confirmed: Rangers Buyout Kevin Shattenkirk

I'm not talking Hank and Datsyuk late. Those are indeed extreme examples. I'm talking about, for example, Kucherov (58) and Gaudreau (104) being the best players in the 2011 draft while there's 6 first rounders with 0, 0, 2, 12, 20, and 31 NHL games. Draft rankings aren't perfect and no team has a perfect draft history.

 

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Not to mention, Rangers fans hadn't had a pick as high as #7 in quite a long time and we all had our hopes up for an immediate franchise kind of talent. It didn't exist at that spot in the draft, or if it did, it certainly hasn't been found out yet.

It?s unlikely he grows into the type of player you hope you get with a top 10 pick. They knew he was a reach at 7. They fell in love with his reputed intensity, competitiveness, leadership, ?NHL readiness? and other intangibles, etc, and overlooked the fact that he was not equipped with a physical skill set that justified him being drafted there, regardless of the quality of his draft class.

There were better players on the board.

The overwhelming majority of draft rankings had him in the 12-18 range. None of the major rankings had him in the top-10.

Honestly I think they were really looking at Pettersson and thought he?d be there at 7 and unfortunately he wasn?t. In the process of scouting Pettersson they saw and learned about Lias and liked what they found. So he jumped up on their board and they took him.

Right now, does not look like a good pick. Forget about what guys drafted behind him have done thus far. Judging him based on his own performance and what we can actually see, it?s very underwhelming.

That said, hes still very early in his developmental arc. See where he?s at in another 150 or so games. No one should close the book on him becoming a quality NHL player.

 

Interesting comparison from Valli but I think that was who we were expecting to get when we drafted him. The intangibles and NHL readiness were what was touted when he was selected. Maybe this is his year to make the squad. If he could make the team and be a leader well anyone who has been in a locker room knows that you need leaders and sometimes those guys arent the top point getters but lead by example of leaving it all on the ice. Give this kid a shot to be a leader in training and let him develop his on ice game. I am pumped to see all of these young guys this year. Only one Im disappointed about is K'andre not making the jump yet.

He's gonna go from what he's shown to be a leader? If he's a leader on this team we're fucked. Maybe the bar should be he becomes an NHL level talent.

He's gonna go from what he's shown to be a leader? If he's a leader on this team we're fucked. Maybe the bar should be he becomes an NHL level talent.

And that is very fair to say at this point.

The way they made it sound, it was like “In 3-5 years, this kid is our Captain for the next 10 years.”

I’m not seeing that yet.

Well everyone's been talking about how Chytil was the better draft pick. I thought he was terrible. He was the perfect candidate to play in Hartford FOR THE WHOLE SEASON. The fact that Hartford was a miserable place to develope was why Chytil kept getting ice time. We'll never know if Anderson got the same treatment as Chytil if he would have had a better year. Towards the end of the season both Chytil and Andersons picked up. Maybe not in the stats but with the eye, Chytil picked up his physical game and Anderson picked up his 200 ft game. Last season was really not a good gauge of a rookie performance because of the plethora of factors the team and coach faced. This is the season we should be able to scrutinize how our youngins respond after their respective tastes last year.

Chytil had a good season for his age. Not great, and his numbers could have been better a bit better, but his underlying stats are very good and the Rangers do really well when he's on the ice.

He was bad when deployed on the 4th line, but you can't really expect an 18/19 year old to drive a line with replacement level players and McLeod types.

Absolutely no reason to go after Chytil for what he did last season.

Chytil had a good season for his age. Not great, and his numbers could have been better a bit better, but his underlying stats are very good and the Rangers do really well when he's on the ice.

He was bad when deployed on the 4th line, but you can't really expect an 18/19 year old to drive a line with replacement level players and McLeod types.

Absolutely no reason to go after Chytil for what he did last season.

Thats the whole point with Andersson. He only ever got stuck on the 4th line and people expected him to be Crosby because he was selected 7th in the draft.

It’s unlikely he grows into the type of player you hope you get with a top 10 pick. They knew he was a reach at 7. They fell in love with his reputed intensity, competitiveness, leadership, “NHL readiness” and other intangibles, etc, and overlooked the fact that he was not equipped with a physical skill set that justified him being drafted there, regardless of the quality of his draft class.

 

There were better players on the board.

The overwhelming majority of draft rankings had him in the 12-18 range. None of the major rankings had him in the top-10.

 

 

Honestly I think they were really looking at Pettersson and thought he’d be there at 7 and unfortunately he wasn’t. In the process of scouting Pettersson they saw and learned about Lias and liked what they found. So he jumped up on their board and they took him.

 

Right now, does not look like a good pick. Forget about what guys drafted behind him have done thus far. Judging him based on his own performance and what we can actually see, it’s very underwhelming.

 

That said, hes still very early in his developmental arc. See where he’s at in another 150 or so games. No one should close the book on him becoming a quality NHL player.

This was sort of the point of my original post; if they had traded down to 12 or 13 to get an additional 2nd or 3rd round pick, and grabbed him there, all of this noise about him being a bust would be so much quieter. Instead they over reached, not in a McIlrath kind of way; but they did leave a more productive player on the board, and we are where we are right now.

Thats the whole point with Andersson. He only ever got stuck on the 4th line and people expected him to be Crosby because he was selected 7th in the draft.

Right on the money. If someone wants to criticize the pick, because they used it on a player whose ceiling is as a middle six forward; totally fair. However if you are criticizing the player because he hasn't had a 25 goal season at 20 years old, and is therefore a "bust", you really don't know what you are talking about.

This was sort of the point of my original post; if they had traded down to 12 or 13 to get an additional 2nd or 3rd round pick, and grabbed him there, all of this noise about him being a bust would be so much quieter. Instead they over reached, not in a McIlrath kind of way; but they did leave a more productive player on the board, and we are where we are right now.

Totally understand that

And I agree with you in terms of his draft position had it been 5-6 spots lower.

The bigger argument and issue though is that you shouldn’t reach or roll the dice heavily at 7th overall. Way more likely the guy you pick disappoints vs flourishes. Just setting up for a letdown on some level.

Gotta take the best player available in that spot. They didn’t

But everyone should be patient. Far too soon for a final judgment

Things may change, but as of now, his upside looks more like a Manny Malholtra than a Ryan Callahan, and that's not good enough for a No. 7 pick, even in a relatively thin draft.

Malhotra is the guy I think of with Lias as far as his ceiling goes

If he’s that player when all is said and done, it wouldn’t be awful.

Granted still a disappointment for his draft position but a player like that that you could deploy in a shit down role vs top players, kill penalties, hopefully he becomes good in faceoff circle, that player has value.

Malhotra is the guy I think of with Lias as far as his ceiling goes

 

If he?s that player when all is said and done, it wouldn?t be awful.

Granted still a disappointment for his draft position but a player like that that you could deploy in a shit down role vs top players, kill penalties, hopefully he becomes good in faceoff circle, that player has value.

I think his ceiling is Toews.

Devon...not Jonathan.

Malhotra is the guy I think of with Lias as far as his ceiling goes

 

If he’s that player when all is said and done, it wouldn’t be awful.

Granted still a disappointment for his draft position but a player like that that you could deploy in a shit down role vs top players, kill penalties, hopefully he becomes good in faceoff circle, that player has value.

Nothing like a good shit down center.

The draft isn't a crap shoot though. That's why there's scouting and rankings.

This. NYR under Sather had an aversion to taking high end offensive players in the 1st round. and then not surprisingly find themselves in the market for the likes of Gaboirk, Nash and now Panarin. Not sure if it's Gord Clark or Sather thinking the next Gord Kluzak is the shit or simply overthinking it.

The McIlrath pick really stands out. If it's 1992, the guy has a 10-year Tom Laidlaw type career as a 2nd or 3rd pair stay at home good ifo the net D. But the game changed to more skating and puck carrying, and there ins't a role for a guy like that any more if he cannot do those other things .

Sather since he has been here has had one disaster after another with defensemen. Be it the draft or singings, a mess. Redden, DelZotto, Shattenkirk, finding Stralman and then letting him go to sing Dan Boyle...

Nothing like a good shit down center.

I agree

Shitting down guys like Crosby is crucial to suckcess

This. NYR under Sather had an aversion to taking high end offensive players in the 1st round. and then not surprisingly find themselves in the market for the likes of Gaboirk, Nash and now Panarin. Not sure if it's Gord Clark or Sather thinking the next Gord Kluzak is the shit or simply overthinking it.

 

The McIlrath pick really stands out. If it's 1992, the guy has a 10-year Tom Laidlaw type career as a 2nd or 3rd pair stay at home good ifo the net D. But the game changed to more skating and puck carrying, and there ins't a role for a guy like that any more if he cannot do those other things .

 

Sather since he has been here has had one disaster after another with defensemen. Be it the draft or singings, a mess. Redden, DelZotto, Shattenkirk, finding Stralman and then letting him go to sing Dan Boyle...

Actually it's kind of funny if you look at the similarities between the 2010 "McIlrath" draft and the 2017; there were definitely players available after the Ranger's picks in each draft, but most of them were not ranked very highly by the scouting services. It's very easy to say 9 years later "They should have totally grabbed Tarasenko with that pick", but most of the players you would grab if you could re-draft today are nowhere to be found on most of the experts lists.

https://www.thedraftanalyst.com/rankings/year-to-year-central-scouting-rankings/2010-2/2010-csb-final-na-skaters/

http://www.nhl.com/ice/page.htm?id=59880

http://www.mynhldraft.com/2010-NHL-Mock-Draft/

This. NYR under Sather had an aversion to taking high end offensive players in the 1st round. and then not surprisingly find themselves in the market for the likes of Gaboirk, Nash and now Panarin. Not sure if it's Gord Clark or Sather thinking the next Gord Kluzak is the shit or simply overthinking it.

 

The McIlrath pick really stands out. If it's 1992, the guy has a 10-year Tom Laidlaw type career as a 2nd or 3rd pair stay at home good ifo the net D. But the game changed to more skating and puck carrying, and there ins't a role for a guy like that any more if he cannot do those other things .

 

Sather since he has been here has had one disaster after another with defensemen. Be it the draft or singings, a mess. Redden, DelZotto, Shattenkirk, finding Stralman and then letting him go to sing Dan Boyle...

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Actually it's kind of funny if you look at the similarities between the 2010 "McIlrath" draft and the 2017; there were definitely players available after the Ranger's picks in each draft, but most of them were not ranked very highly by the scouting services. It's very easy to say 9 years later "They should have totally grabbed Tarasenko with that pick", but most of the players you would grab if you could re-draft today are nowhere to be found on most of the experts lists.

 

https://www.thedraftanalyst.com/rankings/year-to-year-central-scouting-rankings/2010-2/2010-csb-final-na-skaters/

 

http://www.nhl.com/ice/page.htm?id=59880

 

http://www.mynhldraft.com/2010-NHL-Mock-Draft/

Right on the money. If someone wants to criticize the pick, because they used it on a player whose ceiling is as a middle six forward; totally fair. However if you are criticizing the player because he hasn't had a 25 goal season at 20 years old, and is therefore a "bust", you really don't know what you are talking about.

Chytil had a good season for his age. Not great, and his numbers could have been better a bit better, but his underlying stats are very good and the Rangers do really well when he's on the ice.

He was bad when deployed on the 4th line, but you can't really expect an 18/19 year old to drive a line with replacement level players and McLeod types.

Absolutely no reason to go after Chytil for what he did last season.

And how did you come up with the Rangers do well when he's on the ice? He led the team with a -22.

It wasn't my intention to sound harsh of Chytil. I just think he was not ready to play the whole season in the NHL. The FO addressed that with Hartfords new coaching staff and hopefully they will not play any rookies that are clearly not ready. Like I said he was terrible but I'm not blaming him. He did the best he could for a kid who can't even shave yet.

And how did you come up with the Rangers do well when he's on the ice? He led the team with a -22.

I didn't come up with anything. His possession and shot differential metrics are excellent, at least in context of what the Rangers were as a team.

If there's someone who should be considered for a full time role in Hartford based on last season it's Howden. After a hot start he was awful and blatantly not ready for a full time role in the NHL.

They combined for 2100 points in 2600 games, but okay.

 

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And never elivated any mediocre players game. Never dominated seasons. Never won. Way to combine two players point totals to equal over a ppg. Logical.

I didn't come up with anything. His possession and shot differential metrics are excellent, at least in context of what the Rangers were as a team.

If there's someone who should be considered for a full time role in Hartford based on last season it's Howden. After a hot start he was awful and blatantly not ready for a full time role in the NHL.

Agreed on Howden. I think he had about 15-20 games at the start of the year where he looked legit. Abysmal otherwise, and unlike Andersson, he got ice time and didn't do enough with it.

The top six for the next 7 years should include Panarin, Zibanejad, Kakko, Chytil, Kravtsov, and potentially Buch. Not exactly hurting for skill or having a hole to fill.

 

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3-4 of those names have either not played one single NHL game or have done very little in the time they have been given.

Andersson as a #7 overall should automatically be considered as a potential top 6 player. Who fuckin drafts for their bottom 6 in the first round, much less top 7.

The POSSIBLE existing roster players whom might make up the top 6, is reason enough for you to be ok with Andersson likely being a bottom 6 player?

As stated. Why keep him? If he has value (and he should), and he doesn't project to be any better than what they have within, why not take advantage of his value. He's not needed...

And never elivated any mediocre players game. Never dominated seasons. Never won. Way to combine two players point totals to equal over a ppg. Logical.

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