Calling ALL Posters

[TwoMinutesForNothing]

I am actually falling into the group of those the come here to read. While I liked some of the threads and discussions we have all had, and there are many posters I do like having these political discussions with, there are posters who give an attitude towards you and when you say something to them, they get nasty right back again while claiming they arent. It gets tiring because you can't have a civil discussion sometimes, and I have even taken it to PM and nothing changes, so to me, the easiest thing to do is not become involved in the threads anymore. I like everyone here, don't get me wrong, but its become tiresome dealing with getting attacked in many different threads by someone. Ill still post, but I am not posting like I was anymore because I just don't want to deal with it anymore. We all have strong feelings towards certain things, and we all should, but when it gets condescending a lot of times, its not fun anymore. Thats just my piece, take it for what it is, and I love this forum because there are a lot of informative posters here about a team I and others love, and getting news here about the team is most of the time better than any or the media sites and clearer.

 

This post pretty much sums up my exact feelings.

[Mike]

Imo, the political threads are the kindling for disaster here. There's not enough posters here to overcome the amount of arguing and fighting that goes on in those threads. Unfortunately it all carries over into the 1 thing we're all passionate about .... Hockey. There's too much animosity in political and religious bullshit that it effects the way those people discuss hockey. It's almost like people go out of their way to disagree with something about the Minnesota Wild just because that person feels a certain way about Donald Trump.

[Future]

I also don't care if mine are used. As far as reporting "offensive posts" you'll never see me reporting someone because I just don't do that. Its the internet, its not that serious. If someone pisses me off, oh well. Words don't bother me, things don't really offend me..

This is why I was a terrible mod.

 

People would complain and I'd just respond with "deal with it" lol

[Vodka Drunkenski]

So now how do we overcome all of this and make this place fun again for everyone?

 

 

LGR

[Mike]

So now how do we overcome all of this and make this place fun again for everyone?

 

 

LGR

 

Eliminate the political threads and any news story that could lead into arguments about race, guns, religion, etc ... Imo, it'll prevent the fighting and also reduce the amount of bullshit mods have to go through for something they don't get paid for. Volunteer work should be fun, and my guess is that it can't possibly be fun for them having to deal with this. We've tried the "tread lightly" in thread topics and it's pretty clear that it doesn't work. I want to post here for hockey, and couldn't care less about anyone's political or religious views and beliefs. They're meaningless discussions where no one is ever going to change their stance, ever. No offense to anyone, but world leaders can't change a fuckin thing ... What makes you think 43 guys on a hockey forum could?

[Vodka Drunkenski]

I think I agree, keep this as a hockey/sports forum. But still keep open the bar room, entertainment portion of it. It allows us to get to know each other on a personal level. When you start talking politics and religion, it just opens a can of worms that seems to take a totally different level so some reason, it happens everywhere.

 

 

LGR

[Future]

Eliminate the political threads and any news story that could lead into arguments about race, guns, religion, etc ... Imo, it'll prevent the fighting and also reduce the amount of bullshit mods have to go through for something they don't get paid for. Volunteer work should be fun, and my guess is that it can't possibly be fun for them having to deal with this. We've tried the "tread lightly" in thread topics and it's pretty clear that it doesn't work. I want to post here for hockey, and couldn't care less about anyone's political or religious views and beliefs. They're meaningless discussions where no one is ever going to change their stance, ever. No offense to anyone, but world leaders can't change a fuckin thing ... What makes you think 43 guys on a hockey forum could?

I've seen this happen on another forum, and the bickering and bs was still exactly the same elsewhere.

 

I haven't been a member here that long so I guess I don't know what it used to be like, but I don't think the political thread is really an issue.

[Vodka Drunkenski]

More opinions welcomed. Maybe we can make a vote on certain ones. Idk, I'm just throwing ideas and seeing what sticks

 

 

LGR

[Mike]

I've seen this happen on another forum, and the bickering and bs was still exactly the same elsewhere.

 

I haven't been a member here that long so I guess I don't know what it used to be like, but I don't think the political thread is really an issue.

 

It is definitely an issue. It'll be a better place if we can bicker over hockey rather than the million other issues going on around the globe. The less conflicting threads that are opened, the less fighting. We're all passionate about the Rangers, and I'd rather argue with Dude about how McIlrath sucks than argue with Pete over Black Lives Matter. I'm not saying that those issues aren't important, what I'm saying is that they're not important HERE.

[fletch]

I agree that the focus should be on BSBH as a hockey forum.

 

I'd keep the bar room open because people like to voice their opinion on a variety of topics.

 

But when a particular thread in the bar room gets particularly heated or confrontational... I find another thread. Or go back to the hockey threads.

 

I like when there is an open exchange of ideas in the bar room, esp when it is someone that has a different opinion than I do. I don't like when it gets overly emotional. It is possible to be passionate or have a strong opinion without using inflammatory language. Pissing off people happens sometimes, but when you are doing it intentionally.... well, that's when the discipline squad gets involved.

[Guest]

I also don't care if mine are used. As far as reporting "offensive posts" you'll never see me reporting someone because I just don't do that. Its the internet, its not that serious. If someone pisses me off, oh well. Words don't bother me, things don't really offend me. Do I feel there is favoritism towards members? No, doesn't seem like it to me. Does it seem like some some members get away with more than others? In my opinion yes. That's the stuff that bothers me. My feelings on that topic are pretty well documented on here in that regard so its probably not worth getting into it again.

 

SaveByRichter, you say you're not reporting offensive posts because you just don't do that. Yet you have no problem derailing threads by complaining about posts you find offensive. That's the exact reason we have the report feature. So that a thread on a certain topic doesn't turn into a personal argument between two users. Since you OK'ed us sharing your discipline interactions, that leads us to this.

 

Here's your most recent infraction. It was for ignoring staff warning:

 

Original Post:

The only help we need in moderating the forums is for you to report a post that you feel violates a forum rule. Other than that, keep your posts about the topic at hand, not the users here.

 

This entire post after the edit is unacceptable. Consider this a warning.

 

Thanks,

 

Dave

Dave this isn't the first time and I am sure it won't be the last time. The amount of PMs and rep I got show I am not alone in my thinking. Maybe if the mods held him accountable like they do to everyone else then it wouldn't be a reoccurring problem.

 

To get this more out in the open, the mod you're talking about is Pete.

 

When you receive an in-thread warning about something from a Mod or Admin (in this case it came from me) that is not an invitation to continue commenting about the same topic in thread. It's a warning that if you continue, you'll receive an infraction. This is like if you got into a fight in a bar and the bouncer grabs you and is telling you to stop. You then take that opportunity to grab a bottle off the bar and throw it at the person you were fighting with. Or worse, at the bouncer. It's completely unacceptable. So this is cut and dry. If you want to continue the discussion privately with us, report the post and leave a message with it or PM one of us. You did PM me after I issued the above infraction.

 

Here is that PM:

 

Point still stands. If that punk was held to the same standards as everyone else none of this would have happened. This place is fucking ridiculous.

 

So you restate your point with even more hostility, calling Pete a punk and have to throw in the complaint about "this place" that the owner, Phil, pays for each month and the mods like myself not only post at but also spend extra time maintaining. Not the first time, certainly we've gotten insulted and won't be the last. But again, let me point out, report posts you think are over the line. Don't lash out in thread complaining about users or mods. And when you're warned for it, ignore the warning and then choose to PM us doubling down on your insults, I'm not sure what response you expect. I decided not to respond at all, rather than get in a shouting match with you.

 

Here's a post you received a warning for trolling for not long after:

 

Although I absolutely hate to agree with the almighty, it can be done. I still wear my old Bauer Reactor 5 shorts from the late 90s early 00s and they're much slimmer than today goal shorts. I like that they're less bulky than today's variants and its the one piece of gear I am not looking forward to having to replace. Luckily for me they're still in great shape for their age and not showing any signs of breaking down.

 

The post you were agreeing to was from Pete. So this is clearly you trolling him. If you out of the blue say, "I hate to agree with the almighty" when talking about another user, isn't it you that's instigating a situation? That's the common thread we often find when discipline becomes necessary. A debate goes on for a while, gets heated, then a user makes a personal comment against another. They get a warning or infraction, depending on their history and the severity of the situation. Then they complain that the other person started it or the other person did it too. Sometimes they're right and we warn/infract both parties. Sometimes they're wrong and only they get warned/infracted.

 

The infraction for ignoring staff warning came from the Kaepernick thread. It's still there, so I encourage anyone who thinks any mod broke a rule to go through that thread and find it for us so we can discuss it. I think what you will ultimately find is a heated debate where everyone involved up to the point of the in thread warning were heated, but completely on the topic of Kapernick refusing to stand for the pledge.

 

http://www.blueshirtsbrotherhood.com/showthread.php?18250-Colin-Kaepernick-Refusal-to-Stand-for-National-Anthem-Ignites-Controversy

 

Anyone is free to look through that thread and report any post by any mod or user they think was against forum rules and we will certainly discuss it. On the first infraction for you, here's the start of the interaction which led to me giving you an in-thread warning:

 

http://www.blueshirtsbrotherhood.com/showthread.php?18250-Colin-Kaepernick-Refusal-to-Stand-for-National-Anthem-Ignites-Controversy&p=856386&viewfull=1#post856386

 

You and Pete had been going back and forth when you dropped this:

 

Have you ever had to help fold a flag and hand it to the next of kin of a dead veteran? Because I have. That flag means a lot more to us than someone like you, obviously.

 

The "some one like you" part is meant to be dismissive. It could have probably earned a quick in thread warning. You're making this about Pete, the user, as well as what he's saying. It's a fine line we, as moderators probably need to clear up. Anyway, Pete responds:

 

No, but I've had a flag handed to me.

 

I have plenty of military in my family. They don't have a problem with "someone like me".

 

It's pretty clear that your shot at him, personally, was noticed. He quoted it. You could have choosen that moment to apologize for making it personal. At the very least, you could have moved on in a different direction. Instead you said:

 

If that's the case then your feeling about that flag is lost on me. Glad you're not a relative of mine.

 

You saying that you're glad he's not a relative of yours comes up to the line again. You're talking about a poster, even if it's somewhat connected to the topic at hand. So you didn't get any warning about this, but again, maybe you could have. Pete then responds with:

 

Same, bro. My family is a little more tolerant of different opinions and people's rights.

 

He's approaching that same line now after you've taken two shots at him. He's basically responding in kind to you. And it's still connected to the topic. So he did not get a warning about it either. Except from you.

 

Edit - If the roles were reversed you'd be crying about that post saying something along the lines of "wahh, you totally ignored the rest of my post where I gave my reasoning to disprove what you just wrote about me, wahh"

 

As usual, you get to do things and say things that others can't and not have to face any repercussions.

 

And that is when I came in with the in thread warning. So your claim that if the roles were reversed doesn't stand. The roles were just reversed. You both made very similar comments. They were both technically on topic, because the entire thread is about our personal feelings about the flag. Neither received moderation for that reason.

 

This is often the case we find when a post gets reported about a user or a mod. A heated discussion which doesn't violate any forum rules leaves one user feeling as if they were slighted. So they report it. We read and discuss the reported post and look at the context and then decide if there was a violation.

 

Getting back to Pete, because I think he's one of the mods that this discussion is mainly about. He's very opinionated. He, like many of us, has passionate discussions here. Those discussions get heated. But heated discussions are fine. It's only breaking forum rules that we moderate. So again, when ever anyone thinks any one else posts something that breaks a forum rule, we need that to get reported.

[Dunny]

I think I have one infraction since inception. I still manage to be a cunt most of the time, and my political views are polar opposite of 99% of the forum.

 

It's not that hard to avoid infraction. Take your warning and walk away for a bit.

[Guest]

I think I have one infraction since inception. I still manage to be a cunt most of the time, and my political views are polar opposite of 99% of the forum.

 

It's not that hard to avoid infraction. Take your warning and walk away for a bit.

 

I think you may be over estimating the number of infractions you've had in the last 5 years. I think that number is 0. Agree with the rest of your post.

[phillyb]

:deadhorse: :catfight:

[RichieNextel305]

Without mentioning any names I will support this, as I cannot stand to see posters tell you guys there's a real problem in this regard too and for it to be dismissed.

Your customers are speaking, mods. Listen to them.

Maybe we don't pay a subscription, but our time here is our most valuable currency.

Adios, and now I will shut up and get on with what I had hoped to do today.

 

Pretty much spot on.

[Guest]

Imo, the political threads are the kindling for disaster here. There's not enough posters here to overcome the amount of arguing and fighting that goes on in those threads. Unfortunately it all carries over into the 1 thing we're all passionate about .... Hockey. There's too much animosity in political and religious bullshit that it effects the way those people discuss hockey. It's almost like people go out of their way to disagree with something about the Minnesota Wild just because that person feels a certain way about Donald Trump.

 

There are a couple of issues with this.

 

You'll probably remember that this type of rule was in place prior to the creation of that area. What would happen was that people would post a news story and these types of threads would get created in The Bar Room. Then, we'd end up having to police whether a story was political in nature and if it was, did we need to lock the thread, delete the thread, delete certain posts. It was a head ache. Plus, we were actively policing opinions, not rule violations. That's why we created that forum. To put everything political into one area so if you weren't interested, you didn't have to engage in it.

 

Also, the political thread keeps the forum active in the off season and when there are long stretches in between games.

 

I've been on a few different political message boards and ours is far and away one of the most civil. Discussions get heated some times, no doubt, but no where close to the kind of nastiness that occurs elsewhere. Really, what we're talking about here are the equivalent of "micro aggressions".

[Guest]

I am actually falling into the group of those the come here to read. While I liked some of the threads and discussions we have all had, and there are many posters I do like having these political discussions with, there are posters who give an attitude towards you and when you say something to them, they get nasty right back again while claiming they arent. It gets tiring because you can't have a civil discussion sometimes, and I have even taken it to PM and nothing changes, so to me, the easiest thing to do is not become involved in the threads anymore. I like everyone here, don't get me wrong, but its become tiresome dealing with getting attacked in many different threads by someone. Ill still post, but I am not posting like I was anymore because I just don't want to deal with it anymore. We all have strong feelings towards certain things, and we all should, but when it gets condescending a lot of times, its not fun anymore. Thats just my piece, take it for what it is, and I love this forum because there are a lot of informative posters here about a team I and others love, and getting news here about the team is most of the time better than any or the media sites and clearer.

 

You, Keith and others are one of the reasons I think it's important to keep that area of the forum open. I've said it to you quite a few times, but I don't personally have any police officers in my real life circle. So for these types of discussions, I can't get your view point anywhere else. I don't always agree with that perspective, but it's vital for me to know and understand what it is and to be able to pose questions to someone in your position.

 

Look, I know that at times things get heated. All I can do is ask again, when you think something anyone posts is truly over the line, report it so we can deal with it. User or mod.

[Guest]

Here's something I'm going to toss around to the other mods but want to get some feed back on. As far as the issue with the Rangers portion of the forum sometimes being too intense to welcome more casual opinions, do you guys think having a sticky thread in the main forum similar to The Flying Puck in The Bar Room where people could kind of shoot the shit about the team in a much more casual way might help? So we'd still have the normal topic threads when they come up and those conversations would flow as they do, but we'd also have a more general thread that works more like the Game Day threads. You want to call Nash a bum? That's the thread for it. Want to mention how you think "AV should keep the Kreider - Zib - Buchnevich line together for a few months without tinkering" but don't feel like writing a paragraph on why? Put it in there.

 

You guys think that would help?

[Dunny]

Don't take the political/news stuff away, I'll go back to being a Liberal is that's what it takes.

[Future]

Here's something I'm going to toss around to the other mods but want to get some feed back on. As far as the issue with the Rangers portion of the forum sometimes being too intense to welcome more casual opinions, do you guys think having a sticky thread in the main forum similar to The Flying Puck in The Bar Room where people could kind of shoot the shit about the team in a much more casual way might help? So we'd still have the normal topic threads when they come up and those conversations would flow as they do, but we'd also have a more general thread that works more like the Game Day threads. You want to call Nash a bum? That's the thread for it. Want to mention how you think "AV should keep the Kreider - Zib - Buchnevich line together for a few months without tinkering" but don't feel like writing a paragraph on why? Put it in there.

 

You guys think that would help?

In my opinion, the GDTs are sufficient for that.

[Mike]

There are a couple of issues with this.

 

You'll probably remember that this type of rule was in place prior to the creation of that area. What would happen was that people would post a news story and these types of threads would get created in The Bar Room. Then, we'd end up having to police whether a story was political in nature and if it was, did we need to lock the thread, delete the thread, delete certain posts. It was a head ache. Plus, we were actively policing opinions, not rule violations. That's why we created that forum. To put everything political into one area so if you weren't interested, you didn't have to engage in it.

 

Also, the political thread keeps the forum active in the off season and when there are long stretches in between games.

 

I've been on a few different political message boards and ours is far and away one of the most civil. Discussions get heated some times, no doubt, but no where close to the kind of nastiness that occurs elsewhere. Really, what we're talking about here are the equivalent of "micro aggressions".

 

There are 4 threads stickied :

1. Political

2. Religion

3. Gun control

4. An in depth thread on why everyone is being an asshole while discussing 1, 2, and 3. If you need to sticky that type of thread about certain discussions than maybe those discussions aren't worth having. You guys have to moderate it, so go nuts ... I'm just sayin

[Mike]

Here's something I'm going to toss around to the other mods but want to get some feed back on. As far as the issue with the Rangers portion of the forum sometimes being too intense to welcome more casual opinions, do you guys think having a sticky thread in the main forum similar to The Flying Puck in The Bar Room where people could kind of shoot the shit about the team in a much more casual way might help? So we'd still have the normal topic threads when they come up and those conversations would flow as they do, but we'd also have a more general thread that works more like the Game Day threads. You want to call Nash a bum? That's the thread for it. Want to mention how you think "AV should keep the Kreider - Zib - Buchnevich line together for a few months without tinkering" but don't feel like writing a paragraph on why? Put it in there.

 

You guys think that would help?

 

That would reduce the amount of threads started, and probably reduce at least 1 fight in every one of those said threads. But again, the Ranger threads are the least of the problems here. You're replacing McIlrath while Girardi is still in the top 4.

[Guest]

That would reduce the amount of threads started, and probably reduce at least 1 fight in every one of those said threads. But again, the Ranger threads are the least of the problems here. You're replacing McIlrath while Girardi is still in the top 4.

 

I get that, but there are two different issues being discussed in this thread. One is whether moderators are treated differently than users. The other is that the Rangers area of the forum is dominated by a culture where you have to be a hockey scholar in order to engage in any sort of discussion. This idea is towards that second issue, not the first.

[Mike]

I get that, but there are two different issues being discussed in this thread. One is whether moderators are treated differently than users. The other is that the Rangers area of the forum is dominated by a culture where you have to be a hockey scholar in order to engage in any sort of discussion. This idea is towards that second issue, not the first.

 

Pete's a good friend to me, so I'll call it out here ... It's not the thought/feeling of how mods are treated differently than users, it's the thought/feeling that Pete (who is a mod) is treated differently. I'm the closest person here to everyone without being a mod, and I just proved that that's not actually the case. Whether or not you make me a mod or remove Pete from being a mod is irrelevant because perception is reality. What I'm trying to say is, I wouldn't have posted differently if I was a mod, and would have deserved every warning, infraction, and ban that I received. At the same time I'm sure Pete won't change the way he posts either, and even if he's removed as a mod everyone will still say "same shit, he was a mod all this time, same friends, same treatment".

 

As far as having to feel like a scholar to post in threads goes, I do understand how some can feel intimidated at times. There's a decent list of guys here that are very well educated in the game and can point things out that others don't see or don't know. I think people need to be more receptive to the more educated posters rather than combatant with them. There's no shame in asking questions either in the thread or pm. I've gotten plenty of pm's regarding the game from youth hockey on up to the NHL. Do I know everything that goes on at every level or behind the scenes? Of course not, but I do have knowledge and information about a lot of things. Me getting criticized or questioned after plenty of people know me well enough that I'm not trolling, guessing, or making things up does in fact bother me sometimes and makes me not want to share information, which imo is top notch and I think you along with others would agree. I can list at least 5 people on here that have equal, or even better info/insides and I respect and believe everything they share and post here.

[NYR2711]

You, Keith and others are one of the reasons I think it's important to keep that area of the forum open. I've said it to you quite a few times, but I don't personally have any police officers in my real life circle. So for these types of discussions, I can't get your view point anywhere else. I don't always agree with that perspective, but it's vital for me to know and understand what it is and to be able to pose questions to someone in your position.

 

Look, I know that at times things get heated. All I can do is ask again, when you think something anyone posts is truly over the line, report it so we can deal with it. User or mod.

 

I have no problems discussing things in a civil matter, but when it gets nasty, and you tell that person they are getting nasty, they tell you you are wrong and continue being nasty. Its happened way too any times. Its easier to refrain than to join in now. I don't care if someone has a totally different opinion than I do, its what makes for good discussions, I just don't like when someone gets nasty about it and has to tell you your wrong or you don't know what your talking about or your changing what your saying to fit their argument.

 

I really enjoy talking with you in these threads because you are open minded and we can discuss calmly and civilly about many different topics, but its the other times where its even extended outside of the political forum, where I have had enough and am at the point where Ill join in here and there, but I am stepping back, especially in the political area.