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Thread: Article: World Scientists' Warning of a 'Climate Emergency'

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    Article: World Scientists' Warning of a 'Climate Emergency'

    'Scientists have a moral obligation to clearly warn humanity of any catastrophic threat and to “tell it like it is.” On the basis of this obligation and the graphical indicators presented below, we declare, with more than 11,000 scientist signatories from around the world, clearly and unequivocally that planet Earth is facing a climate emergency.'

    BioScience, peer reviewed journal
    https://academic.oup.com/bioscience/...biz088/5610806

    ...'Profoundly troubling signs from human activities include sustained increases in both human and ruminant livestock populations, per capita meat production, world gross domestic product, global tree cover loss, fossil fuel consumption, the number of air passengers carried, carbon dioxide (CO2) emissions, and per capita CO2 emissions since 2000 (figure 1, supplemental file S2). Encouraging signs include decreases in global fertility (birth) rates (figure 1b), decelerated forest loss in the Brazilian Amazon (figure 1g), increases in the consumption of solar and wind power (figure 1h), institutional fossil fuel divestment of more than US$7 trillion (figure 1j), and the proportion of GHG emissions covered by carbon pricing (figure 1m).'
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    I appreciate the share, but these sort of things drive me nuts: partly because this falls under the "no shit" doctrine, and partly because of the solution set presented.

    We aren't solving this problem by going vegan and swearing off CFCs, because just 100 corporations are responsible for 71% of all greenhouse gas emissions. We need to make it uncomfortable for these companies to continue doing business without regard for the collateral damage in order to make a real impact.
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    Fletch, great article but unfortunately, with topics like this, it's not going to sway many minds as they're already made up and the positions are dug in. This is as it's become just another political issue that no one wants to be shown they may be wrong on.

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    Quote Originally Posted by G1000 View Post
    I appreciate the share, but these sort of things drive me nuts: partly because this falls under the "no shit" doctrine, and partly because of the solution set presented.

    We aren't solving this problem by going vegan and swearing off CFCs, because just 100 corporations are responsible for 71% of all greenhouse gas emissions. We need to make it uncomfortable for these companies to continue doing business without regard for the collateral damage in order to make a real impact.
    That’s article took some heat. The majority of those companies are energy producers.
    They aren’t emoting they emissions, they are selling the product to the consumers who then produce the emissions.
    The issue is much more complicated than a few companies


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    It's going to be a massive shift to renewables over time, but how much time do we have before we are all stricken with illnesses linked to pollution? The view from 10,000 feet is an easy fix. Down here it's much more difficult as greed rules the roost.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Puck Head View Post
    That’s article took some heat. The majority of those companies are energy producers.
    They aren’t emoting they emissions, they are selling the product to the consumers who then produce the emissions.
    The issue is much more complicated than a few companies


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    Yeah, I noticed that as well. It gave me some pause, except I don't think it changes the factual accuracy of the statement. I might drive a car, for example, but I generally haven't got a good option for a car that doesn't run on fossil fuels. Tesla's out there, but even there, ConEd or Duke is converting coal or gas to electricity to power that.

    We simply make it too easy for these companies to skate off without finding better solutions in the renewable space, and we're kind of complacent as a country, or even as earthlings, about that.
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    I think the main issue is the solution requires a large portion of the Earth's populace (on an individual, group, or corporate level) need to modify a pretty fair portion of habits in order to limit their "carbon footprint." And that's a non-starter or difficult to swallow for a lot of people. I would also lump myself in that category, even as someone who considers climate change a massive issue, probably number one if not top-3.

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    'The climate crisis is closely linked to excessive consumption of the wealthy lifestyle. The most affluent countries are mainly responsible for the historical GHG emissions and generally have the greatest per capita emissions (table S1)....To secure a sustainable future, we must change how we live'

    The paper position is the status quo will result in increasingly dire consequences disproportionately born by the poor to support the lifestyles in affluent countries. Wealthy countries need to shrink their footprint, instead of just chastising tropical countries to 'Save the Rainforest'.
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    it’s a tough problem. i do think individuals can make a big difference with choices (walk, public transport, car, plane)... eating local, how much meat and what kind, electrical/water/heat/air conditioning consumption , etc. i have much more confidence in local and state/provincial governments than national governments in making decisions that make a difference
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morphinity View Post
    I think the main issue is the solution requires a large portion of the Earth's populace (on an individual, group, or corporate level) need to modify a pretty fair portion of habits in order to limit their "carbon footprint." And that's a non-starter or difficult to swallow for a lot of people. I would also lump myself in that category, even as someone who considers climate change a massive issue, probably number one if not top-3.
    do you see small changes you could make that would help, or do you see whatever changes you make as a drop in the bucket that wouldn’t matter?
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    I think any change an individual makes is a drop in the bucket because of the scale of the problem and the complexity of the solution.

    There needs to be a complete paradigm shift and a massive effort to change on the part of individuals, countries, and corporations for any meaningful change to take place.

    So I try to do my part, but it's definitely half-assed because a) I don't want to change all that much when it really comes down to it and b) I'm cynical towards what my impact actually is.

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    I think you've captured it in a nutshell: can one individual really make a difference, and it's hard to change.

    I get more encouraged when I hear about town or neighborhood initiatives because that means multiple individuals have gotten together and worked toward a positive change, multiplying the impact.

    International conferences have great sound bites, with little meaningful change. So I'm in favor of the bottom up or grassroots efforts, rather than top down dictation. Anything from the top down has to be watered down because of all the people affected.
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    Collectively, individual *small* steps can add up to be a huge impact. Recycling for instance, is such a easy and hugely impactful measure, yet how many people still don't do it? Separating cans and bottles away from refuse is a no-brainer. Food waste is another area that individuals can help change but it's a bit more difficult. The amount of energy and resources that go into *making* our food is huge, so every incremental reduction in waste can become quite big. i.e., My brother-in-law would never eat leftovers and consequently, food in his home goes to waste. I get the nearly impossible challenge to making changes to our eating habits.

    Our family of 4 burned $6,500 in gasoline last year. Would driving electric vehicles the amount of mileage we go result in a net positive if we could make the switch from gasoline vehicles? The electricity has to be generated in the first place and at what cost? Advances in solar energy capture and battery range have not yet intersected at a meaningful point IMO to make the change (for us at least) viable.
    Last edited by 4EverRangerFrank; 11-08-2019 at 11:45 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 4EverRangerFrank View Post
    The electricity has to be generated in the first place and at what cost? Advances in solar energy capture and battery range have not yet intersected at a meaningful point IMO to make the change (for us at least) viable.
    And that's the key. Come up with a viable renewable(s) energy source that makes the same or better returns and the big bad companies that the climate zealots keep railing about will be all over it. WE don't need to force THEM. They're in it for profit. Ineffective govt mandates and fees etc will only be passed down to the consumer.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 4EverRangerFrank View Post
    Collectively, individual *small* steps can add up to be a huge impact. Recycling for instance, is such a easy and hugely impactful measure, yet how many people still don't do it? Separating cans and bottles away from refuse is a no-brainer. Food waste is another area that individuals can help change but it's a bit more difficult. The amount of energy and resources that go into *making* our food is huge, so every incremental reduction in waste can become quite big. i.e., My brother-in-law would never eat leftovers and consequently, food in his home goes to waste. I get the nearly impossible challenge to making changes to our eating habits.

    Our family of 4 burned $6,500 in gasoline last year. Would driving electric vehicles the amount of mileage we go result in a net positive if we could make the switch from gasoline vehicles? The electricity has to be generated in the first place and at what cost? Advances in solar energy capture and battery range have not yet intersected at a meaningful point IMO to make the change (for us at least) viable.
    I am all in favor of individual changes. Walking more often and eating less beef are 2 choices I’ve made that help my health and lessen my footprint. IMO too much attention is being paid to national policies of various countries. Elections don’t happen very often, but you can make choices everyday that can help yourself, family, neighborhood, and community.
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    Article: World Scientists' Warning of a 'Climate Emergency'

    From @richardbranson interesting read on how breakthrough battery technologies will play a central role in our energy system sooner than previously thought possible. Here’s how: https://virg.in/ihn
    Last edited by 4EverRangerFrank; 11-10-2019 at 10:06 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NY Chief View Post
    And that's the key. Come up with a viable renewable(s) energy source that makes the same or better returns and the big bad companies that the climate zealots keep railing about will be all over it. WE don't need to force THEM. They're in it for profit. Ineffective govt mandates and fees etc will only be passed down to the consumer.
    You're forgetting two very important things:

    1 - I'm all for companies making money, but there are some places where the strive for limitless profit needs to be examined. Energy is one of those places, largely because precisely none of these energy companies have competition in their respective areas. You, as a consumer of energy in NYC, have two choices. ConEd, or no electricity. You don't have the ability to live in Queens, for example, and get anything but ConEd. I don't think the whole "in it for profit" thing applies when there's no competition - they're a forced part of living in a specific space. If they're both in it for profit and there are no options aside from them, they're either a government mandated cost (and therefore vulnerable to being legislated), or a monopoly.

    The rules of capitalism assume competition. Con Ed has none.

    2 - We already have tons of viable renewable energy sources. Solar, wind, nuclear, and geothermal energy is all basically viable and all basically renewable, and at significantly lower emissions standards. The problems around solar/wind are largely energy transfer and storage - battery tech, as Frank mentioned. It's getting there.
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    Scientists in Sweden have figured out how to harness solar power, store it and release it on demand in the form of heat decades after it's been captured


    https://t.co/ijDFS6eLfZ?amp=1

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