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Thread: Tom Wilson Fined $5K for Roughing Buchnevich; Rangers Release Statement

  1. #161
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil in Absentia View Post
    Great — that's not happening, becuase the NHL's discipline is toothless. So, again, what's your solution?
    Murder.




    And fix the NHL Dept of Player Safety.

  2. #162
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morphinity View Post
    Murder.

    And fix the NHL Dept of Player Safety.
    We want the same thing, then. Laf will be fine.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Capt View Post
    Full stop? The NHL just told you what to think of your statement here. Nobody is taking blame away from Wilson. In fact I'm saying because of Wilson, Backstrom needs to watch his ass. To hope Wilson stops because that makes sense to you is fantasyland shit. Wilson could give a shit what the Rangers think let alone you. He is getting paid to do exactly what he did last night. Make a difference in a hockey game. And boy did he. The Flyers won 2 cups employing this strategy you insist has never belonged in hockey.
    1. I do not care what NHL DoPS thinks. They've got no track record to "tell me what to think", so let's push that aside.
    2. It is INHERENTLY taking blame from Wilson to act like the Rangers are in some way at fault for what goes well beyond the confines of "tough, physical hockey"
    3. Don't disrespect the 70s Flyers by comparing tough, rugged hockey to what Tom Wilson has been doing in the NHL for years. There's a difference between being tough and being a thug, and I'm not sure how many times that needs to be said before you get it.

    Has it ever occurred to you Wilson did not lose control of what he was doing? That what he did last night IS normal behavior for him.? Has it occurred to you that his team wants him to play like that? Did you see their twitter comment? Is it possible that Wilson saw a chance at a free shot at Panarin and took it? In the end what's the result? A $5K fine, Panarin's ego hurt and actually hurt, the Rangers looking defenseless and whinny bitches?
    Again, you cannot blame the Rangers for Tom Wilson doing what he did. It's thuggery. It's not hockey.

    Further, if that's who he is and the Caps sanction that? That's actually worse - this shit has no business in the game. A DoPS with half a spine would put an end to that, because that's actually worse.

    You can be mad at me and whomever here for explaining reality to you. Nobody is discounting Wilson's blame here. To act like this doesn't happen in hockey is either complete ignorance or wishful thinking. To excuse the Rangers for being caught with their pants down here is absolving blame where it is due. Last night was one thing but now they don't even have an answer 48 hours later. It's a joke.
    Yeah, we are. Parse the difference between being tough and being a thug well enough to have this conversation. Reality - what Wilson did to Buchnevich alone has been a 10+ game suspension in the past. Reality - what he did to Panarin isn't a hockey acceptable play in any era.

    Bringing up rape victims here to argue a hockey point is pathetic and sad. Saying what I'm arguing is equal to saying a rape victim should dress less slutty is completely irresponsible of you. I would report your post but I'd be reporting it to you. Grow the fuck up.
    No, it's not. It's a basic analogy, and I'd appreciate if you had this conversation without being some kind of fake self-righteous martyr. Defend it without pretending to clutch your pearls.

    You don't blame the victim of a crime when there's a criminal - that's bullshit. The Rangers lacking physicality has no bearing on whether Wilson literally goes outside the realm of standard hockey scrumming toward intending to injure or cause direct physical harm. Surely, we can agree that pinning someone to the ice with your stick on their neck and punching their head into the ice is not a hockey play. Surely we can agree that grabbing a guy by the hair and slamming him into the ice is not a hockey play. If you want to lament the Rangers being beaten in board battles, unable to create space, can't throw a hit - fine. Acting like Tom Wilson's behavior was inevitable because the Rangers lack toughness is no different than blaming the victim of a crime for being in the wrong place at the wrong time looking the wrong way.
    Last edited by G1000; 05-04-2021 at 09:55 PM.

  4. #164
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    Quote Originally Posted by G1000 View Post
    1. I do not care what NHL DoPS thinks. They've got no track record to "tell me what to think", so let's push that aside.
    2. It is INHERENTLY taking blame from Wilson to act like the Rangers are in some way at fault for what goes well beyond the confines of "tough, physical hockey"
    3. Don't disrespect the 70s Flyers by comparing tough, rugged hockey to what Tom Wilson has been doing in the NHL for years. There's a difference between being tough and being a thug, and I'm not sure how many times that needs to be said before you get it.



    Again, you cannot blame the Rangers for Tom Wilson doing what he did. It's thuggery. It's not hockey.

    Further, if that's who he is and the Caps sanction that? That's actually worse - this shit has no business in the game. A DoPS with half a spine would put an end to that, because that's actually worse.



    Yeah, we are. Parse the difference between being tough and being a thug well enough to have this conversation. Reality - what Wilson did to Buchnevich alone has been a 10+ game suspension in the past. Reality - what he did to Panarin isn't a hockey acceptable play in any era.



    No, it's not. It's a basic analogy, and I'd appreciate if you had this conversation without being some kind of fake self-righteous martyr. Defend it without pretending to clutch your pearls.

    You don't blame the victim of a crime when there's a criminal - that's bullshit. The Rangers lacking physicality has no bearing on whether Wilson literally goes outside the realm of standard hockey scrumming toward intending to injure or cause direct physical harm. Surely, we can agree that pinning someone to the ice with your stick on their neck and punching their head into the ice is not a hockey play. Surely we can agree that grabbing a guy by the hair and slamming him into the ice is not a hockey play. If you want to lament the Rangers being beaten in board battles, unable to create space, can't throw a hit - fine. Acting like Tom Wilson's behavior was inevitable because the Rangers lack toughness is no different than blaming the victim of a crime for being in the wrong place at the wrong time looking the wrong way.
    Yea, I mean you're wrong so often it's hard to say I agree here...

    But the bottom line is anyone defending Wilson under the guise of "old time hockey" never watched old time hockey...Probert would not act that way... Rarely fucked with a skill players or star.

    Twitter is a cesspool but even they realize saying this is a Rangers roster problem and not a Tom Wilson problem is asinine.

  5. #165
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
    Yea, I mean you're wrong so often it's hard to say I agree here...

    But the bottom line is anyone defending Wilson under the guise of "old time hockey" never watched old time hockey...Probert would not act that way... Rarely fucked with a skill players or star.

    Twitter is a cesspool but even they realize saying this is a Rangers roster problem and not a Tom Wilson problem is asinine.
    I'm watching Rangers fans, Devils fans, Islanders fans, Flyers fans, and Penguins fans agree on this on every platform. It's enough already - what Wilson is doing is not "old time hockey", it was never acceptable, and we should have this reaction whether this is Artemi Panarin or Sidney Crosby or Jacob MacDonald on the receiving end of it.

  6. #166
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    Quote Originally Posted by Karan View Post
    Strong words by the Rangers.

    Good. I'm glad they are pushing back.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Dude View Post
    Good. I'm glad they are pushing back.
    Honestly I'm not really happy with this statement or any statement they could have made. It shows weakness and signals to me that the Rangers aren't prepared to get even tomorrow night, or maybe even to change their roster to be better equipped to handle these things. Don't get me wrong, Wilson absolutely should have gotten suspended, I just don't like this social media crying to the NHL approach. Respond on the ice, not twitter.

  8. #168
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morphinity View Post
    Do none of you realize Wilson does not give a fuck who is on the team he is committing his offenses against?

    May 28, 2018 - Wilson blindsides Marchessault - Ryan Reaves is on the bench and he does nothing


    September 30, 2018 - Wilson headshots Sundqvist - Chris Thorburn is on the bench and he does nothing


    March 5, 2021 - Wilson headshots Carlo - Trent Frederic is on the bench and fights him later in the game


    The common thread: Wilson does what he wants, when he wants. He doesn't care who is in the lineup or on the ice. He will fight anyone thrown his way and pay whatever price he has to. He will continue cheapshotting and head shotting. The NHL discipline doesn't seem to work. The "in game policing" doesn't seem to work.
    Reeves went after Wilson later. I believe he gave him a concussion...

  9. #169
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tonybologna View Post
    Honestly I'm not really happy with this statement or any statement they could have made. It shows weakness and signals to me that the Rangers aren't prepared to get even tomorrow night, or maybe even to change their roster to be better equipped to handle these things. Don't get me wrong, Wilson absolutely should have gotten suspended, I just don't like this social media crying to the NHL approach. Respond on the ice, not twitter.
    While I don't really see it in this team to respond in turn on the ice, in theory you can do both.

  10. #170
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Dude View Post
    Reeves went after Wilson later. I believe he gave him a concussion...
    Not in that game, but in the next season. Reaves threw a dirty hit and got a game misconduct for it. Concussed Wilson.

    Still didn't end his antics.

  11. #171
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    Quote Originally Posted by G1000 View Post
    1. I do not care what NHL DoPS thinks. They've got no track record to "tell me what to think", so let's push that aside.
    2. It is INHERENTLY taking blame from Wilson to act like the Rangers are in some way at fault for what goes well beyond the confines of "tough, physical hockey"
    3. Don't disrespect the 70s Flyers by comparing tough, rugged hockey to what Tom Wilson has been doing in the NHL for years. There's a difference between being tough and being a thug, and I'm not sure how many times that needs to be said before you get it.



    Again, you cannot blame the Rangers for Tom Wilson doing what he did. It's thuggery. It's not hockey.

    Further, if that's who he is and the Caps sanction that? That's actually worse - this shit has no business in the game. A DoPS with half a spine would put an end to that, because that's actually worse.



    Yeah, we are. Parse the difference between being tough and being a thug well enough to have this conversation. Reality - what Wilson did to Buchnevich alone has been a 10+ game suspension in the past. Reality - what he did to Panarin isn't a hockey acceptable play in any era.



    No, it's not. It's a basic analogy, and I'd appreciate if you had this conversation without being some kind of fake self-righteous martyr. Defend it without pretending to clutch your pearls.

    You don't blame the victim of a crime when there's a criminal - that's bullshit. The Rangers lacking physicality has no bearing on whether Wilson literally goes outside the realm of standard hockey scrumming toward intending to injure or cause direct physical harm. Surely, we can agree that pinning someone to the ice with your stick on their neck and punching their head into the ice is not a hockey play. Surely we can agree that grabbing a guy by the hair and slamming him into the ice is not a hockey play. If you want to lament the Rangers being beaten in board battles, unable to create space, can't throw a hit - fine. Acting like Tom Wilson's behavior was inevitable because the Rangers lack toughness is no different than blaming the victim of a crime for being in the wrong place at the wrong time looking the wrong way.
    I never took blame away from Tom Wilson. Stop making shit up about me, I have zero interest in being your strawman.

    You may not care what DOPS thinks but they are the judge and jury here so obviously their opinion carries weight in reality.

    I thought Wilson should have been suspended indefinately. The NHL made a statement loud and clear that the Rangers are on their own here.

    Tom Wilson is exactly that player. He's been suspended 30 games in his young career and has shown little remorse even yukking it up last night. The Caps have rewarded him with a letter and the tweet last night applauded his violence and made fun of the Rangers whining about it.

    I disagree the Buch aspect on its own doesn't deserve a suspension. The Panarin thing could have been really bad, like murder. The lack of awareness here by the NHL is crazy. They narrowly dodged the biggest sport's story and tragedy in sometime last night. All because a player was out of control and dangerous. Tom Wilson has no place in this league. That's my opinion but here we are.

    Stop with the rape shit. How do you double down on this garbage. I do take offense to have a keyboard hero equate my feelings to blaming a rape victim for "dressing to slutty". Have some decency. I'm not some self righteous martyr for taking offense for someone equating my argument as a rape victim shammer. Yeah I do take offense. You would seriously say that to someone's face and not expect a fist in yours? You nonchalantly throw out these offensive analogies then question my righteousness? As if I'm the one going to these extremes and trying to offend. You're a moderator here for christ sake. You constantly engage in this garbage and then blame me for defending my opinion and your unfair and dishonest assessment of it. I would never victim shame a rape victim and I'm not absolving Tom Wilson. Far from it.

    Maybe I need to put it into an analogy of my own so you can understand. Tom Wilson is the criminal. The New York Rangers is the defunded police and the DOPS is the courts. The criminal does what he does. The court never holds him accountable and releases him without bail. The police (Rangers) are completely defunded and have no way of getting through to the criminal. Get it?

  12. #172
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
    Yea, I mean you're wrong so often it's hard to say I agree here...

    But the bottom line is anyone defending Wilson under the guise of "old time hockey" never watched old time hockey...Probert would not act that way... Rarely fucked with a skill players or star.

    Twitter is a cesspool but even they realize saying this is a Rangers roster problem and not a Tom Wilson problem is asinine.
    Probert would never act that way because the opponent always had a missle pointed at Yzerman if he did. Probert was never afraid of retribution against him because he didn't fear anyone. He feared retribution against Yzerman. That's the point. That's the code. The Rangers don't need someone to beat up Wilson. They need someone who's willing to go rag doll Backstrom.

    Blaming Wilson is obvious but also pointless to discuss. The league said it was a hockey play and that the Rangers need to deal with it themselves.

  13. #173
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    John Scott shocked Wilson wasn't suspended 40 games. John Scott joins Ken Reid on Sportsnet Central to discuss the Tom Wilson situation and how he can't believe Wilson wasn't suspended as a repeat offender.
    https://www.sportsnet.ca/nhl/video/j...nded-40-games/

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    He ain't wrong

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    Quote Originally Posted by G1000 View Post
    3. Don't disrespect the 70s Flyers by comparing tough, rugged hockey to what Tom Wilson has been doing in the NHL for years.
    The Flyers (Schultz 479 penalty minutes) were not simply tough rugged hockey. They ushered in a new level of goonery that took the league about 25 years to ween itself from.

    What do you do when there is only one true goon left in the league, and the league does nothing about him? Do you waste roster spots on Oggie Ogglethorpes to combat one player several time a year?

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    Quote Originally Posted by G1000 View Post
    Not in that game, but in the next season. Reaves threw a dirty hit and got a game misconduct for it. Concussed Wilson.

    Still didn't end his antics.
    I’d be curious if he’s fucked around against the VGK since then though.

  17. #177
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    Quote Originally Posted by Capt View Post
    Probert would never act that way because the opponent always had a missle pointed at Yzerman if he did. Probert was never afraid of retribution against him because he didn't fear anyone. He feared retribution against Yzerman. That's the point. That's the code. The Rangers don't need someone to beat up Wilson. They need someone who's willing to go rag doll Backstrom.

    Blaming Wilson is obvious but also pointless to discuss. The league said it was a hockey play and that the Rangers need to deal with it themselves.
    That's not the case at all. Probert in his heydey was Wilson. No one wanted to go with him. That's the point. And he certainly didn't fight skill players coming out of a scrum.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Morphinity View Post
    Do none of you realize Wilson does not give a fuck who is on the team he is committing his offenses against?

    The common thread: Wilson does what he wants, when he wants. He doesn't care who is in the lineup or on the ice. He will fight anyone thrown his way and pay whatever price he has to. He will continue cheapshotting and head shotting. The NHL discipline doesn't seem to work. The "in game policing" doesn't seem to work.
    Yeah. I think the idea that the Rangers need players who act as "deterrent" is wide of the mark. There really isn't such a thing in the NHL anymore.
    What they do need are players that can walk the walk when the game gets physical. It's back to the discussion about addressing the homogeneity in the roster construction and mixing up skill guys with players who can play a heavy game. Not trying to find a hulking bruiser who's going to crack Wilsons skull if he steps out of line.

  19. #179
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    Quote Originally Posted by Capt View Post
    I never took blame away from Tom Wilson. Stop making shit up about me, I have zero interest in being your strawman.
    When you blame the Rangers for "not being tough enough", you're taking blame from Wilson. There's not really another way to read that aside from "If the Rangers were different, Wilson would behave himself", which is patently untrue.

    You may not care what DOPS thinks but they are the judge and jury here so obviously their opinion carries weight in reality.

    I thought Wilson should have been suspended indefinately. The NHL made a statement loud and clear that the Rangers are on their own here.

    Tom Wilson is exactly that player. He's been suspended 30 games in his young career and has shown little remorse even yukking it up last night. The Caps have rewarded him with a letter and the tweet last night applauded his violence and made fun of the Rangers whining about it.
    Yes - and we can either agree that this is unacceptable and shouldn't be tolerated, or kowtow to DOPS and pretend like they've got some higher moral authority here that they clearly do not. I'm not interested in the latter, and I'm not particularly sure why you're tripling down on arguing with the former.

    I disagree the Buch aspect on its own doesn't deserve a suspension. The Panarin thing could have been really bad, like murder. The lack of awareness here by the NHL is crazy. They narrowly dodged the biggest sport's story and tragedy in sometime last night. All because a player was out of control and dangerous. Tom Wilson has no place in this league. That's my opinion but here we are.
    If DOPS is the "judge and jury" and we're supposed to put any stock in them, then they need to be consistent. There's actual precedent for "punching a face down player into the ice" - Shawn Thornton was suspended for 15 games for doing exactly that in 2013. Wilson got $5k. You can disagree all you want with whether or not it deserved a suspension, but holding the opinion that DOPS is the judge and jury and also holding the opinion that they shouldn't suspend for an action they've handed down rather harsh sentences for in the past is inconsistent.

    Stop with the rape shit. How do you double down on this garbage. I do take offense to have a keyboard hero equate my feelings to blaming a rape victim for "dressing to slutty". Have some decency. I'm not some self righteous martyr for taking offense for someone equating my argument as a rape victim shammer. Yeah I do take offense. You would seriously say that to someone's face and not expect a fist in yours? You nonchalantly throw out these offensive analogies then question my righteousness? As if I'm the one going to these extremes and trying to offend. You're a moderator here for christ sake. You constantly engage in this garbage and then blame me for defending my opinion and your unfair and dishonest assessment of it. I would never victim shame a rape victim and I'm not absolving Tom Wilson. Far from it.
    I'm not wasting my time with your faux-outrage. It's a basic series of analogies that's commonly understood to mean "you don't blame the victim for the acts of a criminal". You're not being shamed or anything - you're making a choice to purposefully misinterpret an analogy with clear intent and commonly understood meaning for the sole purpose of positing yourself as holier-than-thou - or more accurately, to disparage me without cause. You just compared Tom Wilson's actions to attempted murder. Don't act like you don't get it.

    Maybe I need to put it into an analogy of my own so you can understand. Tom Wilson is the criminal. The New York Rangers is the defunded police and the DOPS is the courts. The criminal does what he does. The court never holds him accountable and releases him without bail. The police (Rangers) are completely defunded and have no way of getting through to the criminal. Get it?
    Let me fix that for you. Tom Wilson is the criminal. The Rangers are the VICTIM. The referees are the defunded police. DOPS is the jury - and the jury is crooked.
    Last edited by G1000; 05-05-2021 at 06:50 AM.

  20. #180
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sod16 View Post
    The Flyers (Schultz 479 penalty minutes) were not simply tough rugged hockey. They ushered in a new level of goonery that took the league about 25 years to ween itself from.

    What do you do when there is only one true goon left in the league, and the league does nothing about him? Do you waste roster spots on Oggie Ogglethorpes to combat one player several time a year?
    Gotta endorse here. Schultz, Kelly, Moose Dupont, Don Saleski, et al elevated goonery to a strategic discipline. They weren't some band of tough-but-noble players who just did what they had to in along the road to higher hockey achievement. Fred Shero turned pure, uncut intimidation into points in the standings and playoff series wins.

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