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Thread: Islanders Reacquire F Matt Martin from Leafs for G Eamon McAdam

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil in Absentia View Post
    I don't need to clarify what I said. It was perfectly succinct.

    But I'll try an even more terse version: cheer for better efforts, hope for a lottery pick.
    It was precisely your succinctness that led to the invitation to discuss and explain your thinking, with considerations to specific realities. I thought this subject and your opinion deserved more discussion. Is there a better place to engage smart fans like you on this, than your discussion forum? Apparently, you took it another way and would rather not elaborate on some of the considerations mentioned.

  2. #42
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    Islanders Reacquire F Matt Martin from Leafs for G Eamon McAdam

    Quote Originally Posted by Giacomin View Post
    It was precisely your succinctness that led to the invitation to discuss and explain your thinking, with considerations to specific realities. I thought this subject and your opinion deserved more discussion. Is there a better place to engage smart fans like you on this, than your discussion forum? Apparently, you took it another way and would rather not elaborate on some of the considerations mentioned.
    It's self-explanatory. But since you want me to over explain, fine:

    I expect to see better effort on the ice this season and next. More physical. More in your face. Better driving to the net, and better response to not having the puck (no more peeling off and giving up volume chances against to spring odd man rushes the other way). I want relentless puck pursuits and relentless forecheck.

    I also want them to lose more than they win because for all they've done right regarding this rebuild, they still have, maybe, one game-breaking talent on the way (Kravtsov). They need more. They need Jack Hughes. Given how unlikely it is they'll be a playoff team this season, especially if they trade Zuccarello and/or Spooner, I want them to embrace the tank on a short-term plan to inject the roster with high-end talent. And I mean high. As in taken in the top-five, if not top-three, or the draft. If they can do that this season, they can go into the following maybe being a playoff team, but probably still one year away from contention, similar to the Leafs. Tap free agency and trades and boom — 2020/2021 Cup contender.

    I didn't think this needed to be spelled out, but does this sufficiently answer your question? Oh. And no, I'm not rethinking it. This is, mathematically speaking, the most likely route to building a quality contender with balance throughout. Nearly every Cup winning team proves it, to varying degrees.


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  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil in Absentia View Post
    It's self-explanatory. But since you want me to over explain, fine:

    I expect to see better effort on the ice this season and next. More physical. More in your face. Better driving to the net, and better response to not having the puck (no more peeling off and giving up volume chances against to spring odd man rushes the other way). I want relentless puck pursuits and relentless forecheck.

    I also want them to lose more than they win because for all they've done right regarding this rebuild, they still have, maybe, one game-breaking talent on the way (Kravtsov). They need more. They need Jack Hughes. Given how unlikely it is they'll be a playoff team this season, especially if they trade Zuccarello and/or Spooner, I want them to embrace the tank on a short-term plan to inject the roster with high-end talent. And I mean high. As in taken in the top-five, if not top-three, or the draft. If they can do that this season, they can go into the following maybe being a playoff team, but probably still one year away from contention, similar to the Leafs. Tap free agency and trades and boom — 2020/2021 Cup contender.

    I didn't think this needed to be spelled out, but does this sufficiently answer your question? Oh. And no, I'm not rethinking it. This is, mathematically speaking, the most likely route to building a quality contender with balance throughout. Nearly every Cup winning team proves it, to varying degrees.
    Appreciate you taking the time. Didn't want to eat up your time on the self-explanatory. It is the deeper more interesting issues regarding a total tank, that I'm curious if people consider. Here's a list. Not trying to suck you into a long debate or anything like it.

    1. Is it really a viable/good strategy? Even the worst record only gets 16% odds for #1, most likely #4 (at 50%). The odds weren't remote like this for Pitt or Chicago or Wash. Having the worst record is tough to do and trying for it is a gamble.

    2. If we are atrocious, slot #3 is still a longshot and would be good fortune. This year, a great draft, we choose the same prospect at #3, #6, #9, or #11. How much does it really matter to the Rangers?

    3. With odds so low, is it really worth the pain for all? What about the concerning lack of progress and lack of individual and coaching successes it would mean? Is it worth your time to cheer for that? Is it worth the negativity, bad vibe, unintended consequences for a questionable return?

    4. Is this really Ranger mgmt's plan? They say no. So if we are not trying to tank, isn't it a bad sign if our team is horrific? Isn't it foreboding to know we assessed our talent so inaccurately? Aren't the fans rooting for an immediate tank in conflict with our mgmt, coaches and players approach? This seems different than Toronto (where fans and mgmt were on the same page) and the rules were different.

    5. Is losing more than most any other team good for our players and coaches? Does losing breed losing? How much does it effect confidence long term or impact certain individuals?

    6. If guys play well (which should result in more wins than you want) doesn't that give us something to build from and bode well? Doesn't it improve some of our assets trade value?

    7. Is it even sporting?

    8. Love Hughes, agree he would really launch us. A #1 OA should do that. Yet, might other great players be found outside the Top 10. Plenty of guys who are their team's most valuable asset currently:

    Guys like Kuz at #26, or at #16 there's Barzal and Tarasenko. #15 for Karlsson. #11 for Kopitar and Forsberg. #38 for Josi. #46 for Subban. #22 for Giroux. #58 for Kucherov. #158 for Benn. #20 for Burns. #25 for Paternck. #45 for Bergeron #30 for Rakell.

    Let alone all stars or budding stars that went in the 3rd round or beyond like Gaudreau, Ghost, Klingberg, Guentzal, Point, Trochek, Yandle, Letang, Marchand, Pavelski, Panarin

  4. #44
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    The lottery is even more incentive to gamble. You don't need to finish dead last to potentially win big.

  5. #45
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    It's too early to talk about the lottery.

    Hope that the team plays hard and lays some foundation and *culture* to build upon. Think the Renney Rangers.

  6. #46
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    Team: Play hard, improve over the course of the season

    Fans: If ^^ happens, accept the result win or loss

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