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Thread: How Rangers Can Improve Toughness This Summer

  1. #21
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    What kind of package does a player like Kreider fetch
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vodka Drunkenski View Post
    What kind of package does a player like Kreider fetch
    Whatever Evander Kane got.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
    Whatever Evander Kane got.
    Which trade?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
    Whatever Evander Kane got.
    They only got a B- prospect, a conditional first and a conditional fourth. Kreider would get more then that.

    Kane was a pending UFA traded at the deadline, if we trade Kreider now they would get him signed for the next 2 seasons. Unless its a blockbuster trade for a #1C or a top pair D man I would not trade him for less then a good prospect, 1st + something minor. Kinda the same deal as Kane, but because of the contracts (Kreids also 500k cheaper) he will a get a better prospect and a 1st instead of a conditional 1st.

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    I'm not giving up on any of these guys until I see how they play under a new coach with a new attitude and a real SYSTEM

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vodka Drunkenski View Post
    What kind of package does a player like Kreider fetch
    I don't think you trade Kreider. He may never be a star but that doesn't mean he's not useful.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThirtyONE View Post
    I don't think you trade Kreider. He may never be a star but that doesn't mean he's not useful.
    That doesn’t answer the question lol
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
    Whatever Evander Kane got.
    Better, but close. Kreider is a guaranteed first, not a conditional. My guess is first and a good prospect.


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  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuc View Post
    Most likely, but we've seen players improving their game after changing the coach. If he's allowed and encouraged to play the way he plays best atleast he may be more consistent in his performances.

    I dont know, I just have a feeling Kreider will be good under Quinn.
    This always gets me. so AV made sure to have Krieder tone down his aggressive play otherwise he would of been a different player the last few years. He brings aggressiveness in spurts and then disappears nearly completely that's who he is. God bless Quinn if he's got the ability to get anything else more out of him in that aspect of his game. Do I expect them all to come out flying the first few weeks sure and we can all say see AV was the problem all along and then I equally expect with very few exceptions that all revert back to what we've seen over the last few years. And I like Kreider for the record, but I do find his inconsistency to be mind numbing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jsrangers View Post
    This always gets me. so AV made sure to have Krieder tone down his aggressive play otherwise he would of been a different player the last few years. He brings aggressiveness in spurts and then disappears nearly completely that's who he is. God bless Quinn if he's got the ability to get anything else more out of him in that aspect of his game. Do I expect them all to come out flying the first few weeks sure and we can all say see AV was the problem all along and then I equally expect with very few exceptions that all revert back to what we've seen over the last few years. And I like Kreider for the record, but I do find his inconsistency to be mind numbing.
    It's human nature. It's hockey. Seasons have highs and lows but generally speaking the star players are able to push through while still being effective. This is why Kreider isn't a star. When he doesn't have it, he just doesn't have it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThirtyONE View Post
    It's human nature. It's hockey. Seasons have highs and lows but generally speaking the star players are able to push through while still being effective. This is why Kreider isn't a star. When he doesn't have it, he just doesn't have it.
    So far.

    And maybe you end up being right.

    How about this alternative future. Kreids took the next step, during his absence from the game. He is a very bright guy who hadn't put the mental part of his game together. He also decided he was worried to much about strength and was carrying too much weight, hampering his speed and energy. Upon his return he discovered the right blend of attributes (and the ability to maximize them) to demonstrate he can be a consistent first line power forward.

    If he can remain healthy, now in his prime years, he may become the leader, by example, under the new coach. He seems to be in the right frame of mind to take the next step and put it all together under Quinn. The result will be consistency and his highest point totals yet. I wouldn't be so fast to close the door on a guy who is one of the strongest, fastest and smartest NHLers. If the mental part of the game becomes easier, his physical skills and experience can really shine. This wouldn't be the first talented 27 year old to finally mature and have things click.
    Last edited by Giacomin; 06-06-2018 at 12:25 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil in Absentia View Post
    Better, but close. Kreider is a guaranteed first, not a conditional. My guess is first and a good prospect.

    I agree, but that's not a deal I want the Rangers to take. We don't know what he'll be like under Quinn, but we know that he's a bonafide top-6 forward, which we would be lucky to get out of a late 1st + a prospect.

    Let's see what he does under Quinn and where we are at the deadline. By then, his value could be tremendous for contending teams since he has a decent (4,6M) deal running for two post-seasons. Depending on his performances until then, that would truly be "selling high".

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    Quote Originally Posted by ThirtyONE View Post
    I don't think you trade Kreider. He may never be a star but that doesn't mean he's not useful.
    i agree. this post and giac's. if im quinn, i'm taking a personal interest in riding chris like a pony in this years training camp. given he is ultimately playing for a contract i expect to see upside.
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  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slobberknocker View Post
    i agree. this post and giac's. if im quinn, i'm taking a personal interest in riding chris like a pony in this years training camp. given he is ultimately playing for a contract i expect to see upside.
    To emphasize your point, Quinn wants to play fast and hard and move the puck between the dots, so he should ride him like a Thoroughbred. He and Z demonstrate good chemistry and speed together and are two third of our top line. Since many of our other forwards like Hayes, Zuc, Lias and even Buch do not use speed to attack or defend, Quinn needs Kreid and Z to create pace. The 1st line can lead by example and keep opposition on their heels. Kreids still also provides a level of toughness that is needed too.

    The consistency criticism is legit (see 2017 playoffs), but he seemed to turn a corner after the blood clot. He played leaner and faster and was consistently good the remainder of the season. In a losing situation, no less, where he retained his positive attitude.

    This is a determined, strong, fast, smart man who just experienced a perspective altering issue and has bounced back better than ever. With some consistency. Had he not done that, I would not be cautioning against moving him until he gets a chance to play for Quinn.

  15. #35
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    Kreider was arguably NYR's best forward since his return from injury, one of our few top-6 forwards who can give and take a hit, score, and one of the few who has leadership qualities.

    Trading him would be gutting the team of the (one of the) last best thing(s) we have - in return for a few rolls of the dice.

    I'll pass on that trade.

    Quote Originally Posted by Giacomin View Post
    To emphasize your point, Quinn wants to play fast and hard and move the puck between the dots, so he should ride him like a Thoroughbred. He and Z demonstrate good chemistry and speed together and are two third of our top line. Since many of our other forwards like Hayes, Zuc, Lias and even Buch do not use speed to attack or defend, Quinn needs Kreid and Z to create pace. The 1st line can lead by example and keep opposition on their heels. Kreids still also provides a level of toughness that is needed too.

    The consistency criticism is legit (see 2017 playoffs), but he seemed to turn a corner after the blood clot. He played leaner and faster and was consistently good the remainder of the season. In a losing situation, no less, where he retained his positive attitude.

    This is a determined, strong, fast, smart man who just experienced a perspective altering issue and has bounced back better than ever. With some consistency. Had he not done that, I would not be cautioning against moving him until he gets a chance to play for Quinn.
    What Giacomin said.
    Last edited by Respecttheblue; 06-06-2018 at 11:25 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ozzy View Post
    I'm not giving up on any of these guys until I see how they play under a new coach with a new attitude and a real SYSTEM
    This- I would love to see how some of these guys perform under a different coach/system.. namely Kreider, Vesey, Hayes, Buch, and even Zucc. I would hate to see any of these guys moved at this point, unless the deal is legit. To a lesser extent Spooner and Namestnikov (sp?) as well. Thats a decent core for a rebuilding team as well even if they dont necessarily have better years next season. I dont want this team to be bare bones when the season starts.

  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Respecttheblue View Post
    Kreider was arguably NYR's best forward since his return from injury, one of our few top-6 forwards who can give and take a hit, score, and one of the few who has leadership qualities.

    Trading him would be gutting the team of the (one of the) last best thing(s) we have - in return for a few rolls of the dice.

    I'll pass on that trade.
    It feels like he should be a part of the rebuild. Moving him now would be both premature and a bit of a gut punch to the team.

    Keeping it basic for a minute. He is a guy who is a threat streaking down the wing (or middle), a net front presence, and a force along the boards. When you can threaten from 3 areas of the ice you have something. Add that he has size, strength and speed, all in spades. And a new coach from Boston who he is a fit to play for... and we basically have a guy in his prime who brings real value across the board.

    We have tons of other assets to trade and priorities to focus on fixing.

  18. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Giacomin View Post
    It feels like he should be a part of the rebuild. Moving him now would be both premature and a bit of a gut punch to the team.

    Keeping it basic for a minute. He is a guy who is a threat streaking down the wing (or middle), a net front presence, and a force along the boards. When you can threaten from 3 areas of the ice you have something. Add that he has size, strength and speed, all in spades. And a new coach from Boston who he is a fit to play for... and we basically have a guy in his prime who brings real value across the board.

    We have tons of other assets to trade and priorities to focus on fixing.
    What in the hell happened to Kreiders shot? When he was first brought in, he was a threat when ever he touched the puck. He never shoots from the slot and has been disgusting on breaks to the net. Obviously two coaches thought he was too raw at the start of his career, but it seems like he changed the way he plays, for the worse. I want back the guy that shot like crazy and ran goalies. Why would you change that aspect of a player?

  19. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Dude View Post
    What in the hell happened to Kreiders shot? When he was first brought in, he was a threat when ever he touched the puck. He never shoots from the slot and has been disgusting on breaks to the net. Obviously two coaches thought he was too raw at the start of his career, but it seems like he changed the way he plays, for the worse. I want back the guy that shot like crazy and ran goalies. Why would you change that aspect of a player?
    Dude man....NO ONE shot the puck on this team LOL!!! We employed that pass first system....and without bashing the ever loving crap out of our past coach yet again, I'm really looking forward to seeing the Rangers....MY HOCKEY TEAM....actually PLAY like a hockey team again! ...Hard, tough, ass kicking hockey!!!

    I've waited 4 years ....and my time's come yet again!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ozzy View Post
    Dude man....NO ONE shot the puck on this team LOL!!! We employed that pass first system....and without bashing the ever loving crap out of our past coach yet again, I'm really looking forward to seeing the Rangers....MY HOCKEY TEAM....actually PLAY like a hockey team again! ...Hard, tough, ass kicking hockey!!!

    I've waited 4 years ....and my time's come yet again!

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