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Thread: The Trump Administration's Handling of the Coronavirus

  1. #1461
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    I get the " I can't vote for 'the enemy' thing." I really do. But I cannot fathom how anyone who can apportion facts can look at the two candidates for POTUS and come to the determination they are equally bad. They're not. One — Trump — is objectively worse. That's not opinion. It's literally fact. Charlottesville. Russia. Covid-19. Helsinki. The parade of indictments and convictions of his Administration and campaign officials. Mocking a disabled reporter. Grab 'em by the pussy. Pathologically lying about everything from the seriousness of a pandemic to the most trivial aspects of daily life. WikiLeaks. Hatch Act violations. Bill Barr and the perversion of the Justice Department. Khashoggi. The EPA. Kushner. Shithole countries. "Loser" military. His generals are "pussies." Stormy Daniels. Children in cages. His fucking tax returns.

    It's a god damned cavalcade of national disgrace after national disgrace, and it never fucking ends. To equate almost any of this, let alone the totality of it, to "well, Biden lies, too," is the biggest false equivalency I've ever encountered. Ever.

    That a Trump voter would be extremely reluctant to cross the aisle I get. That a Trump voter would willfully ignore four years of the degradation of American standards and nearly 200,000 dead countrymen and still want to vote for him I can't. It more than strains credulity — it strains humanity.
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  2. #1462
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil in Absentia View Post
    I get the " I can't vote for 'the enemy' thing." I really do. But I cannot fathom how anyone who can apportion facts can look at the two candidates for POTUS and come to the determination they are equally bad. They're not. One is objectively worse. That a Trump voter would be extremely reluctant to cross the aisle I get. That a Trump voter would willfully ignore four years of the degredation of American standards and nearly 200,000 dead countrymen and still want to vote for him I can't. It more than strains credulity — it strains humanity.
    Ok you’re taking the word equally a bit too literally. My fault. But I cant stand that I’m put in a spot where I have to decide between shitty and shittier. It’s obscene to me personally. It’s not always about the trump voter , the rep/dem voter. So,Erika it’s just as simple as thinking we aren’t making progress either way. Disagree with that? Fine.

    I think it’s going to be an interesting election though. Biden just isn’t a strong candidate. Obama was. Clinton sort of was but just not personable at all. What’s going to make this a very close election is that I think a lot of people are going to go into this election with the idea of “this was who you came up with after all this time” and that will hurt Biden somewhat. The good thing for team Biden though is that Trump is an idiot and probably will continue to do idiotic things.

    How the hell are we in a place as a country where the slogan almost feels like “vote for me because, well, I’m just not as bad as him”

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    Truthfully, I don’t even care about the the POTUS election because it makes no difference. The only real significance of that is who will get to pick who replaces RBG when she finally passes. I hope to have that much tenacity at that age after all the health issues.

    Bigger issue is local elections, which is a shame, because they’ll all go blindly to progressive Dems in NY and I don’t really know how much “progress” I can take before I move my family out of NY.

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    https://nypost.com/2020/09/10/new-yo...ague-of-crime/

    https://nypost.com/2020/09/10/cuomo-...19-shortfalls/

    For those of you not from NYC who don’t realize how progressive politicians have decimated NY, see above. Democratic socialists always say how it will be different here... clearly it’s not. The cities governing as close to what Bernie wants are absolutely horrific. (NYC, Chicago, San Francisco, LA, Portland, etc.). I don’t see how we can see it fail here (highest taxes, highest crime rates, worst QOL, completely unaffordable, etc) and still think this will work, but that’s another discussion for another thread.

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    The Trump Administration's Handling of the Coronavirus

    The comment about having to choose ‘between shitty or shittier’ sums it up - and using common sense you go with the ‘less shitty,’ right?

    We have had that description of presidential candidates applied before and it will continue well into the future. Why? We’ve allowed both parties to exert unreasonable control over our political process. Of course there should be more choices from more parties participating in the overall election process. But the game is rigged. And neither Dems or GOP will want their stranglehold changed. That is our systemic political issue.

  6. #1466
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keirik View Post
    Ok you’re taking the word equally a bit too literally. My fault. But I cant stand that I’m put in a spot where I have to decide between shitty and shittier. It’s obscene to me personally. It’s not always about the trump voter , the rep/dem voter. So,Erika it’s just as simple as thinking we aren’t making progress either way. Disagree with that? Fine.
    I get it, but again, the language you use here invokes a false equivalence. Biden is a career politician, which itself can be a turn-off. Trump is a vulgarian, career criminal, who pathologically lies every time he opens his mouth, and is an objectively awful human being — arguably the worst figure/human being in modern American history. He and Biden are peers in political name only.

    One is human, and flawed. The other is inhuman, capricious, vindictive, and actively seeks to divide the nation by fanning the flames of racial resentment with dangerous (and deadly) rhetoric.

    What you're actually being asked to decide between is the wholesale end of American democracy versus an establishment politician who will maintain our Republic, even if he accomplishes literally nothing else at all. How is this a difficult choice?

    I think it’s going to be an interesting election though. Biden just isn’t a strong candidate. Obama was. Clinton sort of was but just not personable at all.
    Biden absolutely is a strong candidate. He's just not a generational one like Obama was. Biden just decimated the fundraising record in August with more than $300 million dollars in contributions. If that's not political strength, what the hell is?

    What’s going to make this a very close election is that I think a lot of people are going to go into this election with the idea of “this was who you came up with after all this time” and that will hurt Biden somewhat. The good thing for team Biden though is that Trump is an idiot and probably will continue to do idiotic things.
    And you're basing this on what? Biden is, by nearly every measure, a more likeable, and publiicly supported candidate than Clinton was (the favorables numbers alone are stark between them).

    How the hell are we in a place as a country where the slogan almost feels like “vote for me because, well, I’m just not as bad as him”
    Great question worthy of a great answer. I don't have it, but the only way we'll get it is by sidestepping doomsday first. Elect someone who won't be a daily cause of unrest and we can probably start to actually work at solving it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Niko View Post
    Truthfully, I don’t even care about the the POTUS election because it makes no difference. The only real significance of that is who will get to pick who replaces RBG when she finally passes. I hope to have that much tenacity at that age after all the health issues.

    Bigger issue is local elections, which is a shame, because they’ll all go blindly to progressive Dems in NY and I don’t really know how much “progress” I can take before I move my family out of NY.
    "It makes no difference," followed by "who will get too replace RGB" is some serious cognitive dissonance, dude. It makes a metric fuck ton of difference. It's a lifetime appointment.
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    "Never be a spectator of unfairness or stupidity. Seek out argument and disputation for their own sake; the grave will supply plenty of time for silence."
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  7. #1467
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    Quote Originally Posted by Niko View Post
    https://nypost.com/2020/09/10/new-yo...ague-of-crime/

    https://nypost.com/2020/09/10/cuomo-...19-shortfalls/

    For those of you not from NYC who don’t realize how progressive politicians have decimated NY, see above. Democratic socialists always say how it will be different here... clearly it’s not. The cities governing as close to what Bernie wants are absolutely horrific. (NYC, Chicago, San Francisco, LA, Portland, etc.). I don’t see how we can see it fail here (highest taxes, highest crime rates, worst QOL, completely unaffordable, etc) and still think this will work, but that’s another discussion for another thread.
    Not the thread for this. Open a new one.
    "Everyone says you should be a good loser. If you’re a good loser, you’re a loser."
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    "Never be a spectator of unfairness or stupidity. Seek out argument and disputation for their own sake; the grave will supply plenty of time for silence."
    - Christopher Hitchens

  8. #1468
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    Quote Originally Posted by Niko View Post
    Truthfully, I don’t even care about the the POTUS election because it makes no difference. The only real significance of that is who will get to pick who replaces RBG when she finally passes. I hope to have that much tenacity at that age after all the health issues.

    Bigger issue is local elections, which is a shame, because they’ll all go blindly to progressive Dems in NY and I don’t really know how much “progress” I can take before I move my family out of NY.
    The inherent problem with progressive theory right now is that it requires lockstep cooperation from both citizens and government. That's the biggest issue to break down. Thing is...it should get that support, but it doesn't, because of the marshmallow theory. This sounds stupid, but it holds water - people would rather take the marshmallow now than have two later.

    Healthcare is a really good example of this - nationalizing our healthcare system unilaterally reduces costs, increases benefits, etc - the studies have been done, the math works. The concept of a tax increase to support that is completely insane to people....because they're not doing the calculus to say "wait up - that's lower than my premium, it's lower than my costs, and healthcare is the BIGGEST EXPENSE I will have in my retirement". So it becomes a punching bag, because immediacy trumps delayed gratification every time. What we end up with is a hackneyed system that doesn't work as it should because we're busy trying to balance all this out.

    COVID also falls into this - we're completely incapable of not getting immediate gratification. It doesn't help that our president is a completely inept leader, but we as people are just greedier. We had too many people who wanted one marshmallow here, and we're still battling this fuckin' virus.

    The tl;dr of this is that people are bad at math and generally bad at understanding how to maximize their input into the system for the greater good of all, so progressive policies designed to say "dude, stop worrying about X and let us deal with it" end up failing because of concessions made to folks who want that first marshmallow instead of the 2 later on.
    Last edited by G1000; 09-11-2020 at 08:15 AM.
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    "Everyone says you should be a good loser. If you’re a good loser, you’re a loser."
    - John Tortorella


    "Never be a spectator of unfairness or stupidity. Seek out argument and disputation for their own sake; the grave will supply plenty of time for silence."
    - Christopher Hitchens

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    Thank god we're "rounding the turn" otherwise we might have something to be concerned about.

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    ^Unfortunately, the ‘turn’ is the 360-degree circle Consumer Reports uses to test tire grip.

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    Last edited by jsrangers; 09-15-2020 at 09:34 PM.

  13. #1473
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    On the very same day.


  14. #1474
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    "Everyone says you should be a good loser. If you’re a good loser, you’re a loser."
    - John Tortorella


    "Never be a spectator of unfairness or stupidity. Seek out argument and disputation for their own sake; the grave will supply plenty of time for silence."
    - Christopher Hitchens

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    15 cases soon to be down to 0, I mean over 7,000,000.

    200,000 dead and counting.

    Just ignore the question.


  16. #1476
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    I mean sure.

    "Our approach is pro-science, Biden's approach is anti-science......."



  17. #1477
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    Quote Originally Posted by Niko View Post
    Truthfully, I don’t even care about the the POTUS election because it makes no difference. The only real significance of that is who will get to pick who replaces RBG when she finally passes. I hope to have that much tenacity at that age after all the health issues.

    Bigger issue is local elections, which is a shame, because they’ll all go blindly to progressive Dems in NY and I don’t really know how much “progress” I can take before I move my family out of NY.
    Now there is no significance.

    On my little 12 house block in Central Jersey we recently got two families from Brooklyn for exactly the reasons you mention. Prices are going up and we will be listing soon if you are interested.

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    Here's a link to an article that mentions it - https://www.cnn.com/2020/10/07/healt...-bn/index.html
    #imthebadguy

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    #imthebadguy

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