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Thread: Looking Ahead: Seven Quick Thoughts

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bugg View Post
    Playing McLeod at all while Lettieri stays in Hartford makes no sense.
    It would be a good thing to have Lias and Chytil, along with guys like Lettieri, Nieves and others competing for the Calder and having some continuity for the rest of the year. This team is a mess and this is not the way to evaluate some of these Dmen, let alone anyone we are truly trying to develop.

    However, in no way, shape or form should they go into next season with guys like McLeod, Holland, DD, Carey or any marginal NHLer over 24/25. Mgmt's job is to at least fill out the roster with guys that have some potential or value.

  2. #22
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    5th - 10th pick maybe if everything fits, but it’s a huge stretch. I think you’d be able to get better deals for those players if you’re of a mind to move them.
    Absolutely no chance of anyone giving up 3rd or 4th this year imo. Certainly not for what we can offer.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Giacomin View Post
    1a. Draft - Regardless of position or current perceived organizational needs, SELECT THE BEST PLAYER. Haven't we learned not to pass up Fowler for Rath, because we just drafted a puck moving dman the year prior? ...
    Heavens, I hope NYR has finally learned... if we haven't then there's no hope.
    Now more than ever we need to be smart on this. They've blown too many already

    Quote Originally Posted by Giacomin View Post
    1b. What does that mean for this draft? - If we pick #1 we take a Dman. If we pick 2-4 we take a forward. Picks 5-9 are loaded with dman, unless the Rangers like Wahlstrom. Do not underrate Boqvist or Bouchard, either could rise into the top 5. After that, anything can happen, but a lot of Dmen are going in the 1st.
    Again draft smart -- no flaming leaps into the off the script high-risk in the first two rounds. There's enough legit talent there. No need to take a flyer

    Quote Originally Posted by Giacomin View Post
    2a. Can't force a #1C - Trading 3-5 of our absolute best assets just to get a 1C, is not practical.
    Couldn't agree more. Creating other difficult/costly holes to fill makes no sense at this point.


    Quote Originally Posted by Giacomin View Post
    2b. No reason to trade Skjei - an over payment is not coming back to make it worth it. .... Skjei will improve. He fits the profile of talented, young, big and fast. He plays a complete game. ... Shatty will get to talk to mgmt and the new coach and go from there. Hopefully he is fine with being traded.
    Keep Skjei part of the solution not the real problem.
    Shatty is up to Shatty. His defensive porosity is what it is, but I would hope he would be part of the rebuild if he is patient.
    Reality: Who's taking a major chance on a guy off that surgery anyway without waiting a year to see how he plays?

    Quote Originally Posted by Giacomin View Post
    3. Brenden Smith - leave him in Hartford!! So what if the kids stink, pay the price and have an epiphany. After the season, tell him to come to camp in the best shape of his life. Work on your hockey too, impress the new coach. Fresh start, make the best of it. Fuck this up and you're done.
    Brendon, Brandon, Brenden or Brendan? ... I go with Brendan. If he is back to defensive competence ... let him play. If he ain't, let him stay ... there.

    Quote Originally Posted by Giacomin View Post
    4. Hajek and Howden - Both should start the season in Hartford. That should be the plan, no exceptions. L...unless they are crushing it.
    You made an exception yourself "unless they are crushing it." I would give them more wiggle room, I think an NHL look-see helps them realize what they need to work on, especially speed of decisionmaking/anticipation -- everything happens much faster, there's less time than most first-timers and second-timers think, and holding onto the puck for too long has been the team's problem at times.

    Quote Originally Posted by Giacomin View Post
    5. Spooner or Zuc -
    I felt they got Spooner because they wanted to have him, not because he was the best warm body they could get.
    Zuc is still heart and soul to lead the way and show how to play for the kids.


    Quote Originally Posted by Giacomin View Post
    6. Namestnikov - Love him, plays a 200' game at a high level. He really has everything, but size A bit like RNH, but quicker. Zibs/Names is a better 1-2 than Zib/Step or Step/Brass. With Hayes at the 3C and Lias/Chytil, we should be much better up the middle next year and down the road.
    Again, I though it on draft day, they got Namestnikov because he was a high value target for the organization. He's a keeper to fit in the skill department.

    Quote Originally Posted by Giacomin View Post
    7. Lias/Chytil - either could play W. The 4C role is open, if we ice a fourth line with 2 decent players like Fast or Grabs. Neither should be penciled in until each proves he is ready and would benefit from the jump. If one or both tear it up in camp/preseason then we give them some NHL burn.
    I would liek them to start in HFD, but also have a look see early, so again they know how high the bar is, and the speed at which they have to develop their instincts to anticipate faster on shooting or move the puck.
    If n ya gots jowls, they might as well be furry ones.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Respecttheblue View Post
    Keep Skjei part of the solution not the real problem.
    Shatty is up to Shatty. His defensive porosity is what it is, but I would hope he would be part of the rebuild if he is patient.
    Reality: Who's taking a major chance on a guy off that surgery anyway without waiting a year to see how he plays.
    Grounded in reality. You're right, I was just hoping he'd be joining us soon and show it was a simple meniscus repair and is better than ever. The clip of Shatty skating showed he is getting close. Showcase him.

    D'Angelo is a young unseasoned Shatty. They are both third pair righties who can move up on the PP or when we are desperate for offense. We only need one, keep the cheap kid with upside. Maybe as the game slows down for him, his sees the game/ice better. He has some very strong O skills.

    Unlike Spooner and Zuc (which is a good and livable redundancy, two 3rd pair righties who can't play D is not. Skjei is the only sure thing top 4 in the entire organization.

    You made an exception yourself "unless they are crushing it." I would give them more wiggle room, I think an NHL look-see helps them realize what they need to work on, especially speed of decision making/anticipation -- everything happens much faster, there's less time than most first-timers and second-timers think, and holding onto the puck for too long has been the team's problem at times.
    Ha, no! No exception, they start in Hartford. They are both coming from juniors. Being a regular on the Pack will provide valuable developmental coaching and minutes against men. I'm saying they have to be crushing the A, before subjecting them to the pressure of the show. Don't hold em back, but let em earn it.

    This whole idea of skipping the men's league before playing in the NHL should be reserved for the mature elite talent. I get it. Fans either want to see the new toys or get impatient and lose sight of what is best for the players development. Last night they were talking about Brayden Point's development. Tampa left him in the A and extra year even though he "should have" made the team. It is a common story.

    I felt they got Spooner because they wanted to have him, not because he was the best warm body they could get.
    Zuc is still heart and soul to lead the way and show how to play for the kids.
    Certainly possible they both have a role. Yeah, I think the Rangers liked Spooner as a player and legit asset. Doesn't mean we might not consider trading him if he is a piece that gets us someone we are seeking. We have to sign Skjei, Hayes, Names, and Spooner. Or trade them. So a decision has to be made on Spooner, who is clearly 4th on that list.
    Last edited by Giacomin; 03-09-2018 at 04:40 PM.

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThirtyONE View Post
    Agree with everything else though. Draft talent. Figure out where they play later. You never know what the team will look like 2-3 years from when these kids are ready.
    Saw what you wrote on the GDT too. So true, Don't get cute! Don't worry about need, draft the impact player with a very high ceiling. Look for elite hockey skills and abilities. Let speed, size and character be a tie-breaker.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gravesy View Post
    5th - 10th pick maybe if everything fits, but it’s a huge stretch. I think you’d be able to get better deals for those players if you’re of a mind to move them.
    Absolutely no chance of anyone giving up 3rd or 4th this year imo. Certainly not for what we can offer.
    Think Chirelli has much time left if they shit the bed again? Can't you see him drafting for need? And they need D and a winger who could play with McDavid and Leon. Zuc could be that wing. What if their scouts love Bouchard/Hughes/Dobson among others. They move just a few picks back and still get their defender, Zuc and maybe the Devil's #2. We get Tkachuk. Maybe they see little difference between him and a couple of Dmen.

    Buff is also ready to compete and would welcome proven players to push along their youth.

  7. #27
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    22 isn't going anywhere, he has a nmc and clearly wanted to be here and signed a long term. I think the only thing Lettieri has going for him is he plays hard and that's it. He to me is maybe a hair better than the plugs on D that really have no business other than filling a role on a tanking (shit) team. DeAngelo is the vest of the bunch but that's more of an indication of just how big the dumpster fire is back there with the AHL'ers that have been brought up.

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Giacomin View Post
    Think Chirelli has much time left if they shit the bed again? Can't you see him drafting for need? And they need D and a winger who could play with McDavid and Leon. Zuc could be that wing. What if their scouts love Bouchard/Hughes/Dobson among others. They move just a few picks back and still get their defender, Zuc and maybe the Devil's #2. We get Tkachuk. Maybe they see little difference between him and a couple of Dmen.

    Buff is also ready to compete and would welcome proven players to push along their youth.
    No I don’t tbh, the top 4 in this draft are simply too good. Giving up one of those 4 would be incredibly short sighted.
    I hope I’m wrong because we’re the Rangers and we’re not drawing a top 4 pick in a month of sundays.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ozzy View Post
    Bingo Pete!!

    They should bring up all the heaping stacks of shit they have in Hartford....Give them all their BIG CHANCE! Lets just see how Deep we are down there!!! LOL
    You know, you are funny like me.....but not that wrong. Makes no sense to bring up Lettieri, he actually might score a few. McCloud is doing his job policing and NOT scoring. (Ahemm)

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gravesy View Post
    No I don’t tbh, the top 4 in this draft are simply too good. Giving up one of those 4 would be incredibly short sighted.
    I hope I’m wrong because we’re the Rangers and we’re not drawing a top 4 pick in a month of sundays.
    And even though that is true, that we represent the Rangers......we are "long overdue" for a little bit of good fortune. All it takes is getting "lucky" just once (see the Devil's with Hirschier) and our time table could become quite sooner. With a little luck, a little more tank and a deft trade and we could easily have 2 of the top 10 picks. I may be wrong but, maybe just maybe some good fortune is coming our way and we get that next Hirschier or the likes. I don't want to wait around for 4-5 years, need this to be 2 max (and so does Hank) for us to be reckoned with, once again.

  11. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by jsrangers View Post
    22 isn't going anywhere, he has a nmc and clearly wanted to be here and signed a long term. I think the only thing Lettieri has going for him is he plays hard and that's it. He to me is maybe a hair better than the plugs on D that really have no business other than filling a role on a tanking (shit) team. DeAngelo is the vest of the bunch but that's more of an indication of just how big the dumpster fire is back there with the AHL'ers that have been brought up.
    After this season Shattenkirk has a modified 10 team no move clause, meaning he names 10 teams he can block a trade to. That is not difficult to navigate. In addition, Shatty did not sign up for a total rebuild and might not have any problem going to a decent destination where he can be a valuable PPQB.

    Lettieri also has a good hockey IQ, pretty strong on his skates with a quick first step and can shoot. He has done nothing to standout, but his game is not mistake filled either. He could become a good 4th liner and should get another chance to show improvement next camp. He and Nieves should not be counted out yet, nor should they be counted on [to even be a good 4th liner]. They both need to take the next step and show more improvement, next preseason.

    D'Angelo has issues defensively, but he is still young and inexperienced. He has a serious NHL skill set though, that should be evident if you watch him closely. His game is not sound, but things like positioning or seeing the ice better can be coached up and improved with experience and a steady solid partner. He does not have issues like skating backwards with speed (ala Del Zotto) or other limitations such as slow footed, meh coordination and reflexes, weak core, etc. Many good dmen played poorly in their own zone in their first 100 NHL games. Chara is an extreme example, but look at Sergachev. He makes a mistake every game and he is going to be a monster.

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gravesy View Post
    No I don’t tbh, the top 4 in this draft are simply too good. Giving up one of those 4 would be incredibly short sighted.
    I hope I’m wrong because we’re the Rangers and we’re not drawing a top 4 pick in a month of sundays.
    Thanks for the reality check, appreciate your opinion and pessimism. The chance of the chips falling as suggested, followed by a swap of picks that gets us the last of the 3 forwards, is certainly a longshot.

    Agree, no one is trading the #1 pick, not to us. Additionally, if you look at the bottom 10-12 teams, likely only two would entertain moving back from 4/5. That is the only opening. Given all our picks and other assets, we are in the best position to make a move. Gorton was just saying that with 2 picks at last year's draft, there was a lot of activity at his table, unlike years prior.

    So, put yourself into the head of Chirelli or Buff's owner. If you are familiar with either, they are 'unique individuals' in unusual circumstances with different priorities than you, Jeff Gorton and most other GM/owners. Both teams have enjoyed plenty of high picks and need to make the playoffs next year. Chirelli is being lambasted for trading wingers who put up points and could play with McDavid . Buff needs to get Eichel more NHL ready supporting players and start winning, they already have Mittelstadt and other prospects in the wings. Could easily see either team really liking one of the top Dmen (the need is there) that will still be available a few picks later, but not past the top 10.

    The pessimist in me says forget about it, no such luck. But you have to make your own luck and we have the ammo. Mgmt needs to be creative and opportunistic. And our scouting needs to be spot-on, these next few years.
    Last edited by Giacomin; 03-10-2018 at 12:48 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LarryBiv View Post
    And even though that is true, that we represent the Rangers......we are "long overdue" for a little bit of good fortune. All it takes is getting "lucky" just once (see the Devil's with Hirschier) and our time table could become quite sooner. With a little luck, a little more tank and a deft trade and we could easily have 2 of the top 10 picks. I may be wrong but, maybe just maybe some good fortune is coming our way and we get that next Hirschier or the likes. I don't want to wait around for 4-5 years, need this to be 2 max (and so does Hank) for us to be reckoned with, once again.
    Hank understands that if he wants to win he has to be traded. Rangers fans have to understand this as well. It's time to stop thinking about things in terms of Hank's career.
    GORTON 2020

  14. #34
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    As much as the rangers current d is a dumpster fire it’s not much worse than it has been all year. For about 20m less they are just as incompetent. Shattenkirk should be happy because if he was still playing with expectations then he would quickly become the next redden. Plain and simple he’s horrid

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fatfrancesa View Post
    As much as the rangers current d is a dumpster fire it’s not much worse than it has been all year. For about 20m less they are just as incompetent. Shattenkirk should be happy because if he was still playing with expectations then he would quickly become the next redden. Plain and simple he’s horrid
    Shattenkirk was very good at the beginning of the year. I'd say give him a chance to recover from injury and play for a coach that allows him to do what he does best which is skate the puck.
    GORTON 2020

  16. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Giacomin View Post
    After this season Shattenkirk has a modified 10 team no move clause, meaning he names 10 teams he can block a trade to. That is not difficult to navigate. In addition, Shatty did not sign up for a total rebuild and might not have any problem going to a decent destination where he can be a valuable PPQB.

    Lettieri also has a good hockey IQ, pretty strong on his skates with a quick first step and can shoot. He has done nothing to standout, but his game is not mistake filled either. He could become a good 4th liner and should get another chance to show improvement next camp. He and Nieves should not be counted out yet, nor should they be counted on [to even be a good 4th liner]. They both need to take the next step and show more improvement, next preseason.

    D'Angelo has issues defensively, but he is still young and inexperienced. He has a serious NHL skill set though, that should be evident if you watch him closely. His game is not sound, but things like positioning or seeing the ice better can be coached up and improved with experience and a steady solid partner. He does not have issues like skating backwards with speed (ala Del Zotto) or other limitations such as slow footed, meh coordination and reflexes, weak core, etc. Many good dmen played poorly in their own zone in their first 100 NHL games. Chara is an extreme example, but look at Sergachev. He makes a mistake every game and he is going to be a monster.
    Thanks - I find little to nothing to be excited about in any of these updates. Yay if Letteri is yet another fourth liner. I still see no way 22 leaves after coming to his favorite team. DeAngelo is an undersized guy who plays with an edge that another team wouldn't even take notice of.

    But hell hopefully all these guys that have been entirely underwhelming somehow step in shit and become anything but bottom feeder NHL'ers. We knew what we were getting with 22 and he still somehow managed to disappoint. We can blame that one on injury.

  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by jsrangers View Post
    Thanks - I find little to nothing to be excited about in any of these updates. Yay if Letteri is yet another fourth liner. I still see no way 22 leaves after coming to his favorite team. DeAngelo is an undersized guy who plays with an edge that another team wouldn't even take notice of.

    But hell hopefully all these guys that have been entirely underwhelming somehow step in shit and become anything but bottom feeder NHL'ers. We knew what we were getting with 22 and he still somehow managed to disappoint. We can blame that one on injury.
    Ha, well none of that post is exciting, except that Shatty can be traded to 20 teams starting this off season. Good chance he stays, but a full rebuild creates a mitigating factor to the favorite team issue. And be happy we have some flexibility. If he racks up some points in the first half and we suck, he'll be good trade bait and fine leaving a mess.

    Don't expect much excitement for a while, unless we get lucky in the lottery. I'm pretty psyched for the draft and checking out the top 40 prospects. As the thread said, look ahead.
    Last edited by Giacomin; 03-10-2018 at 07:29 PM.

  18. #38
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    Things to be excited about:

    The draft. Obviously.
    Our approach to free agency this summer. There are a couple of great potential additions available. Depends if we’re trying to accelerate the rebuild or are happy to go with a young team next season.
    Training camp/pre season. I expect guys like Lias, Chytil, Hajek, Rykov, Howden and quite possibly one or two draft picks to be given their chance to stake a claim. I’m definitely excited about that.

  19. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Giacomin View Post
    Envision a scenario with the 7th or 8th pick. Say Edmonton and Buff (teams that are not as enamored as us about the draft) have picks 4 and 5. We swap.

    Here is a chance for Edm to get back an offensive winger they desperately need and still draft a top Dman. One of those teams may be high on Hughes, Bouchard or Dobson or whoever. We have the ammo to move up or around, with picks positioned throughout the first 3 rounds.

    There are other possibilities. We add Shatty and swap our say 23rd pick + Devil's 2nd, Zuc/Spponer and Shatty for that 5th pick. Keeping our pick, giving us two in the top 8.

    Or we upgrade/swap another pick of ours because scouting loves someone at 16. Offensive wingers have value to teams lacking talent. Or to teams that got surprised and just missed the playoffs or knocked out in the first round because they were lacking somewhere.
    Who is going to play on this team next year? I feel your poise about the draft and the rebuild, but I feel you are a bit too enamored with the whole idea.

    The Rangers will need to ice a team next season. There will have to be some veterans and some contracts on the team.

    I don't see the Rangers trying to add more first rounders, nor do i think whats left to trade would be any teams top priority to trade for. Especially not a top 10 pick. I just think they are done looking to add more draft picks. Prospects maybe, but i don't think it would be wise to sell assets and go all in on one single draft.

    I think both Spooner and Zuc stay. Simply because they have nobody else to plug in on the top 6. Maybe Chytil.

    The D is in shambles. Shattenkirk stays because they desperately need NHL caliber players and his contract is actually pretty good.

    The Rangers will not ice an AHL roster next season.

  20. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gravesy View Post
    Things to be excited about:

    The draft. Obviously.
    Our approach to free agency this summer. There are a couple of great potential additions available. Depends if we’re trying to accelerate the rebuild or are happy to go with a young team next season.
    Training camp/pre season. I expect guys like Lias, Chytil, Hajek, Rykov, Howden and quite possibly one or two draft picks to be given their chance to stake a claim. I’m definitely excited about that.
    Rykov has another year on his KHL contract. I don't think he will be in the mix for anything here next year.
    Last edited by jsrangers; 03-11-2018 at 09:21 PM.

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