Give him a shot on a scoring line and see what happens. My gut is that he's not going to make a big splash.

[Dunny]

I could be mistaken but I believe a low volume shooter is an old, old wooden ship used during the civil war era.

 

Civil war was mostly ironclads, reasonable facsimiles of iron clads, and even cotton clad steamers. They were low volume shooters, though.

 

Wood ships of the time were high volume shooters having as many as 100 guns vs. an Ironclads two or three or four.

 

Try again!

[Ozzy]

....Love this kid!!

 

High energy and lots of pucks shot to the net. Would be great with a Kreider or Nash who thrives in front of the net.

[Future]

Obviously, there was little point in having him up and playing on the 4th line, as that is not a role that he can ever fill well. There will be roster spots to bring him back next week. Give him a shot on a scoring line and see what happens. My gut is that he's not going to make a big splash.

Pretty much agree with this, it's impossible to know what he is right now because you can't be expected to produce as a rookie playing with McLeod and Holland.

 

His biggest thing is that he's going to have to learn to a) hit the net and b) shoot for rebounds. If he can do those things, he can be really effective.

[Ozzy]

All can be done with the right guy behind the bench.

[ThirtyONE]

Pretty much agree with this, it's impossible to know what he is right now because you can't be expected to produce as a rookie playing with McLeod and Holland.

 

His biggest thing is that he's going to have to learn to a) hit the net and b) shoot for rebounds. If he can do those things, he can be really effective.

 

I think these are two really important points. Yes, he fires the puck, and from what I saw one time in warmups, he has one of the fastest shots on the team, but he has got to learn to hit the net. Don't pick corners, just put it on goal and let the chaos ensue.

[Ozzy]

Future is right! Hit net and if you don't, get a rebound!!

 

The kid's fun to watch, and I don't know if it's just the steaming pile of shit that surrounds him, or he's just an exciting player at this point. But in this setting, he's like a breath of fresh air in a car full of guys that just came from White Castle!! LOL

[Gravesy]

I think these are two really important points. Yes, he fires the puck, and from what I saw one time in warmups, he has one of the fastest shots on the team, but he has got to learn to hit the net. Don't pick corners, just put it on goal and let the chaos ensue.

 

My worry with Lettieri is that he’s never really been a goal scorer at any level. Not in college, not in the AHL.

So whilst he’s a fun player to watch, moves cleverly in the attacking zone and has a lightning quick release I just can’t see him becoming more than a depth player, in and out of 3rd line duty. It’s obviously possible, but it’s quite rare to suddenly turn into a goal scorer at NHL level if you haven’t been one at junior/college/AHL level, quick release or not. Another thing I noticed looking at his career stats is that he’s carrying a brutal +/- stat that also dates back to college. It seems obvious to me that he’ll never be a viable 4th line option.

So in my view he’s got a lot of work to do on his game in both ends of the ice.

He’s the kind of player I really want to do well though, can’t really say why.

[Ozzy]

My worry with Lettieri is that he’s never really been a goal scorer at any level. Not in college, not in the AHL.

So whilst he’s a fun player to watch, moves cleverly in the attacking zone and has a lightning quick release I just can’t see him becoming more than a depth player, in and out of 3rd line duty. It’s obviously possible, but it’s quite rare to suddenly turn into a goal scorer at NHL level if you haven’t been one at junior/college/AHL level, quick release or not. Another thing I noticed looking at his career stats is that he’s carrying a brutal +/- stat that also dates back to college. It seems obvious to me that he’ll never be a viable 4th line option.

So in my view he’s got a lot of work to do on his game in both ends of the ice.

He’s the kind of player I really want to do well though, can’t really say why.

 

Short answer: Adam Graves...

 

Graves never scored more than 9 goals with the Red Wings/Oilers.....He came to the Rangers and in the right setting with the right leadership....he went nuts! The guy was a cornerstone of the team for a decade. Now I'm not saying Lettieri is Adam Graves, but we never know until we get to see what he can do in the right setting.

 

Hell, Gravy won the Selke 3 times, The Clancy, The Hart Trophy and The freakin' Masterton!! Dude was THE MAN!!!

 

I love this kid though! He's got balls...and that's a good start!

[Gravesy]

Short answer: Adam Graves...

 

Graves never scored more than 9 goals with the Red Wings/Oilers.....He came to the Rangers and in the right setting with the right leadership....he went nuts! The guy was a cornerstone of the team for a decade. Now I'm not saying Lettieri is Adam Graves, but we never know until we get to see what he can do in the right setting.

 

Hell, Gravy won the Selke 3 times, The Clancy, The Hart Trophy and The freakin' Masterton!! Dude was THE MAN!!!

 

I love this kid though! He's got balls...and that's a good start!

 

I think you'll find I agree on Graves considering my username. ;)

Like I said it's possible. But Graves had a few more strings to his bow, and to be fair he put up close to 2 points per game in 3 seasons for Windsor in the OHL, scoring 100 goals.

[Ozzy]

I think you'll find I agree on Graves considering my username. ;)

Like I said it's possible. But Graves had a few more strings to his bow, and to be fair he put up close to 2 points per game in 3 seasons for Windsor in the OHL, scoring 100 goals.

 

Yeah I caught that!! LOL

 

I have high hopes for the kid....call it a glimmer of hope in a shit house of horrors this year, Gravesy! I like his ability to play with a little "reckless abandon". He's a kid and he's gonna do kid things, but that's going to mature into something which I hope is going to be NHL worthy at a high level. His instincts seem to be correct though. I always love a shooter!

 

Now if he can only hit the net with it!!!

 

...but that's a story for another day!! LOL

[Long live the King]

My worry with Lettieri is that he’s never really been a goal scorer at any level. Not in college, not in the AHL.

So whilst he’s a fun player to watch, moves cleverly in the attacking zone and has a lightning quick release I just can’t see him becoming more than a depth player, in and out of 3rd line duty. It’s obviously possible, but it’s quite rare to suddenly turn into a goal scorer at NHL level if you haven’t been one at junior/college/AHL level, quick release or not. Another thing I noticed looking at his career stats is that he’s carrying a brutal +/- stat that also dates back to college. It seems obvious to me that he’ll never be a viable 4th line option.

So in my view he’s got a lot of work to do on his game in both ends of the ice.

He’s the kind of player I really want to do well though, can’t really say why.

 

You have to have looked at the stats for someone else? He scored 19 goals in 39 games as a senior in college, and left college a +17 over 4 years. He's on a 30 goal pace in the A this season and his -4 is nearly the best on the Pack for their regulars....

[Gravesy]

You have to have looked at the stats for someone else? He scored 19 goals in 39 games as a senior in college, and left college a +17 over 4 years. He's on a 30 goal pace in the A this season and his -4 is nearly the best on the Pack for their regulars....

 

No. 19 goals in 39 as a senior in college isn't exactly stellar.

Scoring less than 0.5 gpg as a 23 year old in the AHL is hardly indicative of someone that is going to come into the NHL and put up the numbers required to take up a roster place as a point scoring forward, which I think is the role we should be looking at with him. Like I said, it's possible and players develop at different intervals, but most of the guys that make the step up put up significantly better numbers in juniors/college/minors than what Lettieri has been able to do.

I've no idea what I did looking at the +/- stat, I got that wrong.

[Long live the King]

You said he's never really been a goal scorer at any level...

 

Through ~30 games this year there are 10 college players with 19 or more goals. All but 1 of them are juniors or seniors. And there are only about 10 guys in the entire AHL that score .5+ goals per game.

 

He's been 23 for less than 3 weeks. He's dining quite well for his first pro season as an undrafted player.

[Gravesy]

OK, maybe I'm not making myself clear.

What I said originally was that I don't think he has that many strings to his bow. He doesn't seem to have the game for anything other than being a point scoring forward at the highest level. I could obviously be wrong here, but that's what I'm currently seeing.

Now, I'm not saying his goal scoring stats at lower level is shit, but it's not good enough to make me confident he can make the step up to become a goal scorer at NHL level. When I say he hasn't been a goal scorer at any level I mean that he doesn't have the scoring record of someone you say "this guy is going to keep scoring in the National".

I mean he's currently scoring goals at the same rate as Peter Holland in the AHL, you're hardly looking at PH and saying he looks like a bonafide NHL goal scoring forward.

I dunno. Maybe I'm just talking shit.

[Future]

OK, maybe I'm not making myself clear.

What I said originally was that I don't think he has that many strings to his bow. He doesn't seem to have the game for anything other than being a point scoring forward at the highest level. I could obviously be wrong here, but that's what I'm currently seeing.

Now, I'm not saying his goal scoring stats at lower level is shit, but it's not good enough to make me confident he can make the step up to become a goal scorer at NHL level. When I say he hasn't been a goal scorer at any level I mean that he doesn't have the scoring record of someone you say "this guy is going to keep scoring in the National".

I mean he's currently scoring goals at the same rate as Peter Holland in the AHL, you're hardly looking at PH and saying he looks like a bonafide NHL goal scoring forward.

I dunno. Maybe I'm just talking shit.

I think this is pretty fair, though Lettieri's ceiling I think is higher than Holland's just on age alone.

[Dunny]

I think he's shown enough in the AHL to deserve a run in the NHL. He's going to get it, too, so it's up to him what he does with it. Thus far, he's done nothing with it.

[Long live the King]

I think this is pretty fair, though Lettieri's ceiling I think is higher than Holland's just on age alone.

 

Yea, Holland is a bad comparison. This is Holland's 7th year as a pro.

 

 

Side note, looking through the 2013 draft (when Lettieri was 18) there are a lot of late 1st round picks that have more years pro than Vinni, but are scoring goals at a similar rate. Those are kids that have been through multiple training camps and have had NHL teams developing them for 4+ years now. You'd think, despite is age, Lettieri has more room to grow as he gets that experience.

[Gravesy]

Possibly.

All I’m saying is that most guys who go on to be good enough for a place on the 2nd line for a team with ambition tend to put up better numbers than what Lettieri has done. Again, I don’t see VL having the overall game for a 3rd line player. Certainly not 4th line.

As for Holland, I’m not comparing them as players, but if you accept my argument on the type of player VL is, it’s a bit concerning that he’s not comfortably out scoring a player like him.

To be clear, I hope I’m wrong here.