2021 Offseason Thread: Fuck Around & Find Out!

Sure does. The team needs more Kreider's note fewer of them. The Anderson ship sailed when he was traded to and signed long-term with Montreal. I'm not pining to acquire him. I'm saying that Brooks was right to beat the drum for him, because players like him (and Kreider) are what often put teams over the top in the postseason.

I don't think he was. There's not enough cap for the contract Anderson got in addition to Kreider's. It was the right mindset by Brooks, but still the wrong player and, really, the wrong position.

I don't think he was. There's not enough cap for the contract Anderson got in addition to Kreider's. It was the right mindset by Brooks, but still the wrong player and, really, the wrong position.

The more you look at it - the players we're talking about don't really exist as centers anymore. Not elite ones anyway. They're wings.

Here and there? Sure - they pop up. Ryan Oreilly exists - but they're a dying breed. We're literally looking for a unicorn if we're trying to find these big ass two way scoring centers at this point.

The more you look at it - the players we're talking about don't really exist as centers anymore. Not elite ones anyway. They're wings.

 

Here and there? Sure - they pop up. Ryan Oreilly exists - but they're a dying breed. We're literally looking for a unicorn if we're trying to find these big ass two way scoring centers at this point.

If they make the concession on position, there's going to be a real pisser of a trade or two coming up. Buch for a 40 pt wing, or possibly Kakko/Kravtsov involved. It's gonna be super ugly on paper. In Drury we trust?

The more you look at it - the players we're talking about don't really exist as centers anymore. Not elite ones anyway. They're wings.

 

Here and there? Sure - they pop up. Ryan Oreilly exists - but they're a dying breed. We're literally looking for a unicorn if we're trying to find these big ass two way scoring centers at this point.

Sean Couturier, UFA next summer. This is the answer. Forget Eichel.

Sean Couturier, UFA next summer. This is the answer. Forget Eichel.

Yeah. I would love to get him. Exactly what we need.

On Anderson, I’m not going to pretend to have watched him a ton, but from what I’ve seen he plays A LOT bigger than Kreider and does it pretty consistently. I think he’d be a really good addition too, cap space permitting.

The more you look at it - the players we're talking about don't really exist as centers anymore. Not elite ones anyway. They're wings.

 

Here and there? Sure - they pop up. Ryan Oreilly exists - but they're a dying breed. We're literally looking for a unicorn if we're trying to find these big ass two way scoring centers at this point.

It's sad, I want to see what Howden can do with a new coach. Their draft profiles are almost identical. Only slightly smaller than Getzlaf, both pegged as leaders (Howden wore the C for 2 years, Getzlaf 1 A), hard to play against, good play makers w/ good vision, guys that would score in and around the net, not the best skaters, two-way players, hard to play against...

Sean Couturier, UFA next summer. This is the answer. Forget Eichel.

only because I'm on the page...

https://lastwordonsports.com/2016/04/22/brett-howden-scouting-report-2016-nhl-draft-24/

In terms of a comparable, Howden is a lot like Sean Couturier of the Flyers.

It's sad, I want to see what Howden can do with a new coach. Their draft profiles are almost identical. Only slightly smaller than Getzlaf, both pegged as leaders (Howden wore the C for 2 years, Getzlaf 1 A), hard to play against, good play makers w/ good vision, guys that would score in and around the net, not the best skaters, two-way players, hard to play against...

I hope you are not still hoping for the girl you had a crush on in 7th grade to come around.

who, my side piece?

No, she knows her place. But she's not entering her prime, either.

Rangers presser to formally introduce Gallant today at 10am. Don’t think it’s televised but we should get some news today .

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It's sad, I want to see what Howden can do with a new coach. Their draft profiles are almost identical. Only slightly smaller than Getzlaf, both pegged as leaders (Howden wore the C for 2 years, Getzlaf 1 A), hard to play against, good play makers w/ good vision, guys that would score in and around the net, not the best skaters, two-way players, hard to play against...

Howden even remotely living up to his promise at this point would be a massive benefit. Becoming a 25 point two way center that's just a pain to play against would feel like the hockey version of the Battle of Thermopylae.

Howden even remotely living up to his promise at this point would be a massive benefit. Becoming a 25 point two way center that's just a pain to play against would feel like the hockey version of the Battle of Thermopylae.

He out up 23 in 66 games his rookie season.

I think getting rid of the sprint everywhere requirement and the make mistakes faster mentality will allow these big bodies to get in the right places on the ice - not sprint toward the puck but being big in the neutral zone, getting in skating and passing lanes, being able to lean/push a guy throughout an entire contest.

Last season, guys were sprinting out of position to go after the puck. Instead, they can stay with an opponent, and now that opponent has to fight through/with them for open space for a pass or shooting lane, rather than the Rangers granting them the free space (because they all sprinted elsewhere)

He out up 23 in 66 games his rookie season.

 

I think getting rid of the sprint everywhere requirement and the make mistakes faster mentality will allow these big bodies to get in the right places on the ice - not sprint toward the puck but being big in the neutral zone, getting in skating and passing lanes, being able to lean/push a guy throughout an entire contest.

 

Last season, guys were sprinting out of position to go after the puck. Instead, they can stay with an opponent, and now that opponent has to fight through/with them for open space for a pass or shooting lane, rather than the Rangers granting them the free space (because they all sprinted elsewhere)

I think Gallant just basically saying "dude, you're our 4c. This is your job and you're going to do it well" might make a world of difference here. Howden's 3 years under Quinn had him as something like the worst regular NHL forward and I just refuse to believe that someone drafted that high and with his size will continue to be this bad when there's some positional responsibility and structure.

If he ends up being a mini Brian Boyle, that's fine.

Nah, he had 25 points in 50 games. Buch had 48 in 54. Literally doubled his output.

Plus, I doubt the Rangers are gonna be in the business of moving a guy for futures. They're going to want to make hockey deals -- probably large ones if https://nypost.com/2021/06/30/rangers-will-have-to-lose-players-to-make-offseason-noise/ is accurate.

Drury needs to be in the import and export business, just like Art Vandelay. The GM won’t be able to add players without subtracting. And that is why two-for-one’s or three-for-one’s makes sense for the Rangers. Because they cannot address their deficiencies without moving out incumbents.

Nah, he had 25 points in 50 games. Buch had 48 in 54. Literally doubled his output.

 

Plus, I doubt the Rangers are gonna be in the business of moving a guy for futures. They're going to want to make hockey deals -- probably large ones if https://nypost.com/2021/06/30/rangers-will-have-to-lose-players-to-make-offseason-noise/ is accurate.

Why not? If they want to sign a 3RW and play Kakko/Kravtsov in the top 6, Buchnevich needs to be out for non-roster pieces.

Why not? If they want to sign a 3RW and play Kakko/Kravtsov in the top 6, Buchnevich needs to be out for non-roster pieces.

Yeah, if the Rangers need to make room, and there's no play for a 2 (Rangers) for 1 (Tkchuck) type of deal, I see no problem continuing to trade for and make picks. That's how dynasties are made. Flip Buch for a 1st and that's really good asset management - especially if you think Krav and Kakko are your top 6 wingers. (I don't necessarily think Krav and Kakko are there yet, but maybe the Rangers feel differently).

All I know is Buch is gonna get paid, and I'm not absolutely sold on him or his next deal.

Why not? If they want to sign a 3RW and play Kakko/Kravtsov in the top 6, Buchnevich needs to be out for non-roster pieces.

I mean, I guess if they just plan to sign someone, sure, but my guess is their first and second approach is going to be trying to strike a deal here. I mean, have you seen the list of free agent right-wings list this summer? Who are you getting that's justifiably "better" than Buchnevich? The only guy who maybe qualifies is Brandon Saad. From there, it's a sheer drop to Palmieri and a bunch of scrubs.

I mean, I guess if they just plan to sign someone, sure, but my guess is their first and second approach is going to be trying to strike a deal here. I mean, have you seen the list of free agent right-wings list this summer? Who are you getting that's justifiably "better" than Buchnevich? The only guy who maybe qualifies is Brandon Saad. From there, it's a sheer drop to Palmieri and a bunch of scrubs.

Nobody, but the argument I've seen around here is we can't keep Buchnevich because it blocks Kakko and Kravtsov. So the idea isn't to replace him. It's to promote the other two and backfill the bottom 6. I don't agree with that plan, which I've mentioned a bunch in the past, but it is still a valid pathway to take the franchise.

Yeah, if the Rangers need to make room, and there's no play for a 2 (Rangers) for 1 (Tkchuck) type of deal, I see no problem continuing to trade for and make picks. That's how dynasties are made. Flip Buch for a 1st and that's really good asset management - especially if you think Krav and Kakko are your top 6 wingers. (I don't necessarily think Krav and Kakko are there yet, but maybe the Rangers feel differently).

 

All I know is Buch is gonna get paid, and I'm not absolutely sold on him or his next deal.

I'm not too sure the Rangers will go hunting prospects, 31. But I also wouldn't be against landing more solid assets/prospects. I do agree with the boss though; I think the Rangers are looking to contend now...also considering Dolan just bumped out Gorton and JD because he wants to win again, more sooner than later.

To me, Buch seems like the perfect "Sell High" kinda player. I keep hoping they put together something to pry Greenway away from the Wild using Buch as part of the deal.

We'll see...

Nobody, but the argument I've seen around here is we can't keep Buchnevich because it blocks Kakko and Kravtsov. So the idea isn't to replace him. It's to promote the other two and backfill the bottom 6. I don't agree with that plan, which I've mentioned a bunch in the past, but it is still a valid pathway to take the franchise.

It's not so much that he's blocking Kakko and Kravtsov - neither of whom are obviously better than he is, but both of whom have significant runway - it's that committing to the contract he will likely have earned is going to be untenable and significantly block us from making the moves we probably have to make. Giving Buch his extension at anything over what RNH just got opens some real questions about who plays center and how we can even remotely afford it by 2022. His value will literally never be higher, he's at a position that we have clear options at - it just makes sense.

I'm not too sure the Rangers will go hunting prospects, 31. But I also wouldn't be against landing more solid assets/prospects. I do agree with the boss though; I think the Rangers are looking to contend now...also considering Dolan just bumped out Gorton and JD because he wants to win again, more sooner than later.

 

To me, Buch seems like the perfect "Sell High" kinda player. I keep hoping they put together something to pry Greenway away from the Wild using Buch as part of the deal.

 

We'll see...

It would be Greenway as part of the deal for Buch.

Nobody, but the argument I've seen around here is we can't keep Buchnevich because it blocks Kakko and Kravtsov. So the idea isn't to replace him. It's to promote the other two and backfill the bottom 6. I don't agree with that plan, which I've mentioned a bunch in the past, but it is still a valid pathway to take the franchise.

OK, sure, I agree, but that still doesn't really justify the idea of selling him for middling picks, and doesn't at all jive with what we all (I think) agree is the plan this year — to end the build part of the rebuild and begin actually competing. How is more picks — even a first-rounder — for Buchnevich "helping" them? That feels very much like a get picks to rebuild move, not a let's see what we can actually do here move.

Even if they're entirely resigned to trade Buchnevich, I tend to agree with Brooks — I see him as moving as part of a much larger package that's "imbalanced" in that it brings back fewer players, but unquestionably addresses areas of the team they feel they need to upgrade in order to be more competitive now.

This is not a viable offer, but I shared this type of construction with friends off the forum earlier today:

Using Eichel as the example target:

To BUF: No. 15, Ryan Strome, Pavel Buchnevich, Brett Howden (three bodies, one pick)

To NYR: Jack Eichel, Cody Eakin (two bodies)