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Thread: Carp: Hayes to Jets, Heating Up?

  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Future View Post
    You don't need another NHL player next year, because you aren't trying to win next year. Niku's never even been an NHLer, how do you know it's a steep drop? He could be John Gilmour, for all we know.
    Yeah, we are either worried about rebuilding, or worried about having an NHL player next year. Niku doesnt seem to fit either, based on the current players signed for next year, and those coming through the system. He doesn't fill any need.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil in Absentia View Post
    I'd have a lot of interest in Niku.
    I'd be very interested in Niku as well.

    I'm on board with bringing in any quality young NHL/NHL-ready defensemen. But it should also mean doing anything that can be done to getting rid of the contracts that are currently on the books. Take on half or more of the cap hits - whatever it takes. Teams might actually be interested in Smith @ 1.5-2 million per season, or Shattenkirk at 2.5-3.5 million per season. Tired of these horrible veteran defensemen being put out on the ice. There is nothing to be gained from it.

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gravesy View Post
    You can add Nils Lundkvist to that pipeline as well.
    He's a righty, but yea.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Future View Post
    You don't need another NHL player next year, because you aren't trying to win next year. Niku's never even been an NHLer, how do you know it's a steep drop? He could be John Gilmour, for all we know.
    Well we do need to consider having NHL players at some point, don’t we? We can’t just suddenly flip 6 shitty Dmen for 6 nhlers. Even if next year isn’t a “go for it year.” Im at least hoping they’ll be done competing for last place.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThirtyONE View Post
    Well we do need to consider having NHL players at some point, don’t we? We can’t just suddenly flip 6 shitty Dmen for 6 nhlers. Even if next year isn’t a “go for it year.” Im at least hoping they’ll be done competing for last place.
    What's the point in not competing for last place next year? Unless they are serious buyers this offseason (which would make trading Hayes stupid), they won't be any more ready to make a playoff run than this year.

    The NHL players we need to consider are currently prospects in the system. Upgrading from Smith to Niku (or whoever) right now is meaningless.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Future View Post
    What's the point in not competing for last place next year? Unless they are serious buyers this offseason (which would make trading Hayes stupid), they won't be any more ready to make a playoff run than this year.

    The NHL players we need to consider are currently prospects in the system. Upgrading from Smith to Niku (or whoever) right now is meaningless.
    Maybe, maybe not. There are more top end forwards (Panarin, Stone, Duchene as of now) available in free agency that can replace Hayes' spot in the top 6 if the Rangers wanted to be serious buyers, more than good defensemen (Karlsson? and probably not a good idea anyway).

    I say this with a lot of hesitation regarding trading Hayes. I'd probably rather see them move others to relieve cap space and improve the defense, and then sign Hayes.

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by rmc51 View Post
    Maybe, maybe not. There are more top end forwards (Panarin, Stone, Duchene as of now) available in free agency that can replace Hayes' spot in the top 6 if the Rangers wanted to be serious buyers, more than good defensemen (Karlsson? and probably not a good idea anyway).

    I say this with a lot of hesitation regarding trading Hayes. I'd probably rather see them move others to relieve cap space and improve the defense, and then sign Hayes.
    Well Panarin and Stone are wingers and don't replace Hayes. I guess you could make the argument that Duchene is an upgrade but he'll be 29 starting next year and almost certainly be more expensive than Hayes.

    But you're talking about completely overhauling the offense and defense in one offseason. I guess they could do it, but to make any significant progress on the defensive side they'd have to move out a ton of assets. It's not nearly as viable, long term, as patience.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Future View Post
    Well Panarin and Stone are wingers and don't replace Hayes. I guess you could make the argument that Duchene is an upgrade but he'll be 29 starting next year and almost certainly be more expensive than Hayes.

    But you're talking about completely overhauling the offense and defense in one offseason. I guess they could do it, but to make any significant progress on the defensive side they'd have to move out a ton of assets. It's not nearly as viable, long term, as patience.
    No, they wouldn't be direct replacements for Hayes. I would envision Chytil moving back to his natural position at center on the 2nd line. They would take Chytil's vacant winger spot.

    I wouldn't consider a Hayes swap for a good young defenseman with upside, followed by a signing of Panarin, a complete overhaul...but it would be an improvement on both sides of the puck?

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    Quote Originally Posted by rmc51 View Post
    No, they wouldn't be direct replacements for Hayes. I would envision Chytil moving back to his natural position at center on the 2nd line. They would take Chytil's vacant winger spot.

    I wouldn't consider a Hayes swap for a good young defenseman with upside, followed by a signing of Panarin, a complete overhaul...but it would be an improvement on both sides of the puck?
    That seems like a pretty lateral move. Not sure how you're better by doing that, and it's also really risky to assume that Chytil can be a top-6 C next year.

    That's improbable to the point of being nearly impossible. Teams don't trade "good young defensemen with upside" who singlehandedly change the complexion of a defense, not to the extent that the Rangers don't already have in their pipe, and especially not for a rental.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Future View Post
    That seems like a pretty lateral move. Not sure how you're better by doing that, and it's also really risky to assume that Chytil can be a top-6 C next year.

    That's improbable to the point of being nearly impossible. Teams don't trade "good young defensemen with upside" who singlehandedly change the complexion of a defense, not to the extent that the Rangers don't already have in their pipe, and especially not for a rental.
    I didn't say that. But it could be a defenseman who gets us started in the right direction and can become a part of the long term solution.

    Hayes -> Panarin is not even close to a lateral move.

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    Bob McKenzie
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    NYR getting good action on Zuccarello. Could go for a second rounder and a prospect perhaps. If the return on Kevin Hayes is soft, I could see NYR keeping him and trying to sign him. McQuad will go for at least what they gave up: 4th and 7th rders


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    Quote Originally Posted by rmc51 View Post
    I didn't say that. But it could be a defenseman who gets us started in the right direction and can become a part of the long term solution.

    Hayes -> Panarin is not even close to a lateral move.
    It's lateral in the sense that you've filled one hole and created another. Yes, Panarin is a much better player than Hayes, but is your team really better if you are giving a #3c top-6 minutes?

  13. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Future View Post
    It's lateral in the sense that you've filled one hole and created another. Yes, Panarin is a much better player than Hayes, but is your team really better if you are giving a #3c top-6 minutes?
    It's not all about being a playoff contender next year. To me it is about being that 2-3 years from now. At that point, yes I'd hedge my bets that Panarin is still better than Hayes and Chytil grows into a 2C. Doesn't have to happen in 1 year for Chytil.

  14. #54
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    Carp: Hayes to Jets, Heating Up?

    Joe Fortunato
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    Talked about this on the pod this week, but the Hayes market probably goes from soft to red-hot the moment Duchene moves. Teams who missed out on him are going to gun hard to not miss on Hayes, and that's fine, too. Friedman speculated that with Columbus.

    Joe Fortunato
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    Hayes makes almost too much sense for Columbus. Bigger body Torts covets, can help down the middle, could replace some offense if they do move on from Panarin ...
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    Quote Originally Posted by rmc51 View Post
    It's not all about being a playoff contender next year. To me it is about being that 2-3 years from now. At that point, yes I'd hedge my bets that Panarin is still better than Hayes and Chytil grows into a 2C. Doesn't have to happen in 1 year for Chytil.
    I guess I just don't like putting the team in a situation where Chytil HAS to be a 2c. That's a lot of eggs in one basket and, if it doesn't work, then you're trying to trade for Hayes later on anyway.

  16. #56
    Senior Member Pee-Wee Division Mr.wiskers's Avatar
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    Now that Zuccs if off to Dallas. It’s Hayes turn. The rumor of Nashville being interested has been brought up. Could we get Dante Fabbro( 2016 1st Rd pick), David Farrance ( 2017 3rd Rd pick) & Patrick Harper (2016 5th Rd pick) for Hayes. All 3 were coached by Quinn last year at BU, and are actually still playing at BU this year—Quinn should have a 1st Hans scouting report on all 3.


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  17. #57
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    Since we only got picks for Zucc, I hope we get an actual player out of this deal, wherever he lands.

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    Rebuild Mode.

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    Senior Member Pee-Wee Division Mr.wiskers's Avatar
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    Carp: Hayes to Jets, Heating Up?

    Saw a rumor where it says we are interested in Andrew Mangiapane and Juuso Villimaki. Neither one seems to be impressive.


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    Last edited by Mr.wiskers; 02-24-2019 at 04:16 PM.

  20. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.wiskers View Post
    Saw a rumor where it says we are interested in Andrew Mangiapane and Juuso Villimaki. Neither one seems to be impressive.


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    Rumor from where? This isn't how we share reports here. Please link to the tweet or at least reference who sent it.


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