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Thread: Rangers Re-Sign F Vladislav Namestnikov to 2-Year/$8M Extension; $4M AAV

  1. #41
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    while i always hope for the best I'm not under the illusion that the Rangers just brought the next Lombardi in here. Time will tell what Quinn is and will be. He will fuck up along the way and will see if he learns from his mistakes.

    Unless he's a real zero, he will probably get a pretty long leash from Gorts/Drury.

    I'll reserve judgement on the Vlad signing. Fresh start. See how he fits in.
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    I don't think anyone's saying players who aren't putting out or not performin should stay in the lineup.
    The hope is that Quinn, as opposed to AV, won't crucify the young players for mistakes young players make.
    It's pretty well established that, under AV, a certain set of veterans could be brutal for weeks on end and still stay in the lineup whereas young players were given next to no rope.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gravesy View Post
    I don't think anyone's saying players who aren't putting out or not performin should stay in the lineup.
    The hope is that Quinn, as opposed to AV, won't crucify the young players for mistakes young players make.
    It's pretty well established that, under AV, a certain set of veterans could be brutal for weeks on end and still stay in the lineup whereas young players were given next to no rope.
    Let me preface this by saying AV is an idiot.

    That said, this isn't a coaching issue as much as it's an organizational issue. AV's teams were trying to win. Quinn's teams are trying to develop and teach...therefore a completely different mindset.

    Not saying that excuses any of AV's decisions, he played the guys he thought gave him the best chance to win (and a lot of the time he was wrong), but Quinn doesn't have any pressure to win on him.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Long live the King View Post
    No one said anything about allowing players to be lazy. Its not about accepting losing, its about demanding hard work and improvement. The goal is to have the players buy in and get better every game, win or lose.
    That's what any coach would do.
    That's what AV did.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
    Let me preface this by saying AV is an idiot.

    That said, this isn't a coaching issue as much as it's an organizational issue. AV's teams were trying to win. Quinn's teams are trying to develop and teach...therefore a completely different mindset.

    Not saying that excuses any of AV's decisions, he played the guys he thought gave him the best chance to win (and a lot of the time he was wrong), but Quinn doesn't have any pressure to win on him.
    Of course there is pressure. At the NHL level, there is no such thing as no pressure.

    Expected to be a contender/playoff bound? Not really.
    Pressure to develop kids and start to sort out which ones will be successful and which wont? Absolutely
    He's not going to settle for losing, just because the kids are young.
    And he's not going to allow sloppy play and mental mistakes because they are "rebuilding".
    Lias Andersson for #AJT2019

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    Quote Originally Posted by josh View Post
    Of course there is pressure. At the NHL level, there is no such thing as no pressure.

    Expected to be a contender/playoff bound? Not really.
    Pressure to develop kids and start to sort out which ones will be successful and which wont? Absolutely
    He's not going to settle for losing, just because the kids are young.
    And he's not going to allow sloppy play and mental mistakes because they are "rebuilding".
    Well, that's why I said there is no pressure to win.

    He won't be judged (or, shouldn't be), by the W/L column.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
    Well, that's why I said there is no pressure to win.

    He won't be judged (or, shouldn't be), by the W/L column.
    Probably not.

    I mentioned the wins for his own pride. You dont get to the NHL level with being ok with losing (even during a rebuild)
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
    Let me preface this by saying AV is an idiot.

    That said, this isn't a coaching issue as much as it's an organizational issue. AV's teams were trying to win. Quinn's teams are trying to develop and teach...therefore a completely different mindset.

    Not saying that excuses any of AV's decisions, he played the guys he thought gave him the best chance to win (and a lot of the time he was wrong), but Quinn doesn't have any pressure to win on him.
    I agree for the most part, which is why it's perfectly fair to assume young players will get plenty of rope under Quinn.
    I don't think you can file all of AV's favoritism under organizational issues though. He clearly had a massive blindspot when it came to young players vs his favorite vets.

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    Quote Originally Posted by josh View Post
    Probably not.

    I mentioned the wins for his own pride. You dont get to the NHL level with being ok with losing (even during a rebuild)
    100%.

    He needs to deal with short terms "wins" versus the long game.

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    If I ever see/hear a soundbite out of Quinns mouth saying its more about development than wins, he should be run out on a rail immediately.

    we know what this is. that being said winning is always the only thing that matters.
    Acqua in bocca

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    No, it isn't. If you're honestly rebuilding—and the Rangers have given us no reason to disbelieve this—then development is what matters most. They're not going to scoff at wins, but I would imagine management is more than OK with not earning many of them for a while.


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    Quinn understands what he's here for and why he was hired, even if fans don't.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ozzy View Post
    I like this deal. I'm ok with Namesnikov. That term and dollar amount is not a problem by any means and I think this guy has some good skill in him. He fits the bill for young and can actually play center. Again, I know this year is going to be the first year of a rebuild which amounts to a lot of growing pains.

    No worries....

    I just don't wanna see the Rangers start clogging up the roster with experienced dog shit....or just to bring in "experience". If anything, I hope they bring in an enforcer to keep the douche-baggery at a minimum. I don't want teams taking shots at our young guys while their still growing and learning.

    Once these kids have matured and have some road miles under them.....THEN we can peel off some of the dogs.
    Sounds like a fair strategy to me.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Giacomin View Post
    Phil, the two year deal won't preclude the rangers from signing him to a new contract in a year or year and a half, if he performs and fits well. Also, if he impresses and we are sellers, he becomes more than a rental. He is a versatile C and plays 200'. The acquiring team knows he'll be willing to reup since he would have been on 3 teams in less than 2 years. We could easily turn Names into a 1st + if he performs.

    Late addition: With the new contract, Names is worth more now than he was yesterday. Both net worth and around the NHL.
    Good enough.

    We made the big trade — JTMiller — we better kick thetyresthoroughly, or else!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Long live the King View Post
    No one said anything about allowing players to be lazy. Its not about accepting losing, its about demanding hard work and improvement. The goal is to have the players buy in and get better every game, win or lose.

    This percent
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    Quote Originally Posted by Respecttheblue View Post
    Sounds like a fair strategy to me.
    You see where I'm coming from right Blue?

    Guys always seem to play a little "bigger" when there's some toughness around them. It kinda rubs off on the team, and I believe if these young guys grow up in that type of environment it's going to catch on that they can play tough, and be very effective in doing so. I think intimidation has it's place in the NHL, even though no one on a broadcast seems to want to admit it.

    I'm hoping we can protect our guys while they're growing into themselves. By the time they're ready to really take flight they should be fully mature and know how to handle themselves.

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    Enough of AV, it was past time he went. He's gone; it's over.

    Back to Namestnikov.

    While his end of season play here was disappointing, I hope this team can put some scoring around him.
    Pity we don't have a lot of finishers to go around.

    On that note, I hope some players can get out of the horrible habit of making "one more pass" and relinquishing the element of surprise on the goalie. Maybe they'd finish more and surprise themselves.

    -- dives of varying depths on Namestnikov can be found here (interesting reading):

    https://www.rawcharge.com/2017/7/27/...ally-analytics

    and here:

    https://www.rawcharge.com/2018/2/26/...-a-remembrence

    Star players like Nikita Kucherov and Ondrej Palat achieve much better results with Namestnikov than without him. In both cases, the shot generation is similar but the shot suppression is much better with Vladdy on their line. If we’re trying to tie all of the information in this post together to understand those results, we might surmise that Vladdy’s skill in exiting the defensive zone and in transition helps boost the shot suppression numbers.

    That thought process might give us an indication of why the Kucherov, Namestnikov, Steven Stamkos line was so successful. Perhaps a player who is happy to bear the burden of defensive zone work and starting the transition game without needing the puck in the offensive zone is an ideal fit with two offensive dynamos like Stamkos and Kucherov.
    https://www.rawcharge.com/2017/7/27/...ally-analytics
    Quote Originally Posted by Ozzy View Post
    You see where I'm coming from right Blue?

    Guys always seem to play a little "bigger" when there's some toughness around them. It kinda rubs off on the team, and I believe if these young guys grow up in that type of environment it's going to catch on that they can play tough, and be very effective in doing so. I think intimidation has it's place in the NHL, even though no one on a broadcast seems to want to admit it.

    I'm hoping we can protect our guys while they're growing into themselves. By the time they're ready to really take flight they should be fully mature and know how to handle themselves.
    On that score, yes I agree. I think it helps some of them play a little braver and bigger.
    And I also think up and down the lineup we need players who inherently have lionhearts not kitty kat hearts, and who don't back away from being first to the puck, or whatever it takes.

    On that score, even though he does sometimes "look like his puppy died," Namestnikov, may not be as meek as some folks think:

    TBL's Rawcharge site's epitaph for Namestnikov said,

    For a player that is listed at a generous 6’0” and 170 lbs., he takes no quarter from anyone on the ice. If there is a scrum on the ice, most likely he’ll be involved in it and he’s not afraid to drop the gloves from time to time (hockey fights has him competing in 6 career fights during his NHL tenure).
    https://www.rawcharge.com/2018/2/26/...-a-remembrence
    https://youtu.be/uSTfN8mI_OE


    I hope they give Namestnikov the best chance possible here, but our lack of "finishers" does not bode well unless others up their scoring game.

    As for the role you were talking about, someone to keep the league's dirty guys more honest, I was hoping we'd get Matt Martin, and revisiting Cody McLeod is not at all what I expected, but thsoe are the cards we are dealt.
    Last edited by Respecttheblue; 07-24-2018 at 11:20 AM.
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    I like this kid, Blue. He has talent...he seems to have some heart too....let's see what he's got this year. I'm very curious to see a lot of these guys this season.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ozzy View Post
    I like this kid, Blue. He has talent...he seems to have some heart too....let's see what he's got this year. I'm very curious to see a lot of these guys this season.
    I agree Ozzy he had a few moments last year, but really tough to tell his true worth. It must've been tough being traded for the first time and then leaving a top tier playoff team to a team not going anywhere, so his psyche must have been shot.
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  20. #60
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    Namestnikov is, in a lot of ways, the exact kind of player you want at his price tag on a rebuilding team entering year one. He's a work ethic prototype, even if the points won't accumulate the way they did running shotgun to Kucherov and Stamkos. And he's ultimately an asset to be flipped, either this year or next before he's UFA eligible. In the interim he can give you great effort, if not good results, which can hopefully have a spillover effect on the young pups.
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