Page 16 of 40 FirstFirst ... 6141516171826 ... LastLast
Results 301 to 320 of 789

Thread: The New Political Thread: New Rules; New Attitude

  1. #301
    ContraQuinndicated BSBH Prospect
    G1000's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    16,611
    Rep Power
    152
    Quote Originally Posted by rmc51 View Post
    You can word it however you want. It's still supporting a 3rd trimester abortion.

    At best you are massaging the words to make it sound less reprehensible. Intentional misrepresentation to deceive the masses.
    First, lets understand that third trimester abortions account for a fraction of a fraction of 1% of all abortions. Acting as if there's a group of people out there wanting to freely and openly "murder babies" is fallacious. It's neither statistically supported, nor legally supported - even the most liberal legislation doesn't allow for third trimester abortion unless the mother's life is overtly threatened, because it's not a moral thing to do.

    Now - both of these laws are inexorably linked to the health of the woman or the viability of the fetus. Saying it's blanket support for third-trimester abortions is manipulative and deliberately deceptive, doubly so since (in the case of the NY law) 24 weeks isn't third trimester, but hey, let's not split hairs on words, right?

    The Virginia law is vaguely worded, but it's still "if baby is going to die or mother's life is at risk". Bluntly, I think it's a political stunt so that one side can point and say "they hate babies" and the other can say "they don't care if women live or die"

    I'd argue this - politicians are not qualified to tell doctors how to save lives - and neither are we. If a mother must make the choice between her life and her child's life, if a doctor has to make a choice to save the life of her patient in exchange for the life of her other patient (as is the case in all third trimester abortions by law, by proposed law, and the stance of the democratic party in the case of third trimester abortions), that's unimaginable to me. It's wildly emotionally painful.
    Hidden Content
    Blueshirts Brotherhood. We do what we must because we can - for the good of all Rangerkind

  2. #302
    Moderator BSBH Prospect
    Puck Head's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    North Pole
    Posts
    10,987
    Rep Power
    139
    Late term abortions concern me about as much as “assault” rifles.

    Each comprise about 1% of the debatable issue, yet garner 90% of the attention.


    Sent from my iPhone using Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile app powered by Tapatalk

  3. #303
    Senior Member Squirt Division NY Chief's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Posts
    392
    Rep Power
    19
    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post

    Women's right to choose ≠ pro abortion.
    Women's right to choose...…….abortion or no abortion?

  4. #304
    The future is spelled K-A-K-K-O BSBH Legend
    Phil in Absentia's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Brooklyn, NY
    Posts
    86,363
    Rep Power
    459
    Quote Originally Posted by NY Chief View Post
    Women's right to choose...…….abortion or no abortion?
    What does this even mean?

    You seriously need to improve your post quality in this thread. We can't go through this again.
    "Everyone says you should be a good loser. If you’re a good loser, you’re a loser."
    - John Tortorella


    "Never be a spectator of unfairness or stupidity. Seek out argument and disputation for their own sake; the grave will supply plenty of time for silence."
    - Christopher Hitchens

  5. #305
    Senior Member Junior Division
    BlairBettsBlocksEverything's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    6,294
    Rep Power
    82
    a pro-abortion argument I've heard that I find interesting.

    Under no circumstance is someone legally obligated to donate their organs to someone else. If someone came to you and said person X needs a new kidney and you are a perfect match, are you obligated to donate your kidney? It's your choice. You very well may want to. But it's your choice to.

    I understand being against abortion and I support people's right to be against it. It's a touchy subject that people have strong feelings about. But what I don't support is factually wrong arguments that boil down to 'libtards want to kill babies' when it's simply not true. The instances of late term abortion only deal in terms of a fetus not being viable or risking the mother's life.

    What I also can't support is the hypocrisy from the right on this issue. the same people who want to end abortions in every form are the same who will deny access to birth control and other forms of contraceptives. Having available contraception has drastically reduced the abortion rate. https://www.self.com/story/abortion-...administration
    __________________________________

  6. #306
    Senior Member Squirt Division NY Chief's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Posts
    392
    Rep Power
    19
    Quote Originally Posted by Phil in Absentia View Post
    What does this even mean?

    You seriously need to improve your post quality in this thread. We can't go through this again.
    Through what again?

    Pete said “Women's right to choose ≠ pro abortion.”
    I was questioning the circular logic of the "right to choose" to have an abortion or not have abortion is exactly choose = abortion

  7. #307
    The future is spelled K-A-K-K-O BSBH Legend
    Phil in Absentia's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Brooklyn, NY
    Posts
    86,363
    Rep Power
    459
    Quote Originally Posted by NY Chief View Post
    Through what again?

    Pete said “Women's right to choose ≠ pro abortion.”
    I was questioning the circular logic of the "right to choose" to have an abortion or not have abortion is exactly choose = abortion
    Through dragging more than a sentence out of you at a time. It makes conversations impossible to navigate. I'm not asking for an essay, but we've had it with the sniping from the rafters thing. Take stances. Answer questions (with more than questions, or whataboutism). What you said above it a thosuand times more clear than what you initially posted, for example, and didn't require a novel.

    Basically, be more concise so we're not constantly having to pull the car over to ask you for clarification.
    "Everyone says you should be a good loser. If you’re a good loser, you’re a loser."
    - John Tortorella


    "Never be a spectator of unfairness or stupidity. Seek out argument and disputation for their own sake; the grave will supply plenty of time for silence."
    - Christopher Hitchens

  8. #308
    Senior Member Bantam Division
    rmc51's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Posts
    1,545
    Rep Power
    67
    Quote Originally Posted by Puck Head View Post
    Late term abortions concern me about as much as “assault” rifles.

    Each comprise about 1% of the debatable issue, yet garner 90% of the attention.


    Sent from my iPhone using Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile app powered by Tapatalk
    While I would also look to the assault rifle topic here, I would do so with a completely different context. I do find assault rifle deaths concerning, despite the low percentages amongst gun violence. And I do find late term abortions concerning, despite the low percentages amongst abortions.

    Using statistics to guide a moral compass isn't something I'm going to adhere to. Wrong is wrong. Using the "Yeah but it only happens x times out of 100" is very poor justification for something that simply isn't right.

    Sent from my [device_name] using http://Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile...ed by Tapatalk

  9. #309
    The future is spelled K-A-K-K-O BSBH Legend
    Phil in Absentia's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Brooklyn, NY
    Posts
    86,363
    Rep Power
    459
    So, too, then, is holding it up as a national alarm if you're not also doing so with a major caveat — that "it only happens X times out of 100."

    The national reaction when this is not done is often wholly disproportionate to the problem, which is a problem.
    "Everyone says you should be a good loser. If you’re a good loser, you’re a loser."
    - John Tortorella


    "Never be a spectator of unfairness or stupidity. Seek out argument and disputation for their own sake; the grave will supply plenty of time for silence."
    - Christopher Hitchens

  10. #310
    Senior Member Bantam Division
    rmc51's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Posts
    1,545
    Rep Power
    67
    Quote Originally Posted by Phil in Absentia View Post
    So, too, then, is holding it up as a national alarm if you're not also doing so with a major caveat — that "it only happens X times out of 100."

    The national reaction when this is not done is often wholly disproportionate to the problem, which is a problem.
    Yeah, but neither of those problems is the same as, say, talking about how to eliminate people stealing $20 worth of groceries at WalMart. These problems revolve around the loss of human life, and therefore the magnitude of the problem is greater regardless of the percentages.

    Sort of off topic, but appllicable here. That's why Boeing pulled their 737 Max 8 airplanes after a 2nd crash in a year, despite the incredibly low percentages of that plane crashing over the course of it's history. The magnitude is obviously different.





    Sent from my [device_name] using http://Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile...ed by Tapatalk

  11. #311
    HNIC BSBH Legend
    Pete's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    77,110
    Rep Power
    532
    Quote Originally Posted by NY Chief View Post
    Through what again?

    Pete said “Women's right to choose ≠ pro abortion.”
    I was questioning the circular logic of the "right to choose" to have an abortion or not have abortion is exactly choose = abortion
    It's simple. I support a woman's right to make a choice about her family and body. Just because I would not support an abortion in my own own, doesn't give me the right to push those beliefs on anyone else.

    I'm confused as to why that's a hard concept to get.

  12. #312
    Senior Member Bantam Division
    rmc51's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Posts
    1,545
    Rep Power
    67
    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
    It's simple. I support a woman's right to make a choice about her family and body. Just because I would not support an abortion in my own own, doesn't give me the right to push those beliefs on anyone else.

    I'm confused as to why that's a hard concept to get.
    At some point it's about a human life and not a woman's choice. Previously it had been if the fetus was dependent on remaining within the mother's womb. Now it has begun to branch past that. Are you good with the mother having the choice if a single toe remains in the vaginal canal?

    Sent from my [device_name] using http://Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile...ed by Tapatalk

  13. #313
    HNIC BSBH Legend
    Pete's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    77,110
    Rep Power
    532
    Quote Originally Posted by rmc51 View Post
    At some point it's about a human life and not a woman's choice. Previously it had been if the fetus was dependent on remaining within the mother's womb. Now it has begun to branch past that. Are you good with the mother having the choice if a single toe remains in the vaginal canal?

    Sent from my [device_name] using http://Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile...ed by Tapatalk
    It doesn't matter what I think, that's the point. Everyone believes something different. You have to ask the owner of the vaginal canal.

  14. #314
    Senior Member Bantam Division
    rmc51's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Posts
    1,545
    Rep Power
    67
    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
    It doesn't matter what I think, that's the point. Everyone believes something different. You have to ask the owner of the vaginal canal.
    So what if the baby is fully removed? I guess that's not your problem either. At some point a moral compass must kick in, or you would be ok with murder in general.

    Sent from my [device_name] using http://Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile...ed by Tapatalk

  15. #315
    HNIC BSBH Legend
    Pete's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    77,110
    Rep Power
    532
    Quote Originally Posted by rmc51 View Post
    So what if the baby is fully removed? I guess that's not your problem either. At some point a moral compass must kick in, or you would be ok with murder in general.

    Sent from my [device_name] using http://Blueshirts Brotherhood mobile...ed by Tapatalk
    Not everyone's moral compass is the same.

    I find it ironic that the party of "don't have big government tell me how to live my life! " Wants government to tell folks how to live their lives.

    Look up how abortion became a party line issue. Has nothing to do with human lives.

  16. #316
    Senior Member Bantam Division
    rmc51's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Posts
    1,545
    Rep Power
    67
    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
    Not everyone's moral compass is the same.

    I find it ironic that the party of "don't have big government tell me how to live my life! " Wants government to tell folks how to live their lives.

    Look up how abortion became a party line issue. Has nothing to do with human lives.
    You didn't answer the question.

  17. #317
    HNIC BSBH Legend
    Pete's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    77,110
    Rep Power
    532
    Quote Originally Posted by rmc51 View Post
    You didn't answer the question.
    I already did. What I'm good with doesn't matter. My morals aren't everyone's morals.

    The entire point of "rights". There are 1,000 ways I can spin this. What are you doing about babies dying in Afghanistan or Rwanda?

  18. #318
    Senior Member Bantam Division
    rmc51's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Posts
    1,545
    Rep Power
    67
    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
    I already did. What I'm good with doesn't matter. My morals aren't everyone's morals.

    The entire point of "rights". There are 1,000 ways I can spin this. What are you doing about babies dying in Afghanistan or Rwanda?
    Nope. You didn't. At some point it does in fact become murder.

  19. #319
    Senior Member Mite Division Bieser's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    148
    Rep Power
    9
    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
    Not everyone's moral compass is the same.

    I find it ironic that the party of "don't have big government tell me how to live my life! " Wants government to tell folks how to live their lives.

    Look up how abortion became a party line issue. Has nothing to do with human lives.
    Prior to Roe v Wade I imagine they wanted the government to stay out of it or leave it as it was.

    But the real answer is they see abortion differently than you do. What you call “how to live their lives” they call taking a life. Now you can disagree with that, but the hypocrisy is removed to a point.

    It’s not big government to want the law to say stealing is wrong is it?
    In 1994 I thought I could die in peace...now I'm hungry again.

  20. #320
    Senior Member Junior Division
    BlairBettsBlocksEverything's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    6,294
    Rep Power
    82
    the law in new york that allows any late term abortions only allows it in instances where the fetus is not viable, or the mothers life is at risk.

    Is it humane to force a woman to deliver a baby that is going to die when it comes out anyway? Is it humane to expect a woman to allow herself to die for a fetus that might not live anyway?
    __________________________________

Page 16 of 40 FirstFirst ... 6141516171826 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •