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Thread: Death of George Floyd Sparks Nationwide Protests, Riots, Police Violence

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    Death of George Floyd Sparks Nationwide Protests, Riots, Police Violence

    The F.B.I. and the Minneapolis Police Department are investigating the arrest of a black man who died after being handcuffed and pinned to the ground by an officer’s knee, in an episode filmed by a bystander and denounced by the mayor on Tuesday.

    The arrest took place on Monday evening, the police said in a statement, after officers responded to a call about a man suspected of forgery. The police said the man, believed to be in his 40s, was found sitting on top of a blue car and “appeared to be under the influence.”

    “He was ordered to step from his car,” the department’s statement said. “After he got out, he physically resisted officers. Officers were able to get the suspect into handcuffs and noted he appeared to be suffering medical distress.”

    The statement said that officers called for an ambulance and that the man was taken to Hennepin County Medical Center, “where he died a short time later.”
    The bystander video that circulated widely on social media Monday night shows a white Minneapolis police officer pressing his knee into a black man’s neck during an arrest, as the man repeatedly says “I can’t breathe” and “please I can’t breathe.”

    Within minutes the man, lying face down in the street with his hands cuffed behind his back, becomes silent and motionless, the video shows; the officer continues to pin the man to the pavement with his knee.

    Bystanders plead and curse, begging the officer to stop and telling him the man’s nose is bleeding. Another officer faces the people gathered on the sidewalk. An ambulance medic arrives and, reaching under the officer’s knee, feels for a pulse on the man’s neck.

    The medic turns away, and a stretcher is wheeled over. The arrested man is then rolled onto the stretcher, loaded into an ambulance and taken away.

    The video did not show what happened before the officer pinned the man to the ground by his neck.
    https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/26/u...mid=tw-nytimes
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    Disgusting.

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    Yeah, this is murder IMO. The real question is, will that officer and his partner be prosecuted? They should be.
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    I think its manslaughter, not murder.

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    I'm not a prosecutor. Whatever it is, it's not legal, and the officer(s) should be prosecuted for it.
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    these videos never show what leads to cops acting the way they do in these incidents. im always wondering like why did this cop had his knee in the guy's neck in the first place? if the victim had the cuffs already on and the situation seemed to be defused, why was the cop's knee still pinning him down?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Albatross View Post
    if the victim had the cuffs already on and the situation seemed to be defused, why was the cop's knee still pinning him down?
    That's the point.

    these videos never show what leads to cops acting the way they do in these incidents. im always wondering like why did this cop had his knee in the guy's neck in the first place?
    Not this. It's not relevant. He was clearly detained and in medical distress. We've learned nothing since Eric Garner.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil in Absentia View Post
    That's the point.



    Not this. It's not relevant. He was clearly detained and in medical distress. We've learned nothing since Eric Garner.
    everything's relevant when its someone's life and someone else's freedom is at stake

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    Quote Originally Posted by Albatross View Post
    everything's relevant when its someone's life and someone else's freedom is at stake
    Nope. He could have just slaughtered a street full of kids or mildly resisted arrest. Neither changes the fact that he was detained, in cuffs, and in medical distress. The officers ignored repeated please from both the victim and bystanders, even after his body went limp and he lay quiet and motionless. The officer who killed him never took his knee off his neck. That is what matters. That, and only that.
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    I thought you said you weren't a prosecutor?

    I know what happened. I was curious what happened before the knee was placed on the victim's neck

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    Quote Originally Posted by Albatross View Post
    these videos never show what leads to cops acting the way they do in these incidents. im always wondering like why did this cop had his knee in the guy's neck in the first place? if the victim had the cuffs already on and the situation seemed to be defused, why was the cop's knee still pinning him down?
    You're right. The lead up absolutely matters. I read he was resisting arrest, so there's leeway here to subdue him with force. However, once he was subdued there is no excuse to pin him down by the back of the neck with full body weight.

    It looked like there was one officer on the back and one on the neck. Throw the book at both of them. I have all the appreciation in the world for officers who do a rather thankless job, but these are some bad apples here.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Albatross View Post
    I thought you said you weren't a prosecutor?

    I know what happened. I was curious what happened before the knee was placed on the victim's neck
    Per the video there was a point and time that the situation was defused, and the individual was in custody and no longer a threat.
    At that point it’s the responsibility of the arresting officers to negate unneeded harm.

    And they failed miserably.
    They should be removed from the force, charges brought, and a investment in training made.


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    Quote Originally Posted by rmc51 View Post
    You're right. The lead up absolutely matters. I read he was resisting arrest, so there's leeway here to subdue him with force. However, once he was subdued there is no excuse to pin him down by the back of the neck with full body weight.

    It looked like there was one officer on the back and one on the neck. Throw the book at both of them. I have all the appreciation in the world for officers who do a rather thankless job, but these are some bad apples here.
    not saying you are wrong, and not really related to this case specifically, but these types of videos of police using insane levels of force, it isn't new. With cameras on every phone these days, we see it more but this stuff has been going on forever, and it seems like cops continuously get away with it because the so-called good cops don't speak up (don't want to be called a rat)

    the problem goes beyond a few bad apples.
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    Quote Originally Posted by rmc51 View Post
    You're right. The lead up absolutely matters. I read he was resisting arrest, so there's leeway here to subdue him with force. However, once he was subdued there is no excuse to pin him down by the back of the neck with full body weight.
    It looked like there was one officer on the back and one on the neck. Throw the book at both of them. I have all the appreciation in the world for officers who do a rather thankless job, but these are some bad apples here.
    This. 100% this.

    Officers are not judges, juries, or executioners. Their job is to serve as the conduit for folks suspected of committing offences to the criminal justice system, where we have judges, juries, and yes, executioners.

    He's handcuffed, face to the ground, pleading for breath - what he did prior to the arrest isn't relevant.
    Last edited by G1000; 05-26-2020 at 04:59 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlairBettsBlocksEverything View Post
    not saying you are wrong, and not really related to this case specifically, but these types of videos of police using insane levels of force, it isn't new. With cameras on every phone these days, we see it more but this stuff has been going on forever, and it seems like cops continuously get away with it because the so-called good cops don't speak up (don't want to be called a rat)

    the problem goes beyond a few bad apples.
    I don't know that I agree with that. There are something like 800k law enforcement officers in the country. We would be reading about these kinds of deaths nonstop if it was systemic and not a very small portion who go way overboard on their ego trips.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rmc51 View Post
    I don't know that I agree with that. There are something like 800k law enforcement officers in the country. We would be reading about these kinds of deaths nonstop if it was systemic and not a very small portion who go way overboard on their ego trips.
    yes but the issue for so long has been that police cover for each other when these instances happen. And these officers who avoid jail time and get to quietly leave PD's end up hired at another Police Department where history repeats itself.

    its not some coincidence that the uptick in these cases coincides with technology making it easier to record/share these things.

    I would argue that cops who keep quiet about their fellow officers are also bad apples.

    the Ahmaud Arbery case would be forgotten about if it weren't for video evidence leaking. and while that wasn't against a cop, it was a former cop who had strong connections that prevented any charges so I would count it.

    There is certainly a racial bias in our justice system as a whole, not just in relation to any police brutality. Just seems like every day there's some new story about police overstepping their bounds and every day that 'bad apple' phrase gets used. eventually you have to think it's more than just an odd bad apple and that there is something bigger
    Last edited by BlairBettsBlocksEverything; 05-26-2020 at 03:45 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Albatross View Post
    I thought you said you weren't a prosecutor?

    I know what happened. I was curious what happened before the knee was placed on the victim's neck
    I'm not. I'm logical, though, so let's try this as a thought exercise:

    Scenario A: Suspect is witnessed to be walking the streets with a gun, firing indiscriminately, killing innocent citizens before police are called, arrive, and apprehend suspect. Once apprehended and in custody, the remainder of the video's contents are what we see.

    Scenario B: Suspect is witnessed to resist arrest. Police apprehend suspect. Once apprehended and in custody, the remainder of the video's contents are what we see.

    What about either of these changes the outcome, or justifies the behavior of the officers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Puck Head View Post
    Per the video there was a point and time that the situation was defused, and the individual was in custody and no longer a threat.
    At that point it’s the responsibility of the arresting officers to negate unneeded harm.

    And they failed miserably.
    They should be removed from the force, charges brought, and a investment in training made.



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    Bingo.

    Quote Originally Posted by BlairBettsBlocksEverything View Post
    yes but the issue for so long has been that police cover for each other when these instances happen. And these officers who avoid jail time and get to quietly leave PD's end up hired at another Police Department where history repeats itself.

    its not some coincidence that the uptick in these cases coincides with technology making it easier to record/share these things.

    I would argue that cops who keep quiet about their fellow officers are also bad apples.

    the Ahmaud Arbery case would be forgotten about if it weren't for video evidence leaking. and while that wasn't against a cop, it was a former cop who had strong connections that prevented any charges so I would count it.

    There is certainly a racial bias in our justice system as a whole, not just in relation to any police brutality. Just seems like every day there's some new story about police overstepping their bounds and every day that 'bad apple' phrase gets used. eventually you have to think it's more than just an odd bad apple and that there is something bigger
    Correct. Enablers.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil in Absentia View Post
    I'm not. I'm logical, though, so let's try this as a thought exercise:

    Scenario A: Suspect is witnessed to be walking the streets with a gun, firing indiscriminately, killing innocent citizens before police are called, arrive, and apprehend suspect. Once apprehended and in custody, the remainder of the video's contents are what we see.

    Scenario B: Suspect is witnessed to resist arrest. Police apprehend suspect. Once apprehended and in custody, the remainder of the video's contents are what we see.

    What about either of these changes the outcome, or justifies the behavior of the officers?



    Bingo.



    Correct. Enablers.
    you, for some reason think im trying to excuse the cop's behavior. im not. I was just wondering what happened before that led to the death. Murder and manslaughter are two very different things and carry very different sentences if convicted. If the cop is facing a life sentence, its only fair to find every detail of the incident. If the victim shot up 5 innocent women and kids 10 minutes before and then died under the cops knee, I think you would have a different outburst about this

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    Quote Originally Posted by Albatross View Post
    you, for some reason think im trying to excuse the cop's behavior. im not. I was just wondering what happened before that led to the death. Murder and manslaughter are two very different things and carry very different sentences if convicted. If the cop is facing a life sentence, its only fair to find every detail of the incident. If the victim shot up 5 innocent women and kids 10 minutes before and then died under the cops knee, I think you would have a different outburst about this
    Not really. I'd just be glad he was dead, instead of sad. The victim isn't the problem here. The cops are.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Albatross View Post
    you, for some reason think im trying to excuse the cop's behavior. im not. I was just wondering what happened before that led to the death. Murder and manslaughter are two very different things and carry very different sentences if convicted. If the cop is facing a life sentence, its only fair to find every detail of the incident. If the victim shot up 5 innocent women and kids 10 minutes before and then died under the cops knee, I think you would have a different outburst about this
    If he shot up women and children, and the officer killed him, the officer still killed a man who was clearly already subdued. What he was doing to "deserve it" is not relevant. Carrying out justice is not part of the officer's job. There's a reason an arrested perp is "brought to justice" and not "having justice passed" by an officer.

    Officers aren't executioners. This officer decided he was.
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