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The Salary-Cap Hell the Rangers are Still Trying to Navigate


Phil

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We'd still be OK on roster number (13F, 6D, 2G), and I believe we'd be clear on cap too but by much, much less. Sending Smith to the minors has a cap hit of 3.275M; we'd be clear, but by a hair.

 

 

 

Also true, though, cap space is probably the most premium asset in the league right now.

 

Ahh there it is cap space the most premium asset.

 

Also why is there all of a sudden going to be a team willing to take on smith? He cleared waivers over a year ago and I would imagine has been on the block ever since. If there was an asset they could package with him to move him why hasn’t that materialized in over a year? I guess there is always a price to move him but obviously that price is very high. It’s easy to state it as your fix, it’s much harder to pull off when the PlayStation is turned off

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I don't think that's actually a option though, is it?

 

Am I wrong in thinking you can only have three buyouts on the books at any given time? We've got 2 (Girardi, Spooner). Or am I thinking of retained salary transactions?

Probably retained.

 

The article is explicitly about buying out both.

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I don't think that's actually a option though, is it?

 

Am I wrong in thinking you can only have three buyouts on the books at any given time? We've got 2 (Girardi, Spooner). Or am I thinking of retained salary transactions?

 

Maybe that?s where the term hell is being brought up. Maybe an overreaction but seems like something is going to give.

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Ahh there it is cap space the most premium asset.

 

Also why is there all of a sudden going to be a team willing to take on smith? He cleared waivers over a year ago and I would imagine has been on the block ever since. If there was an asset they could package with him to move him why hasn’t that materialized in over a year? I guess there is always a price to move him but obviously that price is very high. It’s easy to state it as your fix, it’s much harder to pull off when the PlayStation is turned off

 

Time.

 

Three year bad deals become more tradeable when they're two year bad deals.

Two year bad deals become more tradeable when they're now one year deals.

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Probably retained.

 

The article is explicitly about buying out both.

 

Yeah, but I'm ignoring Brooks on grounds that he's a moron.

 

Even in the worst possible case scenario where we have zero takers and have to look at a buyout, it's mathematically unlikely that we'd ever need to buy out both. We'd bury Smith before buying out both of them.

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He shared the Capfriendly link which shows it saves cap space this year at the expense of next year, but it also shows that the dead cap hit is absorbed quite easily next year.

 

At the expense of a player, which FattyF has been saying.

 

Panarin costs you Shattenkirk buyout, which prevents them from signing a player, for example Kreider.

 

 

It makes more sense to trade Namestnikov for a pick, buyout Smith. The 2nd year of the Smith buyout is lower than the Girardi buy-out cap hit for 2019-20.

 

The goal of the next 2 seasons is to not fuck it up. Neither is ideal, but 1 has a lesser impact moving forward. The Shattenkirk buyout makes them do more maneuvering next offseason, and another opportunity to fuck it up.

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Stop moving the bar on the conversation. You can't go "that won't let us re-sign Kreider", then go "but the buyout's too big to re-sign Kreider", then go "BUT THAT DOESN'T SAVE MONEY" when it objectively ensures we save a ton this year.

 

welcome to real life. Decisions you make today, affect what you can do tomorrow.

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At the expense of a player, which FattyF has been saying.

 

Panarin costs you Shattenkirk buyout, which prevents them from signing a player, for example Kreider.

 

 

It makes more sense to trade Namestnikov for a pick, buyout Smith. The 2nd year of the Smith buyout is lower than the Girardi buy-out cap hit for 2019-20.

 

The goal of the next 2 seasons is to not fuck it up. Neither is ideal, but 1 has a lesser impact moving forward. The Shattenkirk buyout makes them do more maneuvering next offseason, and another opportunity to fuck it up.

 

It really doesn't though, but whatever helps you feel better. We'd have at the absolute minimum 6m in cap space (if like....every bonus hits) even with the Shattenkirk buyout, and I'd point back to the UFA list and ask who you'd want to give that kind of contract to in that group.

 

Shit....looking at that group, if I'm Kreider? Kreider might get 8M/Y on that market.

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welcome to real life. Decisions you make today, affect what you can do tomorrow.

 

I...uh....yeah? I mean, sure, whatever makes you feel better about being wrong. You said a thing. I proved thing isn't necessarily true. You said the same thing, I repeated, with proof, that you're wrong, then you made some comment about consequences.

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Just asking. This fan base is going to be ok with adding no players of substance for the next two years? Now your going to be patient? Patient after paying a guy 12 a year only to watch his prime years tick by until you find some cap room to surround him with some other adults. This should be fun to watch. Should last till the first good player is rumored on the market. This slam dunk will become a 50/50 argument by next summer.
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Just asking. This fan base is going to be ok with adding no players of substance for the next two years? Now your going to be patient? Patient after paying a guy 12 a year only to watch his prime years tick by until you find some cap room to surround him with some other adults. This should be fun to watch. Should last till the first good player is rumored on the market. This slam dunk will become a 50/50 argument by next summer.

 

Again, the goal is to win for the next decade. Panarin helps that cause.

 

To ensure that happens, a major factor is NOT fucking up capspace for the future. This season is NOT an issue. Next season, we might be getting there. Even more important is the following season.

 

Panarin doesnt change them into an automatic contender for NEXT season, and people continue to state that for you. They need to grow as a team, and that's what needs to happen the next 2 seasons to enter a long window of contending.

 

Again, DONT fuck up future cap space. This season is another season of growth for the organization.

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Just asking. This fan base is going to be ok with adding no players of substance for the next two years? Now your going to be patient? Patient after paying a guy 12 a year only to watch his prime years tick by until you find some cap room to surround him with some other adults. This should be fun to watch. Should last till the first good player is rumored on the market. This slam dunk will become a 50/50 argument by next summer.

 

Take a look at the 2020 UFA group.

 

The biggest names on that list are:

 

Backstrom, who will almost certainly stay with Washington

Pietrangelo, who will almost certainly stay with STL

Hall, who...might hit FA, though I doubt he will

Justin Schultz

Tyson Barrie - who will almost assuredly hit the market

Torey Krug - Probably staying with Boston

Mike Hoffman

Brayden Schenn

Chris Kreider

 

Once you suss out the group who will stay with their team, you've got a phenomenal bunch of mid-six players here - maybe top end mid-sixers, but mid-sixers. We shouldn't be splashing the cash on ANYONE in this group.

 

Also, it's not like we won't make trades, sign other players, draft, etc.

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Take a look at the 2020 UFA group.

 

The biggest names on that list are:

 

Backstrom, who will almost certainly stay with Washington

Pietrangelo, who will almost certainly stay with STL

Hall, who...might hit FA, though I doubt he will

Justin Schultz

Tyson Barrie - who will almost assuredly hit the market

Torey Krug - Probably staying with Boston

Mike Hoffman

Brayden Schenn

Chris Kreider

 

Once you suss out the group who will stay with their team, you've got a phenomenal bunch of mid-six players here - maybe top end mid-sixers, but mid-sixers. We shouldn't be splashing the cash on ANYONE in this group.

Also, it's not like we won't make trades, sign other players, draft, etc.

 

I dont think they will. It'd be another Brassard or Stepan-like trade. Clearing some cap for a change of scenery guy, on a RFA contract with upside. If it's Kreider, they need a big body coming back.

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I dont think they will. It'd be another Brassard or Stepan-like trade. Clearing some cap for a change of scenery guy, on a RFA contract with upside. If it's Kreider, they need a big body coming back.

 

Yup. Think that's about right.

 

It's why I'm not super worried about next seasons' cap - do what you gotta. I'm way more concerned with the 2021-22 cap, where we've got the first big wave of youngsters up for extensions.

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Just asking. This fan base is going to be ok with adding no players of substance for the next two years? Now your going to be patient? Patient after paying a guy 12 a year only to watch his prime years tick by until you find some cap room to surround him with some other adults. This should be fun to watch. Should last till the first good player is rumored on the market. This slam dunk will become a 50/50 argument by next summer.

 

One year, not two. And yes. The window for contention opens in 2020-21 earliest, but I'd be gunning hard at winning in 2021-22.

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Yup. Think that's about right.

 

It's why I'm not super worried about next seasons' cap - do what you gotta. I'm way more concerned with the 2021-22 cap, where we've got the first big wave of youngsters up for extensions.

 

I think 2020-21 is the bigger issue. And I think the Shattenkirk buyout compounds that issue.

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I think 2020-21 is the bigger issue. And I think the Shattenkirk buyout compounds that issue.

 

Why? Barring big extensions for Kreider and Strome, we're way in the clear next season even with a buyout. Do you just think it'll become such a huge issue across the league that having the cap space lets us leverage something we shouldn't be able to?

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Just asking. This fan base is going to be ok with adding no players of substance for the next two years? Now your going to be patient? Patient after paying a guy 12 a year only to watch his prime years tick by until you find some cap room to surround him with some other adults. This should be fun to watch. Should last till the first good player is rumored on the market. This slam dunk will become a 50/50 argument by next summer.

 

I am and I would hope the rest of the fanbase is good with it. Panarin is better than any option that will be available next summer, so it is still a no brainer to spend now and sit out next summer rather than the other way around.

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The big problem with buy outs is that there is a big hit in the second year, which would be 20-21, which is the year in which we can least take cap hits, with Hank and whatever bad contracts we don't buy out (among Shatty, Smith, and Staal) still on the books. This year is cap purgatory. Next year is cap Dante's Inferno.
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Why? Barring big extensions for Kreider and Strome, we're way in the clear next season even with a buyout. Do you just think it'll become such a huge issue across the league that having the cap space lets us leverage something we shouldn't be able to?

 

It’s the end of the bad-cap window. Need it to be over after that season. No kicking the can. No fast fixes to help the short term at the expense of future teams/cap.

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After today we remarkably have both the most expensive, (after Deangelo cost) and arguably worst, defensive personnel group in the NHL.

 

That's pretty impressive.

 

And it's entirely temporary and could change dramatically as soon as the second buyout window opens. It'll also transform completely by 2021 when Team Triple Shit (Shattenkirk, Staal, Smith) are all off the roster.

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And it's entirely temporary and could change dramatically as soon as the second buyout window opens. It'll also transform completely by 2021 when Team Triple Shit (Shattenkirk, Staal, Smith) are all off the roster.

 

As soon as we get redden, sorry Gomez sorry drury sorry Richards sorry Dan Boyle sorry girardi sorry Staal sorry Smith sorry shattenkirk off the roster. Going forward everything will be fine. The rangers never get burned by long term deals.

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And it's entirely temporary and could change dramatically as soon as the second buyout window opens. It'll also transform completely by 2021 when Team Triple Shit (Shattenkirk, Staal, Smith) are all off the roster.

 

Sure, but in the meantime it's beginning to appear like they'll have to paper over their sins with a buyout(s), or, dump some cheaper, controllable, guys like Deangelo or Buchnevich to make room for the new shiny toys.

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