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Thread: McKenzie: Rangers Will Circle on Karlsson, Tavares

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Dude View Post
    Karlsson makes zero sense, since tje Rangers will win the lottery and get Dahlin.
    Skjei, Smith, Spooner, 28th overall, TB 2nd 2019

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by josh View Post
    Skjei, Smith, Spooner, 28th overall, TB 2nd 2019
    Would rather trade this for Dahlin then Karlsson.

    But this could get us MacKinnon.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
    Would rather trade this for Dahlin then Karlsson.

    But this could get us MacKinnon.
    PLZ GOD NO NOT MACKINNON

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    Quote Originally Posted by torontonyr View Post
    PLZ GOD NO NOT MACKINNON
    why not?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Long live the King View Post
    why not?
    idk I was being hyperbolic for no reason. He's having an incredible year after above average previous seasons. We'd be buying high. Way high.

  6. #26
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    Well yea, but he's 22. 23 when next season starts. Still get up to 7 years where he's a dominant NHLer.

    You also endorsed signing Kovalchuk (I think?)

    Hard to reconcile this...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
    Well yea, but he's 22. 23 when next season starts. Still get up to 7 years where he's a dominant NHLer.

    You also endorsed signing Kovalchuk (I think?)

    Hard to reconcile this...
    Again, was being hyperbolic admittedly.

    But if you want to go down this road:

    Nate Mack would require a significant asset exchange to acquire and as I mentioned previously, we'd be buying high for a player who generally performs at a 50pt per season clip. Is his 90pt performance him reaching potential? Maybe. Am I willing to give up several key assets to bet on that? Probably not. This team has had its share of 2A Centers, and has one right now in the form of Mika Zib. Without seeing more from him, I'd be unwilling to commit the assets to acquire him, assets that would come at a cost larger than the sum of a Karlsson rental.

    On the other hand, Kovalchuk costs us literally nothing in terms of assets. Moreover, his play aside - and I will return to that - he's an asset to us a recruiter and in-room-assistant with Russian players both in the system and on the ice. Buchnevich, Rykov, Shestyorkin, all will benefit from his presence on this team, and in turn the team may also benefit from their presence. Returning to his play, unlike Nathan, Kovalchuk has had a strong track record of performing at a professional level.

    I agree, his age is an issue to a degree and his stats in the KHL are inflated due to a lesser competition field and/or a shortened season. But with that comes a positive. He hasn't been as banged up as many players in his age group due to the difference in physicality in the KHL, he hasn't played arduously long seasons in the KHL, and yet he has faced decent competition in the KHL to reasonably suggest that he's "still got it". Beyond that, players who've left and returned from the KHL have shown similar success in the form of Radulov and Jagr, the latter of which returned at much later stage in his career from a much more physical period of the sport in general. PLUS, it's a 3 year deal and if you're truly a believer in a rebuild, even if he is awful it costs us nothing but a roster spot and cap room, should he unflippable to another team.

    So I hope that allows you reconcile my opinions, or at least assists in making it less hard Pete. Have a wonderful night.

  8. #28
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    If the Avs were actually entertaining the thought of trading Mackinnon, you have to be in on it.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by josh View Post
    Skjei, Smith, Spooner, 28th overall, TB 2nd 2019
    Win the lottery. Give up nothing, deal Namestikov for an NHL caliber D man also. Sign Tavares.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Dude View Post
    Win the lottery. Give up nothing, deal Namestikov for an NHL caliber D man also. Sign Tavares.
    This dude.

  11. #31
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    The av’s are not trading him. Amazing that there is any argument to not wanting him.

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by torontonyr View Post
    Again, was being hyperbolic admittedly.

    But if you want to go down this road:

    Nate Mack would require a significant asset exchange to acquire and as I mentioned previously, we'd be buying high for a player who generally performs at a 50pt per season clip. Is his 90pt performance him reaching potential? Maybe. Am I willing to give up several key assets to bet on that? Probably not. This team has had its share of 2A Centers, and has one right now in the form of Mika Zib. Without seeing more from him, I'd be unwilling to commit the assets to acquire him, assets that would come at a cost larger than the sum of a Karlsson rental.

    On the other hand, Kovalchuk costs us literally nothing in terms of assets. Moreover, his play aside - and I will return to that - he's an asset to us a recruiter and in-room-assistant with Russian players both in the system and on the ice. Buchnevich, Rykov, Shestyorkin, all will benefit from his presence on this team, and in turn the team may also benefit from their presence. Returning to his play, unlike Nathan, Kovalchuk has had a strong track record of performing at a professional level.

    I agree, his age is an issue to a degree and his stats in the KHL are inflated due to a lesser competition field and/or a shortened season. But with that comes a positive. He hasn't been as banged up as many players in his age group due to the difference in physicality in the KHL, he hasn't played arduously long seasons in the KHL, and yet he has faced decent competition in the KHL to reasonably suggest that he's "still got it". Beyond that, players who've left and returned from the KHL have shown similar success in the form of Radulov and Jagr, the latter of which returned at much later stage in his career from a much more physical period of the sport in general. PLUS, it's a 3 year deal and if you're truly a believer in a rebuild, even if he is awful it costs us nothing but a roster spot and cap room, should he unflippable to another team.

    So I hope that allows you reconcile my opinions, or at least assists in making it less hard Pete. Have a wonderful night.
    Sorry to see you waste so much time being argumentative.

    The package proposed was for Karlsson. I just said I'd rather see those players moved for Dahlin aka someone young. Saying we could get MacKinnon for that was just a sarcastic remark to it being overpayment.

    So not sure why you felt this was necessary...but OK.

    My night was also spectacular, BTW.

  13. #33
    Senior Member Mite Division Progrocker's Avatar
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    Is Kovalchuk really worth 6 mil a year???

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    We pay Staal 5.7 to have an active stick in his own end.

  15. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Progrocker View Post
    Is Kovalchuk really worth 6 mil a year???
    Yes. Radulov, who wasn't the same type of player as Kovalchuk prior to going back to the KHL, came back and has been really, really good. I know he's a couple of years younger than Kovy but I can't see any reason to think Kovy can't come back and be dominant. $6 mil is probably market value for him.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dunny View Post
    We pay Staal 5.7 to have an active stick in his own end.
    I'm no Staal fan either, Dunny!! LOL

    But I will bet he has a much better season this coming year now that Mr. Softy has hit the bricks. I used to hate the sight of Staal, but now I find myself in the weird position of actually pulling for the guy to have a "snap-back" kinda year....even if it's just for one more season. I would really like to see him step up and be a real leader and help these kids. It's his turn to return the favor.

  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
    Sorry to see you waste so much time being argumentative.

    The package proposed was for Karlsson. I just said I'd rather see those players moved for Dahlin aka someone young. Saying we could get MacKinnon for that was just a sarcastic remark to it being overpayment.

    So not sure why you felt this was necessary...but OK.

    My night was also spectacular, BTW.
    I didn't mean to come across argumentative. Quite honestly, I typed this in a few minutes while on the pooper so don't lose any sleep over it

    Just explaining to help you rationalize why I may be opposed to Nathan as opposed to alternative options. And, though your initial statement is that you'd rather get him at equal value, my reply to others was that we'd be buying high (which would require more).
    Once you needed assistance finding consistency in my logic it seemed like an easy explanation.

  18. #38
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    I know Karlsson is a hell of a player but I'm not convinced that he's healthy or ever will be again. His offensive #'s were pretty much on par with previous seasons but the -25, in his case, makes me think he was lacking the dynamic skating ability to get back after going forward. I know this is pretty thin and I didn't watch all that much of him but my feelings about it anyway.

  19. #39
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    I think we'd be putting ourselves in a serious bind down the road taking on that much salary.

  20. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ranger Lothbrok View Post
    I think we'd be putting ourselves in a serious bind down the road taking on that much salary.
    Yep.
    FIRE VIGNEAULT

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