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Thread: "Rangers will be diving into UFA waters,"

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil in Absentia View Post
    Most likely both. He and Kypreos have linked Panarin to the Rangers since the beginning, so there's plenty there to work with.
    I was just looking for new information, as opposed to what has been the dominant assumption since last summer. But yes, could be both.

  2. #22
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    Well, that assumption is based on rock-solid reporting from those two. But I'm not sure how much new has been added since outside of the Karlsson talk.
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    Wonder if the Rangers will look to add a Marleu-type. Calling Vesey and Kreider veterans is a bit of a stretch.
    GORTON 2020

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThirtyONE View Post
    Wonder if the Rangers will look to add a Marleu-type. Calling Vesey and Kreider veterans is a bit of a stretch.
    The only two who I think you can make a strong case for are Pavelski and Williams. Everyone else is either Doan'd (only willing to play for current team or retirement) or bad.
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  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin View Post
    Give me the road map to success that has worked for every team. Say they did tear it down to the studs and keep drafting relatively high. Has this been proven to be successful time and again? I understand you preaching patience. I get it. But like has been said over and over, Panarin is still young. This isn't bringing Brad Richards in at this point. This is bringing another player like Zibanejad in.

    There is more than one way to develop a winner. You're adamant that the only way is to keep reloading on youth. I think that, coupled with the right free agents, is the right way. Who knows which of us or either of us is right? Time will tell I guess.
    I’m fine with bringing free agents to supplement what they do have. I’m just not for 7 year commitments that more than likely carry no trade clauses. The fact is this team is building towards the future, not next year. That doesn’t mean I’m throwing away next season. If pavelski is looking to move I’d see him on a three or four year deal as ok if you want to add something. I’d be fine with zucc coming back again at 3 years or so. I’m not on board for tanking. I want to try and win every game and I agree that it would be beneficial to bring some solid guys in here.

    That is a far cry though from committing $11-12m a year for 7 years to guys. I want some clarity to what’s here. As of now they have really two guys that you can rely on being core guys going forward. I just think tying up that kind of money at this point is not smart. It won’t hurt the next three years or so but after that it might. Also it could possibly leave them out of the running to take advantage of a future situation that is unforeseen. Teams fall out favor for all kinds of reasons with really good players. Having the cap space is key to take advantage. When you commit 1/4 of you cap to two guys it really hinders your ability to capitalize on what’s to come. I know we can’t predict that. It’s hard for me to imagine the rangers committing to those too basically for the next decade. The rangers have entered into bad contract after bad contract. Right now the risk of that compared to the reward for the next three of fours years is overwhelming. By the time this team catches up to those two in terms of being ready, what will they be? Nobody can honestly answer that Karlsson or panarin four years from now will still be elite players. Yet they will be paid as such. It’s like installing new windows but glueing them shut
    Last edited by Fatfrancesa; 03-15-2019 at 05:02 PM.

  6. #26
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    All depends on the cap. With Lundqvist, Karlsson, & Panarinóplus Staal, Shattenkirk & Skjeiís cap hit how much cap will be left.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Fatfrancesa View Post
    Iím fine with bringing free agents to supplement what they do have. Iím just not for 7 year commitments that more than likely carry no trade clauses. The fact is this team is building towards the future, not next year. That doesnít mean Iím throwing away next season. If pavelski is looking to move Iíd see him on a three or four year deal as ok if you want to add something. Iíd be fine with zucc coming back again at 3 years or so. Iím not on board for tanking. I want to try and win every game and I agree that it would be beneficial to bring some solid guys in here.

    That is a far cry though from committing $11-12m a year for 7 years to guys. I want some clarity to whatís here. As of now they have really two guys that you can rely on being core guys going forward. I just think tying up that kind of money at this point is not smart. It wonít hurt the next three years or so but after that it might. Also it could possibly leave them out of the running to take advantage of a future situation that is unforeseen. Teams fall out favor for all kinds of reasons with really good players. Having the cap space is key to take advantage. When you commit 1/4 of you cap to two guys it really hinders your ability to capitalize on whatís to come. I know we canít predict that. Itís hard for me to imagine the rangers committing to those too basically for the next decade. The rangers have entered into bad contract after bad contract. Right now the risk of that compared to the reward for the next three of fours years is overwhelming. By the time this team catches up to those two in terms of being ready, what will they be? Nobody can honestly answer that Karlsson or panarin four years from now will still be elite players. Yet they will be paid as such. Itís like installing new windows but glueing them shut
    How is signing Pavelski from age 35-38 better than Panarin age 28-34?

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  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Long live the King View Post
    How is signing Pavelski from age 35-38 better than Panarin age 28-34?

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    It isn't. Not by a long shot. But in fairness it isn't 1 to 1. Pavelski might cost 6 per, Panarin 11 per.

    But I'd still rather Panarin at 11 than pavelski at 6 and say someone else like Zucc at 5 to make up the rest.

    We need quality over quantity here big time. For one we don't have a lot of quality. For two we don't want to clog the roster so our youth has a chance to step in and compete.

  9. #29
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    Pavelski is going to get 40 goals and 70+ points. He's going to cost a lot more than $6 million. More like $8 million.


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  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil in Absentia View Post
    Pavelski is going to get 40 goals and 70+ points. He's going to cost a lot more than $6 million. More like $8 million.


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    I didn't even look at his stats. Wow having quite a year for an oldie. Agreed. Will get closer to 8. So even worse to choose him over Panarin. That kind of signing would truly be a typical Rangers thing to do.

  11. #31
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    Is he really leaving SJ?

    Should go to Winnipeg, probably ends up in dallas or Florida.
    Lias Andersson for #AJT2019

  12. #32
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    Not sure. I'm just saying, if he does, it's not for $6 million.


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  13. #33
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    The reason it’s different is the term. Three or four years from now these kids have grown or not. Hopefully they are in contend mode and in a position to better evaluate their roster.

    Some of you guys ask how you can improve next year without signing two guys at $11-12m for 7 years and I give an example. Now you’re comparing the players as if that’s the point. The point is is that there are a lot of ways to improve short term without committing for 7 years. For the 1000th time Karlsson already can’t stay healthy and has had major injuries to his leg. The risk in signing him and hoping he’s still worth $12m in years 4-7 is ridiculous. We all agree this team isn’t winning when you all expect to get his best years. So we get a great ek and a bad team to then maybe a good team with an anchor contract in ek. No thanks

  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Long live the King View Post
    How is signing Pavelski from age 35-38 better than Panarin age 28-34?

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    You are trying to projecting what pavelski is in 5 months, while panarin 5 years. No difference you’re right. One gets three years the other 7. One gets a no trade for 7 years. No difference.

  15. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fatfrancesa View Post
    The reason itís different is the term. Three or four years from now these kids have grown or not. Hopefully they are in contend mode and in a position to better evaluate their roster.

    Some of you guys ask how you can improve next year without signing two guys at $11-12m for 7 years and I give an example. Now youíre comparing the players as if thatís the point. The point is is that there are a lot of ways to improve short term without committing for 7 years. For the 1000th time Karlsson already canít stay healthy and has had major injuries to his leg. The risk in signing him and hoping heís still worth $12m in years 4-7 is ridiculous. We all agree this team isnít winning when you all expect to get his best years. So we get a great ek and a bad team to then maybe a good team with an anchor contract in ek. No thanks
    The issue with the entire debate is that we can't have one off debates about single players in a silo. If you sign Panarin and Karlsson you instantly improve both your offense and defense and accelerate a rebuild. We're looking at being competitive the year after next instead of in 3-4 years. Panarin will be turning 30 and Karlsson 31. That's not terribly old, and you need vets.

    Is it unrealistic to expect Kravtsov to step right in and make in impact, probably. Is it equally unrealistic to think he won't make an impact the year after next...probably. Plus Chytil, Miller and Lindqvist, plus whomever we draft this year....Plus Zib, Krieder, ADA, Hajek...I mean we're not going to suck, there is quality there.

    And really gotta stop harping on NTCs. All that means is a player controls where he goes. It doesn't mean you can't trade him and get him off your books.

  16. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fatfrancesa View Post
    You are trying to projecting what pavelski is in 5 months, while panarin 5 years. No difference youíre right. One gets three years the other 7. One gets a no trade for 7 years. No difference.
    Pavelski would be a 35+ contract with a NMC. In the second year of a similar contract Marleau won't hit 20 goals.

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  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
    The issue with the entire debate is that we can't have one off debates about single players in a silo. If you sign Panarin and Karlsson you instantly improve both your offense and defense and accelerate a rebuild. We're looking at being competitive the year after next instead of in 3-4 years. Panarin will be turning 30 and Karlsson 31. That's not terribly old, and you need vets.

    Is it unrealistic to expect Kravtsov to step right in and make in impact, probably. Is it equally unrealistic to think he won't make an impact the year after next...probably. Plus Chytil, Miller and Lindqvist, plus whomever we draft this year....Plus Zib, Krieder, ADA, Hajek...I mean we're not going to suck, there is quality there.

    And really gotta stop harping on NTCs. All that means is a player controls where he goes. It doesn't mean you can't trade him and get him off your books.
    AND LIAS.

  18. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
    The issue with the entire debate is that we can't have one off debates about single players in a silo. If you sign Panarin and Karlsson you instantly improve both your offense and defense and accelerate a rebuild. We're looking at being competitive the year after next instead of in 3-4 years. Panarin will be turning 30 and Karlsson 31. That's not terribly old, and you need vets.

    Is it unrealistic to expect Kravtsov to step right in and make in impact, probably. Is it equally unrealistic to think he won't make an impact the year after next...probably. Plus Chytil, Miller and Lindqvist, plus whomever we draft this year....Plus Zib, Krieder, ADA, Hajek...I mean we're not going to suck, there is quality there.

    And really gotta stop harping on NTCs. All that means is a player controls where he goes. It doesn't mean you can't trade him and get him off your books.
    I’m fine with the opinion of wanting those guys. I get the allure of it to and the benefit. However the idea there is no other path forward is kind of ridiculous. I don’t think it’s a good idea. It’s my opinion and it’s based on watching this team for 30 plus years. Others differ, fine. We’ll see. I just don’t get the risk. Because they need to be thoughtful of where this team will be in years 4-7. They are the ones that sent the letter talking rebuild. So are the rebuilding or are they going heavy on high priced ufas this off season? If it’s business as usual then proceed. I would imagine the patience for these kids will wear thin because they will new star player windows.

  19. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by rmc51 View Post
    AND LIAS.
    "Everyone says you should be a good loser. If youíre a good loser, youíre a loser."
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  20. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by rmc51 View Post
    AND LIAS.
    Hoping he's moved before that, but more likely in AHL or SEL.

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