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Thread: Doubtful Spooner is in Rangers' Long-Term Plans

  1. #141
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Dude View Post
    Here I am thinking I don't analyze enough. If I don't post a players corsi, or know a goalies sv% to the exact number, it's a travisty.

    Obviously we saw Hayes recruit Vesey. So we do know some players reach out to others in an effort to help management.

    The general idea of my post was to say, I don't think Names was traded here or will be kept here just for Buch, or to lure Rykov and the goalie or Kovalchuk and vice versa.

    Do you have a recent example of when a team brought in a fellow countryman to help a kid settle in? I guess I never noticed it.
    1. I don’t think that’s true. It also depends on the context of the discussion. You’re also talking about certain people, because I still don’t know what corsi is.

    2. Not sure if that’s true. Hayes isn’t really that guy a staff would approach in that regard. He was raw himself.

    3. I don’t think that was the case either. I’m just saying it exists.

    4. Honestly I’m not sure of anything recent. I’d have to ask around. I do know a few examples of guys trying to get their buddies to come, but opted not to. It was a few years ago though.
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    Did Buchnevich and Namestnikov even know each other before the trade? We’re they friends? Is this not just made up by boardom.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fatfrancesa View Post
    Did Buchnevich and Namestnikov even know each other before the trade? Weíre they friends? Is this not just made up by boardom.
    Of course... There are only 246 people in Russia.. They have to be besties.

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    This whole thing spiraled out of control because of one comment from Josh about Names speaking Russian.

    I think we covered off on why that's not really a reason to keep a pretty average player.

    Josh, you said in another thread to stay away from exactly the kind of deal Names will get. Why so enamored with a 3rd line player that we've got plenty of?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
    This whole thing spiraled out of control because of one comment from Josh about Names speaking Russian.

    I think we covered off on why that's not really a reason to keep a pretty average player.

    Josh, you said in another thread to stay away from exactly the kind of deal Names will get. Why so enamored with a 3rd line player that we've got plenty of?
    I like parts of his game. I dont consider him a third liner, but he could play there if we have enough guys that bump him down.

    He's had one season over 40 points. We should be able to keep it between 3.5 - 3.9 on a 1 or 2 year deal. Left him earn more for his next contract. If not, oh well.

    We can't put Hayes, Spooner, Namestnikov and Skjei all in that range. That's too many middle 6 guys taking up too much cap space.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
    This whole thing spiraled out of control because of one comment from Josh about Names speaking Russian.

    I think we covered off on why that's not really a reason to keep a pretty average player.

    Josh, you said in another thread to stay away from exactly the kind of deal Names will get. Why so enamored with a 3rd line player that we've got plenty of?
    Yes, here's how it started...

    Dude: Russia connection is a reach.
    Josh: Put yourself in Buch's shoes.
    Me: I remember a quote that Buch was happy to have another Russian around.

    Some how that turned into multiple pages of the Rangers catering to Buch, or targeting Names because he's Russian and Buch needed a baby sitter. Fact-Buch is (for now) a Rangers. Fact, Buch was happy when another Russian was in the line up. Let's leave it there.

    Gonna be a long month+ till the draft...

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Dude View Post
    Here I am thinking I don't analyze enough. If I don't post a players corsi, or know a goalies sv% to the exact number, it's a travisty.

    Obviously we saw Hayes recruit Vesey. So we do know some players reach out to others in an effort to help management.

    The general idea of my post was to say, I don't think Names was traded here or will be kept here just for Buch, or to lure Rykov and the goalie or Kovalchuk and vice versa.

    Do you have a recent example of when a team brought in a fellow countryman to help a kid settle in? I guess I never noticed it.
    Just last year the Rangers drafted Chytil, then signed Pavelec. The only player that could speak Czech to Chytil during all the summer camps...

  8. #148
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    Quote Originally Posted by josh View Post
    I like parts of his game. I dont consider him a third liner, but he could play there if we have enough guys that bump him down.

    He's had one season over 40 points. We should be able to keep it between 3.5 - 3.9 on a 1 or 2 year deal. Left him earn more for his next contract. If not, oh well.

    We can't put Hayes, Spooner, Namestnikov and Skjei all in that range. That's too many middle 6 guys taking up too much cap space.
    See what I'm saying?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Long live the King View Post
    Just last year the Rangers drafted Chytil, then signed Pavelec. The only player that could speak Czech to Chytil during all the summer camps...
    But isn't that really just speculation? They could have signed him to a PTO to do that. And Chytil was never pegged for the NHL, it's more likely that Mazanec was the player they had for Chytil in the AHL.

    That stuff just doesn't happen at the NHL level. Roster spots are too precious.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
    But isn't that really just speculation? They could have signed him to a PTO to do that. And Chytil was never pegged for the NHL, it's more likely that Mazanec was the player they had for Chytil in the AHL.

    That stuff just doesn't happen at the NHL level. Roster spots are too precious.
    Yes roster spots are precious, but we're talking about the backup goalie. I couldn't find a list of the other available backups at the time, but was there anyone significantly better then Pav? Same with Names. People are talking like Names is some guy the plucked off the street in Russia just for the hell of it. He's an NHL player and still has to preform. The fact he's Russian is a bonus.

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    If you find a guy that fills a hole and also happens to fit a secondary need, its certainly a little more enticing.
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    I don’t know what hole he fills when like you said they slready have spooner, Hayes, etc.

    This snowballed also for a reason to why the rangers expanded the trade in the first place.

  13. #153
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fatfrancesa View Post
    I don’t know what hole he fills when like you said they slready have spooner, Hayes, etc.

    This snowballed also for a reason to why the rangers expanded the trade in the first place.
    That was discussing contracts.

    And maybe a hole from Miller... Nash... Grabner, Zuccarello if he gets trade, Paul Carey, Cody McLeod maybe...

    The entire roster is a hole, what are you looking at, exactly, to where we are set??
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fatfrancesa View Post
    I don’t know what hole he fills when like you said they slready have spooner, Hayes, etc.

    This snowballed also for a reason to why the rangers expanded the trade in the first place.
    I think you're still assuming the expansion of the trade was JT for Names straight up. If there was a reason JT and Names were eventually included, it had nothing to do with Buch or Russia. That's just an added benefit they can take advantage of.

    And even if you view Hayes, Spooner, and Names as filling the same hole, there is nothing wrong with competition during the rebuild. Although I doubt all three are here come October.

  15. #155
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fatfrancesa View Post
    I agree that mcd needed to be traded but it could have happened in the off season. As far as the prospects go it seems to me we asked for about 4-6 guys and were told no and we settled on what we got and yzerman made it sound like we were taking his first born. That said I have no problem with the return on mcd. Maybe our scouts are right and I will let that pan out over time. The miller/Namestnikov part was awful from day 1 and will grow worse by the day. I don’t want to be accused of Monday morning quarterbacking so I’m calling it as it so obviously to me anyway see it.
    Yzerman is very cagey. He is patient, as he demonstrated with Martin St Louis, Druin and in holding-out to the last minute in this deal. He likely found it easy to express inseparable love for every one of the prospects we inquired about. Beyond, Point or Gourde, he established Sergachev and later Foote as non-starters. In retrospect, it appears Stevie felt Howden, their 1st, plus another decent piece would be enough for McD. Or at least that was his pitch to NY mgmt.

    This was impressive and here's why. While in Florida for well over a month this winter, Yzerman made it clear that he was committed to go all-in for the Cup. The implied backstory was the Cup window is this year and next. That the current roster gets broken-up (due to contracts and cap) after that.

    So with everyone knowing he wants to make deadline additions, particularly on D, Yzerman still manages to convey to the Rangers that he could live w/o doing a deal until the final hours. Tells me this guy is playing high level chess.

    My takeaway? A deal for McD was gonna get done. Yet, Miller did not have to move at the deadline. The inclusion seems more rushed, more questionable, and less strategic.

    I did wanted Howden and their #1, plus I'm optimistic about Hajek. Unfortunately, I think we could have gotten all 3 assets for McD, but we'll never know. Glad we have them. Yzerman's cageyness combined with the Rangers rush to move on from JT, probably got Tampa Miller at a bargain. Not prying Katchouk or Raddysh away, instead of the conditional pick was a missed opportunity. We won't be able to judge this trade for a few years.

    One last point. Watching so many Tampa games this year, I was impressed with Names. Thought that article I posted was a good take on the quality of his game. However, he was often on a line with Stamkos and Kuch. He is definitely better than he showed here in that mess. Anyone who does not get traded and makes it to camp gets a fresh start from the new coach (and me). Then after a few months (in most cases) we can determine if and how a player fits going forward.

  16. #156
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    Weird that you bring up Kucherov. I wonder if Yzerman ever had any experiences where a team tried to establish a welcoming culture for their players, and if he ever tried that strategy...
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  17. #157
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fatfrancesa View Post
    This isnít the late 80ís when a player was smuggled out of a hotel and left behind his wife and kids not knowing if heís ever see them again or if his actions may inflict harm on them.

    Today we must be concerned with his feelings. The multimillion dollars are not enough. So J.T. miller was a locker room problem but this isnít? Of course this is all made up crap by people here but if it was even close to true I trade him immediately.
    He wasnít a problem, you and I went over that. Iím responding to this because I was the one giving the information and I donít want it to seem that I said he was a problem.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike View Post
    He wasn’t a problem, you and I went over that. I’m responding to this because I was the one giving the information and I don’t want it to seem that I said he was a problem.
    I thought his attitude or something with his personality has grown tiresome? Problem is overstating it? They moved on from him because of?

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    Quote Originally Posted by josh View Post
    Weird that you bring up Kucherov. I wonder if Yzerman ever had any experiences where a team tried to establish a welcoming culture for their players, and if he ever tried that strategy...
    no I think he's one of the best GMs in the league and as a result his only priority is bringing in the best players possible rather than what language they speak.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
    But isn't that really just speculation? They could have signed him to a PTO to do that. And Chytil was never pegged for the NHL, it's more likely that Mazanec was the player they had for Chytil in the AHL.

    That stuff just doesn't happen at the NHL level. Roster spots are too precious.
    This is correct. Mazanec was brought in more so to stabilize the tire fire that was Hartford's goaltending situation until Gerogiev found his game. The fact that he was Czech was an added benefit. Are there a bunch of Czechs I'd draft this year? Sure, but not purely to make Chytil more comfortable. Look at Chytil and Andersson. They're best buds and neither is from the same country. There's not remotely any commonality in their language.

    I don't see any merit to the Buchnevich and adding Russians thing though. When was the last time that actually happened? Jagr? Buch was brought in and spent plenty of time adjusting with a host family here in the US and I'm sure he can always look to Nikolai Bobrov for things if need be.

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