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Thread: 2018-2019 NY GIANTS DISCUSSION

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    2018-2019 NY GIANTS DISCUSSION

    Off we go!

    DRAFT is on the horizon. Rumors are all over the place with what they will do at #2.

    If they (GM and coach) are serious about riding ELI for another 2-3 years (minimum) then I donít see how they can pass on Barkley.

    If that is all a smokescreen (they plan to dump Eli after this season) then drafting a QB (if they think it is their guy) or trading back for additional picks makes the most sense to me.
    Personally, if are moving away from ELI at seasons end you have to roll the dice on one of these QBís IMO.

    Thoughts?


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    Eli is still a capable NFL qb. Give him a decent back to help the running game and an O line to help him get the ball to his receivers and we're right back in this division.

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    2018-2019 NY GIANTS DISCUSSION

    Quote Originally Posted by SaveByRichter35 View Post
    Eli is still a capable NFL qb. Give him a decent back to help the running game and an O line to help him get the ball to his receivers and we're right back in this division.
    Thatís how I feel right now. Eli has had garbage backs (and OL) since Jacobs and Bradshaw when he was at his best. Give him one last shot to show heís got it with a great back (and hopefully an improved OL) and see how it goes. If itís a failure, look to draft another QB in 1-3 years or let Webb get his chance.


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    2018-2019 NY GIANTS DISCUSSION

    I think it all depends on what Cleveland does. If the Giants only like Darnold, but heís off the board by then, then you take Chubb or trade the pick. I wouldnít waste the number 2 pick on a running back.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vodka Drunkenski View Post
    I think it all depends on what Cleveland does. If the Giants only like Darnold, but heís off the board by then, then you take Chubb or trade the pick. I wouldnít waste the number 2 pick on a running back.
    But their offense has been garbage and/or predictable with no run game for years. OBJ (then Engram after the OBJ injury) are their only bright spots.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Parsley View Post
    But their offense has been garbage and/or predictable with no run game for years. OBJ (then Engram after the OBJ injury) are their only bright spots.


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    I blame that on the offensive line, thereís a couple of good running backs you can get later in the first or early 2nd that will do well behind a good line
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vodka Drunkenski View Post
    I think it all depends on what Cleveland does. If the Giants only like Darnold, but heís off the board by then, then you take Chubb or trade the pick. I wouldnít waste the number 2 pick on a running back.
    Its not a waste if Barkley turns out to be the impact RB heís projected as. It brings a whole new element to the offense that has been sorely needed in NY. Yea the Giants have some RB depth now with Stewart and Gallman has shown flashes of solid talent; but Iím not sure if an RB of this caliber is such a bad idea at #2

    Granted thereís no way of knowing if what scouts are saying about Barkley will hold true but I wonít be upset if he comes here. Look what guys like Elliot and Fournette have done for their teams. Barkleyís name is being thrown in the same circle as those guys.

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    2018-2019 NY GIANTS DISCUSSION

    Quote Originally Posted by Lt. Dan View Post
    Its not a waste if Barkley turns out to be the impact RB heís projected as. It brings a whole new element to the offense that has been sorely needed in NY. Yea the Giants have some RB depth now with Stewart and Gallman has shown flashes of solid talent; but Iím not sure if an RB of this caliber is such a bad idea at #2

    Granted thereís no way of knowing if what scouts are saying about Barkley will hold true but I wonít be upset if he comes here. Look what guys like Elliot and Fournette have done for their teams. Barkleyís name is being thrown in the same circle as those guys.
    Yup. If the plan is ride ELI a few years, this guy can relieve the weight on Eliís shoulders. Or even Webb a few years down the road.


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    The only thing that would fuck that plan is if the Browns took him first then grabbed a QB 4th.

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    2018-2019 NY GIANTS DISCUSSION

    Quote Originally Posted by Lt. Dan View Post
    The only thing that would fuck that plan is if the Browns took him first then grabbed a QB 4th.
    Then the GIANTS need to guess right on the best upcoming QB. they'll have a full table to choose from.....or trade down a few spots and get whatever top QB is left around 5-6 (Rosen, perhaps). Figure Darnold and Mayfield will go first between 2-4 if they trade down into a 5-6 slot.

    Who knows.


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    The best thing the Giants could do is work out a trade with the Bills....say the #2 for #12, #22, 2nd, 3rd.

    Then spin around and trade the #12, 2nd, 3rd to move up to ~7-8 spot IF either Bradley Chubb or Quentin Nelson are available still.

    Giants would have a guy that would have been worthy of a #2 pick, but would have the #22 in the 1st as well. It would be a serious miscalculation not to cut a deal with Buffalo, who has to be beyond desperate to move up for a QB.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lt. Dan View Post
    The only thing that would fuck that plan is if the Browns took him first then grabbed a QB 4th.
    Which is exactly what I do if I'm Cleveland. There will still be a QB left at 4.
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    As a Cowboys fan, I really hope the Giants take Barkley. He won't make them better lol

    Barkley is basically Reggie Bush, but they're going to use him like Le'Veon Bell because he's a good receiver. But Barkely is not a guy you give the ball 20 times a game to control possession and draft him, especially with a poor offensive line, which means, essentially, committing to the same shotgun, 11 personnel approach that McAdoo loved. It also means that you're not going to establish a legit run game, the offensive line is still going to leave no time to get the ball down the field, and you're betting that Eli throwing the ball 40 times per game will be good enough to win.

    Get used to this formation:

    13 - 87 x-x-x-x-x-88 15

    18-26

    There's a ton of potential there if you can block, because 2 of 26, 88, 13, and 87 will have man-to-man coverage every play, but the Giants can't. On almost every play, Engram is going to have to chip and Saquon will be responsible for blitzers and edge rush support, so they won't be able to draw defenders quickly. As they have been for years the Giants will be dependent on quick-hitters and three-step drop maximums. I don't doubt Saquon's talent, but he fits very specific offenses. He doesn't move the needle for the Giants, because he doesn't allow them to do anything different, he's another piece of the same system that already doesn't work.

    The giants would be smart to trade down, with Denver, draft Nelson, and go defense with whatever other picks they get. I heard speculation on three-way trade with Buffalo and Denver that would give NYG the 4th and 20-something pick. They'd be way better off going Nelson and, say, Davenport, and then grabbing Nick Chubb or whoever in the second round.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Future View Post
    As a Cowboys fan, I really hope the Giants take Barkley. He won't make them better lol

    Barkley is basically Reggie Bush, but they're going to use him like Le'Veon Bell because he's a good receiver. But Barkely is not a guy you give the ball 20 times a game to control possession and draft him, especially with a poor offensive line, which means, essentially, committing to the same shotgun, 11 personnel approach that McAdoo loved. It also means that you're not going to establish a legit run game, the offensive line is still going to leave no time to get the ball down the field, and you're betting that Eli throwing the ball 40 times per game will be good enough to win.

    Get used to this formation:

    13 - 87 x-x-x-x-x-88 15

    18-26

    There's a ton of potential there if you can block, because 2 of 26, 88, 13, and 87 will have man-to-man coverage every play, but the Giants can't. On almost every play, Engram is going to have to chip and Saquon will be responsible for blitzers and edge rush support, so they won't be able to draw defenders quickly. As they have been for years the Giants will be dependent on quick-hitters and three-step drop maximums. I don't doubt Saquon's talent, but he fits very specific offenses. He doesn't move the needle for the Giants, because he doesn't allow them to do anything different, he's another piece of the same system that already doesn't work.

    The giants would be smart to trade down, with Denver, draft Nelson, and go defense with whatever other picks they get. I heard speculation on three-way trade with Buffalo and Denver that would give NYG the 4th and 20-something pick. They'd be way better off going Nelson and, say, Davenport, and then grabbing Nick Chubb or whoever in the second round.
    That's pretty much how I feel. You're wasting the 2nd overall pick on Barkley. You either take a QB that you firmly believe in, if he's still there or you trade the pick. Your offensive line makes your running back, not the other way around.
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    How is Barkley basically Reggie Bush?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Long live the King View Post
    How is Barkley basically Reggie Bush?
    Mikes got a crystal ball

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    Drafting Nelson or Chubb does basically nothing for this team in the near term. Therefore, they are basically pissing Eli's final year(s) away. If they told Eli to take a hike and went with Webb this year then I could understand the gradual rebuild of the D and OL with top picks in the next year or two. But, they (atleast say they) believe Eli has something left in the tank.

    I won't be happy with a trade down personally.

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    Being a jet can ,i dont want to see the giants making a trade with the bills,at least the way it is the jets have a better chance of getting one of the top two qb .

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    Quote Originally Posted by Long live the King View Post
    How is Barkley basically Reggie Bush?
    Their playing styles are almost exactly the same. Untouchable in space, good reciever, top-5 pick, but can't run between the tackles consistently and depend on a strong OL getting them to the second-level or one-on-one with space. PSU's oline wasn't particularly good, but Barkley hasn't shown any ability to run consistently against boxes. He had 10 games where he failed to run for 70 yards over his last two seasons. By comparison, Zeke had 2 games in his last 20 where he didn't get to 100 yards.

    PSU knew that. That's why they always ran 10 and 11 personnel to keep the number of defenders in the box low. Decent breakdown:

    A big reason as to why he saw so many light boxes was due to the fact that more than 81 percent of his runs came out of 10 or 11 personnel, as it forced defenses to be in nickel or dime. This isn’t to criticize Barkley or Penn State, because rushing out of 10 and 11 personnel should be the norm in both college and in the NFL. And to Barkley’s credit, he dominated teams out of 10 and 11 personnel, averaging an insane 6.2 yards per carry. But when he was asked to run out of any other type of personnel grouping, Barkley's yards per carry dropped all the way down to 3.01 yards per rush.

    Due to the amount of time Barkley ran out of 10 and 11 personnel, he rarely faced loaded boxes at the collegiate level. Of his 151 charted runs, Barkley faced eight or more men in the box just six times, averaging two yards per carry. Even against seven-man fronts, Barkley averaged just 4.6 yards per carry on 41 carries, but those numbers are somewhat skewed due to one 65-yard run. Barkley lost yardage on nearly 22 percent of his runs when facing seven defenders in the box. His offensive line deserves quite a bit of the blame, but he isn’t faultless either, as he often bounced runs outside for losses that should have produced moderate gains. Running against loaded boxes just wasn’t something Barkley did well last season, and it’s fair to wonder if that will be a weakness of his entering the NFL.
    http://www.profootballweekly.com/201...bs/a6fjmrs/#//

    Guice, by comparison, averaged 6.75 ypc against 8-man boxes.

    So Barkley would simply be another piece to add to what NYG already do. I'm not saying he won't be a good NFL player, I'm just saying that he won't make the Giants any better in the standings.

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