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Thread: J.T. Miller: Requiem for a Captain Who Never Was

  1. #61
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    Miller is five months younger. They're from the same draft.

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
    I'm not sure it's exactly true that he was being "shopped", but he certainly was available for the right price, like everyone not named Lundqvist.

    The Rangers haven't been sellers at the deadline in forever, and he was productive and on a reasonable contract. Unless they were bowled over by an offer, there was really no reason to force him out the door.
    The deeper they got into last yearís season, the less likely they were to move him.
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  3. #63
    Member Mite Division zman's Avatar
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    Spooner is improvement on Miller. And he looks like him in my opinion. Feels like he never left.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by zman View Post
    Spooner is improvement on Miller. And he looks like him in my opinion. Feels like he never left.
    Ha.. interesting observation. It's a bit early for me to make that conclusion but I'm happy with what I'm seeing from the new guys. Lots of energy and contributions from them both. Namestnikov is impressive.

  5. #65
    Senior Member Pee-Wee Division Fatfrancesa's Avatar
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    I’ve thought the same thing

  6. #66
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    I've always been one of JT Miller's biggest proponents. The tools were there for a Mike Richards type, when he was the "good" Mike Richards early on with Philly. In fact, last season when we had our bold predictions thread, mine was that he would be our leading point scorer by the end of the season. He came close, finishing second only to Zuccarello. 56 points doesn't happen by accident. According to Hockey Reference, Zook played 18:50 per game on average, Miller played 16:22. The only regular forwards behind him in ice time were Grabner, Fast, Vesey and Buchnevich, though it should be noted that Rick Nash only got 16:28 per game. Anyway, he didn't quite play "sheltered" minutes, but he certainly played a bit of a sheltered role. With the same average TOI/G as Zook last season, he would've finished the season with 64 points in theory.

    We all know that production doesn't tell the whole story though (Taylor Hall, anyone?). Yet the alleged attitude problems were never in the forefront. Nobody can think of a specific instance where he was a malcontent or unprofessional, and nothing ever leaked out of the locker room. We just know second-hand that he had attitude issues, and that the coach wasn't his biggest fan. I wish I knew what those issues were, because in my opinion, the kid never got a fair shake. He played a complete game, and a hard-nosed one at that, with a damn-near 60 point pace at 23 years old.

    We had flashes where he oozed talent, we saw him stick up for teammates, we saw the kind of player he could be. I would love to know what went in to management's assessment that he would never reach that potential. In the trade with Tampa, Miller to me at least was a far bigger loss than McDonagh. I can only pray that he really did have these rumored issues off ice, because otherwise, I can't see the justification in giving up on him. I thought he would be one of the biggest pieces of our future going forward. In fact, between him and Kreider, I would've much rather seen Kreider go. We shall see, I guess. But when you put up 56 points without really having the coach's trust, and without being surrounded by talent like the players in Tampa, you got something going for you. I hope to God I'm wrong, because I think this one will come back to bite us in the ass. I think we missed out on a huge opportunity here by never giving him the chance he deserved.

  7. #67
    Just a Simple Country Squire BSBH Prospect
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    The only thing we missed out on was paying him market value. We can do that with anyone. We got back Namestnikov, I don't see how Miller is a better player and they're in similar contract situations. So what's the net loss here we should be all terrified about? Miller isn't going to put up 80 points with any more probability than either Vlad or Spooner. He's never been a huge producer like that anywhere.

    Really, he's a good enough skater but his decision making in the offensive zone was plodding. Slow. Unremarkable. That's not a death warrant, or that's not saying the return won't have his own issues, but at the end of the day he's just another cog in the wheel who was exchanged for a different cog.

    The time for him to be special was in the past, they got good value from Miller when it was there. That value is going to disappear as his salary rises.

  8. #68
    Senior Member Pee-Wee Division jamsim67's Avatar
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    New system, better offensive players around, JT will be a much different (better) player in Tampa.

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    Junior Member Mite Division RodrigueGabriel's Avatar
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    A worker's performance generally improves when they move from a manager they don't get along with to one they do. He could simply have better chemistry with Cooper and that alone could raise his game. Or it may be that he has authority issues wherever he is. It will be interesting to watch.

  10. #70
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    Good players, good system, could be equal or worse. Schrodinger's cat.

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by torontonyr View Post
    Good players, good system, could be equal or worse. Schrodinger's cat.
    he could be alive or dead, in a box?
    "We're all f*cked. It helps to remember that." - George Carlin

    "How many Cups you've got?" - Esa Tikkanen

    "Hatred can keep you warm when you run out of liquor" - Ray Ratto, Dan Patrick show 1/20/2017

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by fletch View Post
    he could be alive or dead, in a box?
    basically

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    Senior Member Mite Division LarryBiv's Avatar
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    @Lothbrok I too agree with you in your post. There simply has to be an underlying reason that we all DON'T KNOW. On the surface, he was a solid enough player/teammate. Obviously COOPER and his group saw the same and believe he saw "a part of his game" that they wanted on their team. That little bit of "extra grit" that he brings that a team MUST HAVE come PO time. Not saying Names doesn't have it (because he really looks impressive) and seems a 50/50 shot, pass type player which is what the Rangers needed more of...... than JT's pass 1st mentality in which we have too many as it is. Just saying.

  14. #74
    Moderator Junior Division
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    Quote Originally Posted by fletch View Post
    he could be alive or dead, in a box?
    Aren't we all?

  15. #75
    swamped Midget Division
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    I'd argue that most of us are trying to find a way out of the box, but point taken.
    "We're all f*cked. It helps to remember that." - George Carlin

    "How many Cups you've got?" - Esa Tikkanen

    "Hatred can keep you warm when you run out of liquor" - Ray Ratto, Dan Patrick show 1/20/2017

  16. #76
    Senior Member Pee-Wee Division mbob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ranger Lothbrok View Post
    I've always been one of JT Miller's biggest proponents.
    I agree completely with your entire post. After the trade I was really surprised JT left and Krieds is still around. I don't post much as my knowledge is so weak and just figured I wasn't seeing what his problems were. Ya there were some boneheaded times but not enough for me to give up on him. I'm down on Krieder, feel like he's peaked and what you see is what you get with him. JT had more upside to see.

    I do like Namestnikov though and he is more versatile at center. Just wish we could have pulled him back and kept JT then switched the coach next year. But I guess JT had two coach chances, Torts was his first right?
    Last edited by mbob; 03-07-2018 at 11:32 AM.

  17. #77
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    Kreider is a one dimensional player. He's Grabner with more willingness to go to the net and less defensive prowess. He'll creep at some 30 goal years, but unless someone brings back the snarl...

    Miller is a more complete player than Krieder already, and they will likely put up the same amount of points in the next few years. CK more goals, JT more apples.

  18. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
    Kreider is a one dimensional player. He's Grabner with more willingness to go to the net and less defensive prowess. He'll creep at some 30 goal years, but unless someone brings back the snarl...

    Miller is a more complete player than Krieder already, and they will likely put up the same amount of points in the next few years. CK more goals, JT more apples.
    Agreed, but as far as a team’s needs are concerned either one of them could be very useful, or expendable. Kreider has the 1 thing you can’t teach, size.
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  19. #79
    Senior Member Bantam Division lefty9's Avatar
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    i see kreider as a more valuable player than Miller,he would demand more of a return than Miller,if the rangers had traded Kreider to Tampa for Namestnikov(hope i spelled his name right)the ranger fan base would go fuckin nuts.

  20. #80
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    I would think if we called Yzerman and offered him Kreider for Miller he would ask what else we wanted.

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